As the first Robin, Dick Grayson was the most famous sidekick in comic book history. As he ventured forth on his own, he formed the Teen Titans and became their leader. When the boy became a man, he became the independent hero known as Nightwing.
Hey people what do you think about Dick Grayson being the New Batman in my opinion I don't like it Night wing suited him way better Bruce Wayne is Original.
I've very much enjoyed his stay as Batman, though I was also glad to see Bruce come back to the mantle. It's not like Dick will be Batman forever though, eventually Morrison will leave and someone will hit the reset button and we'll be back to normal.
Ive also really enjoyed seeing grayson as batman. I always enjoyed the concept of the "Bat-Family" and seeing the eldest child finally a man (a Bat-man if you will) is really interesting to me. @fenixREVOLUTION: as much as i hate it you are probably, in two years we will see dick in a different pair of tights.
@joshmightbe: Yeah I know right well maybe it is better but, like other people have said maybe Dick should only stay as Batman for a while then return to Nightwing I guess I just have gotten used to seeing him as Nightwing!!
I dont want Dick to go back to being Nightwing, that seems like a step backward in terms of character development, that would be like Wally becoming Kid Flash again when Barry came back. Sure he's not Bruce, but Dick is still a pretty good batman.
@GundamHeavyarms: no dick being robin would be a step back him being nightwing was him being his own man and stepping out of bruce's shadow if anything him becoming batman was a step backward
@joshmightbe: If anything, it's Dick accepting his destiny Bruce can't be batman forever Dick is the oldest so it will be a family tradition. And two Batman's work better, criminals don't fear Nightwing the same way they do Batman. And with Batman Inc. he is very much lacking the time for Gotham,and Dick is the only one he knows for sure can take care of himself, and Gotham since he handled all of the Arkham escapee's, and has the most experience with super criminals. Nightwing isn't the symbol like batman is, and he made it to be out of his shadow. But now they are equals so going from Batman to Nightwing would be a big step down,especially since in Prodigal he was only batman for a few issues, and this he's been batman for a significant amount of time.
" Dick has never been nor will he ever truly be Batman. He's just wearing the suit. Bruce is Batman, and Bruce rules. "
This. So much this. People seem to be forgetting that Bruce is just the mask that Batman wears. Batman is the true identity. "
Exacty. Batman may be a legacy, but that legacy IS Bruce. He and Batman are a singular being, which is what makes him so fascinating as a character. Anyone else who wears the cowl isn't really Batman, they're wearing the same suit that Bruce Wayne wore. Batman is more than just a mask and cape.
" Dick has never been nor will he ever truly be Batman. He's just wearing the suit. Bruce is Batman, and Bruce rules. "
This. So much this. People seem to be forgetting that Bruce is just the mask that Batman wears. Batman is the true identity. "
Exacty. Batman may be a legacy, but that legacy IS Bruce. He and Batman are a singular being, which is what makes him so fascinating as a character. Anyone else who wears the cowl isn't really Batman, they're wearing the same suit that Bruce Wayne wore. Batman is more than just a mask and cape. "
Your arugments remind me of a scene in Batman Begins. In the scene Henri Ducard encourages Bruce to become a legend instead of a man. Morrison expanded on this idea with his take on the Batman as a "living idea", a Bat-God if you will. In that case, wouldn't it be more calming to the nerves to view Dick as a Bat-saint (or Bat-Jesus) rather than a copycat? Being Batman is closer to Bat-Godliness than being Nightwing. Also, and call me crazy,but there's something about Dick's Bat-Suit that makes me take him more seriously than when he was Nightwing. I think's it the cape. Without it, he's just a near-Batman class crimefighter/ cougar trophy. I need something to cover up that sweet ass of his.
I liked him picking up the mantle. I wish he would pick up a more updated version of it though. I think they should wear more simlar or identical suits. I know it would make it harder for the readers to differentiate but i would ike to at least see it tried. Also i'm really not liking the artist for the up coming issue of Batman inc. He makes Dick look small and weak compared to Bruce. Dick is supposed to be his equal now but they still make hmi out to be his sidekick w/ a sidekick. If you look at the last panel of him shown in the following scan, they make dick look like a smiling tool. I love his profile pic but they need work on his comic appearances
I liked him picking up the mantle. I wish he would pick up a more updated version of it though. I think they should wear more simlar or identical suits. I know it would make it harder for the readers to differentiate but i would ike to at least see it tried. Also i'm really not liking the artist for the up coming issue of Batman inc. He makes Dick look small and weak compared to Bruce. Dick is supposed to be his equal now but they still make hmi out to be his sidekick w/ a sidekick. If you look at the last panel of him shown in the following scan, they make dick look like a smiling tool. I love his profile pic but they need work on his comic appearances
I think due to most of the books being written so well, but I'm still enjoying Dick as Batman. I do know that eventually Bruce will be the only Batman, but for now I'm enjoying this change, still.
