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    Emma Frost

    Character » Emma Frost appears in 6127 issues.

    Emma Frost is a fictional character originating from Marvel Comics. Originally starting off as a super villain and enemy of the X-Men, during which she was the White Queen of the Hellfire Club, Emma Frost is a powerful mutant telepath who can transform herself into organic diamond. She has become a prominent member of the X-Men. A gifted teacher, Emma is renowned for her beauty, wit, and sense of fashion.

    Can someone tell me at what point did Emma Frost become a better

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    time1

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    #1  Edited By time1


    Can someone tell me at what point did Emma Frost become a better character than Jean. I know that a lot of people like Emma more than Jean. So I am interesting to hear  at what point did you like her more than Jean. when did she actually become that good ? 

     

     
     
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    god_spawn

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    #2  Edited By god_spawn  Moderator

    Emma becoming a better character didn't just happen at once i feel as though it took time. When Emma replaced jean that as when it started and over the years it built up. When Jean was with Cyclops, i hate to admit it but Scott was a boring character. When he was with Emma his character started to develop he didnt stay boring, he evolved. Both Emma and Scott both had their problems and she helped him through and vice versa. She helped with the students more than Jean, helped co- lead the X-men and has helped them through more than one occasion and hell even gave Cyclops his ability to control his powers even if just for a short while. She has just given more to the X-men than Jean IMO. She is a more developed character and just keeps things unpredictable. I know i've said this before but she will stay good but keeps the people hoping she turns bad but that is part of her character. Nothing is straight black and white with her. She operates on ways above that, she isn't a straight character to figure out.

    But honestly it's a matter of opinion, people will hate her more Jean, people will like her more than Jean  so you can't really point out a time she became better as its an opinion. I like Emma better but again that's just an opinion.

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    The Sadhu

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    #3  Edited By The Sadhu

    I've never been an Emma fan nor am I a Jean fan... but the one good thing that has come out of Emma being around is the Cyclops is badass now!
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    Caligula

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    #4  Edited By Caligula

    let me see it wasn't so much that Emma became better, as Jean became crap.

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    Mercy_

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    #5  Edited By Mercy_
    @god_spawn said:
    Emma becoming a better character didn't just happen at once i feel as though it took time. When Emma replaced jean that as when it started and over the years it built up. When Jean was with Cyclops, i hate to admit it but Scott was a boring character. When he was with Emma his character started to develop he didnt stay boring, he evolved. Both Emma and Scott both had their problems and she helped him through and vice versa. She helped with the students more than Jean, helped co- lead the X-men and has helped them through more than one occasion and hell even gave Cyclops his ability to control his powers even if just for a short while. She has just given more to the X-men than Jean IMO. She is a more developed character and just keeps things unpredictable. I know i've said this before but she will stay good but keeps the people hoping she turns bad but that is part of her character. Nothing is straight black and white with her. She operates on ways above that, she isn't a straight character to figure out. But honestly it's a matter of opinion, people will hate her more Jean, people will like her more than Jean  so you can't really point out a time she became better as its an opinion. I like Emma better but again that's just an opinion.
    Great post, yet again. 
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    god_spawn

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    #6  Edited By god_spawn  Moderator
    @The Dark Huntress said:
    @god_spawn said:
    Emma becoming a better character didn't just happen at once i feel as though it took time. When Emma replaced jean that as when it started and over the years it built up. When Jean was with Cyclops, i hate to admit it but Scott was a boring character. When he was with Emma his character started to develop he didnt stay boring, he evolved. Both Emma and Scott both had their problems and she helped him through and vice versa. She helped with the students more than Jean, helped co- lead the X-men and has helped them through more than one occasion and hell even gave Cyclops his ability to control his powers even if just for a short while. She has just given more to the X-men than Jean IMO. She is a more developed character and just keeps things unpredictable. I know i've said this before but she will stay good but keeps the people hoping she turns bad but that is part of her character. Nothing is straight black and white with her. She operates on ways above that, she isn't a straight character to figure out. But honestly it's a matter of opinion, people will hate her more Jean, people will like her more than Jean  so you can't really point out a time she became better as its an opinion. I like Emma better but again that's just an opinion.
    Great post, yet again. 
    Thank you.
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    Whoa

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    #7  Edited By Whoa

    Hmm, I think Emma just brought a whole new dynamic to the X-Men, and her relationship with Cyclops completely changed and developed his character to what many people call "bad-ass".

