The Flash's Infinite Mass Punch and its feasibility

#1 Edited by kadeem (2870 posts) - - Show Bio

The Flash's infinite mass punch is an interesting concept, but I was wondering if anyone knows if the physics behind it has any sort of truth basis (at least theoretically), or is it just completely made up?
#2 Posted by SC (13110 posts) - - Show Bio

To me, its pretty much the same as Iceman hitting absolute zero. 

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#3 Posted by Supreme Marvel (11264 posts) - - Show Bio
@SC: Not going to happen?
#4 Posted by SC (13110 posts) - - Show Bio
@Supreme Marvel said:
" @SC: Not going to happen? "
 
Sounds cool, and easy enough relatively for the characters, in extreme situations, with some scientific logic behind it, and probably therefore rather relaxed application of use in comics, but if actually accurately depicted as one would expect... the build up, the effect and the consequences would or should be a lot different from what we actually get. Like I said though... sounds cool, so would probably read cool. lol
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#5 Posted by Supreme Marvel (11264 posts) - - Show Bio
@SC: I believe that Iceman should not be able to reach Absolute Zero, because that's when atoms stop moving. And what will be the point if he can't move.
 
The Flash idea, realistically not possible. With the help of the Speed Force, which reality doesn't have, and if it does some one please, point me in the right direction. :D
#6 Posted by SC (13110 posts) - - Show Bio
@Supreme Marvel: Yes lol, you should believe that. It might also rip apart the Earth as well. Speed Force would need to have some extreme absolute quality with how it buffers negative effects. 
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#7 Posted by allhaildoom (182 posts) - - Show Bio

No its not feasible at all because physics simply doesn't work like that,  and neither does chemistry

#8 Posted by SC (13110 posts) - - Show Bio

The only way I could see it justifiable if DC wanted to amp up the science aspect, is if they made Flash a high end reality warper lol which could be funny for a few issues... oh and I wish they would clarify the whole faster than thought thing too... 

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#9 Edited by kadeem (2870 posts) - - Show Bio
@allhaildoom said:

" No its not feasible at all because physics simply doesn't work like that,  and neither does chemistry "

That's interesting, do you have any idea how they could explain The Flash's powers in a more feasible way?
#10 Posted by Jotham (4564 posts) - - Show Bio

Well, supposedly when the Flash approaches light speed, his mass increases. Which, as mentioned, would probably tear the planet apart. It would be like a black hole suddenly appearing on the surface of the Earth. Of course, time would also slow down for him. But I thought the whole point of making a "speed force" was so he wouldn't be subject to realistic effects of moving at super speeds, if they're going to make this happen, why not make his body burn up from the friction of the air?

#11 Posted by SC (13110 posts) - - Show Bio

I believe technically, Flash could actually Infinity Mass Spit at people too. He should carry around small metal ball bearings, load up his mouth and go around killing well, all bad guys. Infinite Mass Spit would be unstoppable. Speed Force would prevent break up and maintain cohesion of the infinite mass of spit coated ball, and anything thats infinite mass, going that fast, will do some absolute dead damage to anyone doesn't have huge holes in their body or head, but I mean, no character like that would ever be made. 

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#12 Posted by Jotham (4564 posts) - - Show Bio
@SC said:
" I believe technically, Flash could actually Infinity Mass Spit at people too. He should carry around small metal ball bearings, load up his mouth and go around killing well, all bad guys. Infinite Mass Spit would be unstoppable. Speed Force would prevent break up and maintain cohesion of the infinite mass of spit coated ball, and anything thats infinite mass, going that fast, will do some absolute dead damage to anyone doesn't have huge holes in their body or head, but I mean, no character like that would ever be made.  "
If you were writing Flash comics, I would actually read them.
#13 Posted by DEGRAAF (7881 posts) - - Show Bio

i would say no. I'm guessing here but wouldnt it be a simple (simple to some, not to me) math problem? The mass of the projectile (his fist and body) multiplied by the speed at which it is moving (near or at the speed of light) equals the amount of force or something like that? So while i think he can get a large (and i mean very very very large) amount of force behind his punch, i dont htink he would ever reach the infinity mark. Just imagine something that i would guess weighs roughly 5 pounds moving at the speed of light exactly at your face. It would cleanly take your head off with out you even feeling it most likely.
 
I've just been looking up information about the mathmatics and all i can say is im glad im not in school anymore. Instead here is a  
wiki-link to give you an idea. 
 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impact_(mechanics
#14 Posted by allhaildoom (182 posts) - - Show Bio
@kadeem: The first part wich ruins every thing is the density of the human, technically the faster something is going the more force is behind it, but if you punch something like steel going close to light speed you'll shatter all the bones in your arm. 
  The second part is trying to moving around objects because turning at light speed would  e impossible its like a car going going 100 miles per hour and turning suddenly.
#15 Posted by idukid (157 posts) - - Show Bio
@kadeem: 
IMP is a bad way to call it Its more of a Infinite Kinetic Energy Punch.    
   
The formula for Energy is:
E (energy) =  γ(next equation called the Lorentz factor)  * m(mass) * c(speed of light) ^ 2 

γ    = 1 / square root( 1 - v(speed)^2/c^2 )   
 
As v aproaches c   γ   gers closer to infinity  
1 assume c=3 and v=2.9  then γ=3.905667
2 assume c=3 and v=2.99  then γ=12.25767
3 assume c=3 and v=2.999 then γ=38.73306
4 assume c=3 and v=2.9999 then γ=122.4755 
5 assume c=3 and v=3 then γ=infinity    
 
therefore making the kinetic energy infinity    
 
It seems as though the mass hitting you is infinite but its just the energy.
   
#16 Posted by kadeem (2870 posts) - - Show Bio
@idukid: Yeah thanks for that. I had a hard time understanding how the speed of an object could affect the amount of mass in an object, but if we look at the IMP in tearms of kinetic energy rather than mass it makes so much more sense.
#17 Edited by Sup3rhulk (2 posts) - - Show Bio

It's just a name he doesn't actually reach the "infinite" mass mark it just seems like it is infinite mass because he builds enough momentum to augment his punch enough to knock the target a continent away. velocity=intensity more speed=more force, his only problem is his body is put under high levels of stress and if he moves fast enough he will eventually start to burn he just can't reach that speed without killing himself anyway

#18 Posted by Sup3rhulk (2 posts) - - Show Bio

besides if his mass gets to a certain point he can't run making him an easy target and a liability to the team plus he'd have to pick up the extra mass from somewhere

#19 Posted by Andy_Rancid (1 posts) - - Show Bio

@sup3rhulk: Untrue. DCU is not very consistent. It is shown at one point that he is able to vastly exceed the speed of light (which enables him to move freely between universes and dimensions. The Speed Force allows him the ability to run at such speeds anywhere without damaging neither him nor the environment like he realistically should. It acts like a force shield, containing the force he creates within him. As for the Infinite Mass Punch, it allows him to gain the mass of a white dwarf star, one of the most dense objects in the universe. By the laws of Physics, yes, he should not be able to move that fast nor gain that much mass or hit someone and they or the area survive. But since he can move fast enough to travel inter-dimensionally, it is safe to assume the laws of Quantum Mechanics has some part in his abilities. If you know a little about Quantum Mechanics, than you should know the theories don't always correlate with Reality; which justifies his abilities, since Much of DCU's logic is based on both principles of Magic, theories of Quantum, and beliefs of Theology. Very inconsistent.

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