I think if/when Dick is no longer Batman it should be his decision with something along the lines of "This isn't me" or "No offense Bruce, but i dont want to end up like you"
What i would like to see is for Bruce to do what he has always wanted to do and that is cure crime in Gotham. I think the thing that should happen is a series of attacks at the GPD from all the Gotham mobs united they will only unite because of a combination of them only joining together to hurt the GPD and because the top mob has called for it and they are the most powerful. Then when the police start hunting them down they start getting desperate and call in some masked help. (they don't like masks that's why they don't call them in from the start) They start off with firefly and a group of mobsters but they wont put firefly in charge and refuse to do the hit his way because they want to feel as if the mob is only using masks as weapons not that they need masks. When the hit happens the mob manage to injure 2 police man and kidnap the commissioner then the police force realize the same thing as the mobs that they need some super help so they call in Red Robin because if they call in batman it will no longer be a police operation. The result is the police catch the top mobs top boss. Then both sides realize they need the help of a bigger gun so the police get batman (bruce wayne) to head the GPD temporarily and the mob gets the Joker to head the mobs temporarily. The result is a lot of small conflicts and a final confrontation in which joker is hit in the head and gets amnesia so he forgets his life as the joker and remembers his last life and then with some surgery he goes back to looking normal. After this batman ((bruce wayne) now in his mid 40's) desides to retire because all of the mobs are either disbanded, in prison or very weak and the joker is normal again. So in the end batmans most dangerous (in my opinion he is about 10th) enemy's evil has ended so Bruce Waynes batman has as well. Then Dick can take over as the father of the bat family but bruce will always be the grandad.
Dick being Batman is the best thing to happen to the Batman books since Jason Todd returned...It makes the BatBooks fresh now...
Though my initial reaction wants to agree with that reasoning, Dick becoming The Batman was a logical stepping stone in terms of the character of Batman. Not bruce wayne. I never got into batman in regular title cause as the years went by and the late 80's hit he became very broody and I read more into nightwing anyways. Dick though not as smart as bruce was a great batman in his own rights. and people should get used to the idea of batman being replaced eventually I mean it happens in batman beyond when Terry becomes batman.
Dick was a better team player than bruce ever was and people always forget that. even jim notices the difference when he smiles. cause it shows that bruce is WAY too serious and is a person I would not work with. Dick brought something to the Bat-mantle that Bruce could NEVER bring, heart. if people want good old fashioned smart man who broods all the time in the dark then fine.
I think the series was awesome i was leary about it because i just couldent see night wing taking on that mantle.I defiantly thought jason todd should have took it up because Dick grayson already formed a great hero.But in all fairness Dick did really good as batman and i loved that series
I liked the prospect of him being Batman, but unfortunately, while at first his reluctance to assume the role was good -- it eventually was overplayed and made his ascension into Batman somewhat irritating at times.
It was a wonderful run and Dick can be Batman anytime as far as i'm concerned.
I think it was a logical step in not only the character of Batman, but the character of Dick Grayson as well. Now more than ever I think its clear that Dick's the next one in line to take the mantle if Bruce ever does really pass on and I think DIck's proved he can handle the weight of the cowl.
I didn't mind the suit, but now that he's been Batman and done his own thing, i'd think that in the future he'd change the suit up a bit more, just like Bruce has over the years. Maybe just get rid of the cape altogether. Again, I didn't mind it and thought it was great, but I think changing the outfit in a radical way (Change in costume from Hal to Kyle) is a part of making the job your own.
@Nathaniel_Christopher: Regarding Dick becoming heir. If it happens I believe it's important to touch on what you said about reinventing the costume. All the components are there for an epic, intricate web that ties into every generation gap involving the bat timeline. Nightwing is key to it's formula. I'll pm you the details of what I have theorized. So far during Tomasi's run on Batman and Robin, he's dropped small nuggets of information seeming to foreshadow events that are set to occur in the future. For instance, the great dane purchased for Damian was originally to be named Ace(linking the pre-crisis bathound to the present one; connecting also the future Ace seen in Batman Beyond) There are also subtle similarities between NoBody and Shriek. There's also mention of Batman Inc in the Batman Beyond ongoing.
We're informed DC is making big noise with Batman Beyond Unlimited web series in April, a monthly Superman/ JLA / Bat crossover story set in the future. So readers atleast know they're putting more emphasis on that particular universe. Getting back to Grayson(went off on a tangent, srry) if DC eventually moves forward with defining his legacy as Batman or place a spotlight on Nightwing, I feel it's important to sheopard in the change by alluding to Dick Grayson's correlation with Terry McGinnis. Their costumes have resemblance; color scheme coordinate, schematics etc. They look similar, act the same and are both sons of Bruce Wayne. (As an aside--Batwing has jetboots and battle armor but Nightwing can't even have underarm gliders/utility belt? That's weak.) They need to pick up on that and upgrade his suit as an ode to his successor(Terry) like build him a prototype of the Beyond version either as Batman or Nightwing. There's so much story there I'm surprised it hasn't been brought up yet. Just inquiring.