    I personally still like Jean more but those are possible reasons.
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    riri4life

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    #8  Edited By riri4life

    People got tired of Jean dying and coming back so many times. That and pre-teens boys are suckers for bitchy blonde, tig ol bittie hoes, in skimpy attire. Ya digg?

    I however prefer Jean to this immitation trollop.

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    HexThis

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    #9  Edited By HexThis
    @time said:


    Can someone tell me at what point did Emma Frost become a better character than Jean. I know that a lot of people like Emma more than Jean. So I am interesting to hear  at what point did you like her more than Jean. when did she actually become that good ? 

     

    I like both Jean and Emma, I love them actually. I wouldn't say Emma is more popular than Emma seeing as how Marvel constantly cashes in on Jean and her fanbase with these huge events that deceive us into thinking she'll return somehow but Emma's fanbase has grown considerably.

    When Emma began to appeal to me personally was during "Torn", I think Joss Whedon tapped into her character's inner-conflict really well. Rather than being Scott's mercurial homewrecker mistress she was portrayed as a tough woman who has a lot of defense mechanisms and genuine compassion she conceals. That is who Emma truly is but she's not very often written that way. I disagree with the people who claim she makes Scott more interesting, maybe she did in Astonishing but otherwise he looks like a complete douche and has for...well, years.

    It's mostly forgotten but Jean isn't quite the Mary Sue people accuse her of being, if you read her X-Factor run she's actually quite fun and definitely more firey than she would be portrayed later on. Also, there's a lot of monumental things about Jean's growth as a character in terms of comics in general. The Phoenix Saga was very progressive and cutting edge for the time in terms of storytelling as well as her sticking to her "alter-ego" name rather than keeping a codename, she's one of the only superheroes who most commonly goes by her name. Women weren't generally endowed with her power levels in comics either, aside from Wonder Woman she was one of the first female heavy-hitters of any comicverse.
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    PrinceIMC

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    #10  Edited By PrinceIMC

    I don't think Emma became better than Jean I think Jean just became too perfect, which is annoying. She's sort of like silver age Superman able to do anything and solve any problem plus she's ultra compassionate and forgiving.....she's better off dead for now.

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    lorex

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    #11  Edited By lorex

    I think the difference between them is Jean is like the friend who helps everyone out and everyone likes and Emma is the bad girl that that you are warned to stay away from but if you get to know her she is not as bad as people say. For me Emma is just more interesting
    than Jean. Yes Jean is the Phoenix the ultimate personification of power but Emma's character has just enough of an edge to her to keep you guessing.

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    FadeToBlackBolt

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    #12  Edited By FadeToBlackBolt

    Jean has always been one of the worst characters in comics. She's a God Mode Mary Sue, with no personality.

    Emma, on the other hand, is one of the best characters to have ever appeared in a Marvel book. She's shown genuine growth as a character, has a fanbase that doesn't attract self-righteous douches, and is powerful enough to matter, but not so powerful to make her every appearance a bore.

    In short, Jean is the character you like when you don't know what a good character is .

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    CellphoneGirl

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    #13  Edited By CellphoneGirl
    I feel that when "she started getting better" is different for most readers depending on what they have read from her. For some people it could have been in Generation X, while it could have been around the time when she began dating Scott.


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    PowerHerc

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    #14  Edited By PowerHerc


    She didn't, hasn't and won't. 

    Jean was, is and always will be the better character of the two.

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    EmmaGrace

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    #15  Edited By EmmaGrace

    Emma isn't necessarily a better character.. She's just, you know, currently alive :p that always helps.

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    TDK_1997

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    #16  Edited By TDK_1997

    Because Emma made Scott a super cool character.When he was with Jean he was a very boring character.And Jean was a lame character too.

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    GREGalicious

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    #18  Edited By GREGalicious

    I do like EMMA but not more JEAN. She has become a great character in her own right and writers dont really seem to know what to do with Jean anymore. I prefer either GENERATION X-era Emma or X-MEN: Academy X-era Emma. I really like her in the whole student-teacher settings and storylines.

    SCOTT is still kinda LAME to me, reguardless of who he's with. He actually seems to have manned up a lot but he's still overpowered/overshadowed by his female companion. Jean, MADELYNE, and now Emma; I dunno why writers keep putting him with women he's clearly beneath (not to mention the fact that his loves keep ending up DEAD).

    Emma better get LIFE ALERT!!!

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    ChadwickDavis

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    #19  Edited By ChadwickDavis

    Personally I like both of them equally... for very different reasons. 
    Jean was the anchor to the X men team during it's early development and on some level will always remain an influence on the X men.  
    Emma is the foot in their behind when they need it and in extreme circumstances the telepathic backhand because she comes from another world than jean she brings a perspective to their team that they wouldn't have explored before. 
    Both are pivotal parts of the team though to say one is better than the other is like comparing wolverine to captain america... I like both characters but to place them in the same category just doesn't work because they are too different.     

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    Timandm

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    #20  Edited By Timandm

    Emma is definitely interesting but NOT better.
     
    Jean became UBER powerful and kept dying...  Becoming too powerful, or dying repeatedly makes a character boring.  The most popular characters in the Marvel Universe are the ones who are NOT insanely powerful.  Spider-Man, Wolverine, Captain America...
     
    Emma is powerful but not ridiculously powerful... And she's not a tree-hugger...
     
    I STILL don't like that she had an affair with Scott while Scott was still married to Jean... Many will argue that the marriage was basically over and that argument is basically crap... Maybe it was 'basically' over but they still had a commitment... He should have ended the marriage with Jean before sexiing it up with Emma...
     
    I also don't like that Emma has already cheated on Scott with Namor...  I'm actually surprised that I'm the only one who thinks she was wrong to do that...  It's true that she's had a good effect on Scott, but what will happen when he finds out about her and Namor???

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    Mercy_

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    #21  Edited By Mercy_

    @Timandm:

    He should have ended the marriage with Jean before sexiing it up with Emma...

    Yes, he should have. But the fact remains that it takes two to tango.

    I also don't like that Emma has already cheated on Scott with Namor... I'm actually surprised that I'm the only one who thinks she was wrong to do that... It's true that she's had a good effect on Scott, but what will happen when he finds out about her and Namor???

    When did this happen? Because if your're talking about what I think you are, it happened before she was with Scott. Unless it's an EXTREMELY new development. Emma hasn't been with anybody else since she's been with Scott.

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    Timandm

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    #22  Edited By Timandm
    @The Dark Huntress said:

    @Timandm:

    He should have ended the marriage with Jean before sexiing it up with Emma...

    Yes, he should have. But the fact remains that it takes two to tango.

    I also don't like that Emma has already cheated on Scott with Namor... I'm actually surprised that I'm the only one who thinks she was wrong to do that... It's true that she's had a good effect on Scott, but what will happen when he finds out about her and Namor???

    When did this happen? Because if your're talking about what I think you are, it happened before she was with Scott. Unless it's an EXTREMELY new development. Emma hasn't been with anybody else since she's been with Scott.

    Okay, the following are from Uncanny X-Men Annual #2...  It shows the story of how Emma persuaded Namor to join the X-Men on Utopia.   Sorry in advance for the large images... I don't know how to load those small ones that become large after you click on them...
     Note that she uses the term
     Note that she uses the term "post-coital" so we didn't SEE them having sex, but she's saying it while lying in his bed....

    No Caption Provided
    A few pages later, after cutting Shaw's head off and Namor agreeing to join the X-Men, he makes a pass at her... She doesn't give in but basically suggests he keeps trying... After Namor leaves, she contacts Scott telepathically and tells him to prepare the brig to receive Shaw...  The Brig is where Scott and Emma secretly keep prisoners they've arrested on their own authority and locked up without trial...  So, this did happen while Scott and Emma were together...
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    Timandm

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    #23  Edited By Timandm

    Huntress, I just re-read that issue on the chance that the scene with Emma and Namor in his bedroom was a flash back... It's 'possible' that it is but it's very hard to tell...  I honestly hope it IS a flash back.  I'd sure like some clarification on the issue...  However, the scene where she suggests he continues trying to seduce her DEFINITELY happens in the presence... In fact, it was only moments before she contacted Scott... Of course, this could just be part of the ruse to fool Namor into joining the X-Men...

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    Mercy_

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    #24  Edited By Mercy_

    @Timandm: I'm positive that it's a flashback. I've been trying to hunt up the issue (I have it in a trade somewhere, just can't remember which one), and I remember thinking that it was actually present-time while I was reading it. However, upon further research, it definitely was a flashback. That entire issue focuses on her past and I'm 99.9% positive that she was actually in the HFC at the time of the Namor incident. It's definitely not something that present-day Emma would do.

    As for the second scan. That looks like it's a flashback to around the time where she's trying to get him to join the Cabal and Norman's Dark X-Men. She's playing him, IMO. Emma using her sexuality as a tool has been well-established. For her, it's simply another weapon in her arsenal. She knew that she needed somebody else on the inside on her side and she knew that Namor fit that part.

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    Timandm

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    #25  Edited By Timandm
    @The Dark Huntress: yeah I think you're right, although I believe it's the X-Men she's trying to get Namor to join rather than the Cabal...  She captures Shaw, calls Scott and tells him she has another one for 'the brig.'  I believe the Brig wasn't formed until after they were on Utopia... Of course, I could be wrong about that as well...
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    Mercy_

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    #26  Edited By Mercy_

    @Timandm: I'm pretty sure you're right.

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    CellphoneGirl

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    #27  Edited By CellphoneGirl

    I'm sure it's a flashback.

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    Timandm

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    #28  Edited By Timandm

    Yeah... Pretty sure it is now...  I apologize to Miss Frost... Although, I feel compelled to say for no reason at all that I'm still a bit weirded out that she's in love with "The Blue condom."   (That means Scott)

    And cellphonegirl, your image/avatar reminds me that I think we should see more of Pixie in the X-Men titles... Her and Santo... Not that I mean for them to be an item, because that would just be...eww...  (I'm a guy and I'm actually saying "eww" so it HAS to be bad.)
     
    But back to the issue of this thread...
     
    Emma definitely makes the X-Men titles more interesting than Jean...  Although, I loved Jean...Not the way that Scott and Wolverine, or even Angel loved her... I mean I loved her as a character....  But the pheonix thing was more overdone than a steak cooked in a nuclear reactor...
     
    Also, she brought that femme fatale / bad girl thing to the X-Mansion and beyond...  Jean was very much like a female version of Scott but with much more power....and estrogen...
     
    As for, how long will they be together, well... I think they'll have to be like Kurt Russel and Goldie Hawn; be together but never officially get married...  With Scot's record, if they get married, he'll have to dump her for the next telepath that comes along...

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    #29  Edited By nikbackm
    @Timandm said:
    @The Dark Huntress: yeah I think you're right, although I believe it's the X-Men she's trying to get Namor to join rather than the Cabal...  She captures Shaw, calls Scott and tells him she has another one for 'the brig.'  I believe the Brig wasn't formed until after they were on Utopia... Of course, I could be wrong about that as well...
    They just had a different brig while they were still on the mainland :)
     
    Just to add, one easy way to tell the flashbacks apart from the present time in that Annual story (unless the story makes it clear enough) is to go by the art. 
    Acuna handled the past (for example the first scene with Emma in Namor's bed you posted) while Breitweiser handled the present (the other one).
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    poisonfleur

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    #30  Edited By poisonfleur

    E for Extinction is when Emma started to push pass Jean.

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    nyx

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    #31  Edited By nyx

    I always found Jean to be boring. She was little Ms. Goody-goody meets tortured soul with a tired Scarlett O'Hara routine (Storm had that for a long while too, 'Oh, I must keep myself in control...' [faint dramatically]). And the overuse of the Phoenix Force certainly does not help her case. Hope is about to suffer that same fate (though I don't like Hope all that much either. To me, Hope=Dakota Fanning in 'War of the World').

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