@Nathaniel_Christopher: Regarding Dick becoming heir. If it happens I believe it's important to touch on what you said about reinventing the costume. All the components are there for an epic, intricate web that ties into every generation gap involving the bat timeline. Nightwing is key to it's formula. I'll pm you the details of what I have theorized. So far during Tomasi's run on Batman and Robin, he's dropped small nuggets of information seeming to foreshadow events that are set to occur in the future. For instance, the great dane purchased for Damian was originally to be named Ace(linking the pre-crisis bathound to the present one; connecting also the future Ace seen in Batman Beyond) There are also subtle similarities between NoBody and Shriek. There's also mention of Batman Inc in the Batman Beyond ongoing.
We're informed DC is making big noise with Batman Beyond Unlimited web series in April, a monthly Superman/ JLA / Bat crossover story set in the future. So readers atleast know they're putting more emphasis on that particular universe. Getting back to Grayson(went off on a tangent, srry) if DC eventually moves forward with defining his legacy as Batman or place a spotlight on Nightwing, I feel it's important to sheopard in the change by alluding to Dick Grayson's correlation with Terry McGinnis. Their costumes have resemblance; color scheme coordinate, schematics etc. They look similar, act the same and are both sons of Bruce Wayne. (As an aside--Batwing has jetboots and battle armor but Nightwing can't even have underarm gliders/utility belt? That's weak.) They need to pick up on that and upgrade his suit as an ode to his successor(Terry) like build him a prototype of the Beyond version either as Batman or Nightwing. There's so much story there I'm surprised it hasn't been brought up yet. Just inquiring.
I agree on absolutely everything. In terms of the costume I definitley think Dick needs an upgrade. I don't mind the current one, but the change still seems pointless to me. Changing the color from Blue to Red and not adding anything more to the costume, when its clearly going to remind people of Terry's is weak writing on DC's part. I think considering Dick made special note of the fact the cape wasn't for him and the fact that Terry has NEVER had a cape, is another connection the two could share. Maybe Bruce finally got rid of the cape partly because of Dick's feelings on it.
I hate the idea of a Dick Grayson Batman, the role doesn't suit his character. Dick is a knight not a dark knight
I respectfully disagree. He doesn't have to be Bruce Wayne to be Batman, that's the whole point of it, but there were certain parts of his characterization that were treated horrible.
@ReVamp: I just don't think Dick Grayson is about what Batman represents, nor do I think he'd be willing to sacrifice the aspects of his character that contradict with what it means to be Batman, nor would I want him to. I like Dick Grayson and he definitely has the skill but he doesn't suit the role of Batman. Batman doesn't have to be Bruce Wayne but still there are things about the mythos of Batman that relate to aspects of his characterization. When dick wore the suit he never felt like Batman he felt like Dick wearing the suit.
I just don't think Dick Grayson is about what Batman represents,
I disagree.
nor do I think he'd be willing to sacrifice the aspects of his character that contradict with what it means to be Batman,
Being Batman =/= Being a Solitary motherf*cker that has trouble opening up, that's what it means to be Bruce Wayne.
I like Dick Grayson and he definitely has the skill but he doesn't suit the role of Batman.
And I respect that.
Batman doesn't have to be Bruce Wayne but still there are things about the mythos of Batman that relate to aspects of his characterization.
True, but Dick doesn't have to be what I mentioned above to be Batman. He can be a serious, fearsome motherf*cker is he wants to. Of course, there was some serious problems with characterization, like for instance with him smiling all the time. Writers did that to show us it wasn't Bruce, but then they never had the time to get out of this cycle since Bruce came back to life very soon.
When dick wore the suit he never felt like Batman he felt like Dick wearing the suit.
Depends. I'd say that in Batman and Robin he felt like Batman for sure.
I just don't think Dick Grayson is about what Batman represents,
I disagree.
nor do I think he'd be willing to sacrifice the aspects of his character that contradict with what it means to be Batman,
Being Batman =/= Being a Solitary motherf*cker that has trouble opening up, that's what it means to be Bruce Wayne.
I like Dick Grayson and he definitely has the skill but he doesn't suit the role of Batman.
And I respect that.
Batman doesn't have to be Bruce Wayne but still there are things about the mythos of Batman that relate to aspects of his characterization.
True, but Dick doesn't have to be what I mentioned above to be Batman. He can be a serious, fearsome motherf*cker is he wants to. Of course, there was some serious problems with characterization, like for instance with him smiling all the time. Writers did that to show us it wasn't Bruce, but then they never had the time to get out of this cycle since Bruce came back to life very soon.
When dick wore the suit he never felt like Batman he felt like Dick wearing the suit.
Depends. I'd say that in Batman and Robin he felt like Batman for sure.
I haven't thought being Batman was about being a "Solitary motherf*cker" for a very long time, how large is the Bat Family now anyway? I wouldn't exactly call Bruce a loner with as many kids as he's adopted. What I meant about Dick not suiting the role is that Batman is about fear and a professional seriousness that has to be up most of the time, Dick can cause fear and he can and often is serious and professional but for him to step those aspects up to the level that is necessarily for Batman to have wouldn't be fun, it wouldn't be Dick anymore. Nightwing can be just as effective as Batman and while I would pick another robin to take the mantle I would assign Dick to the role Batman has in the Super community including Batman's position in the Trinity. Let's face it if Batman smiles as often as Dick tends to h then he looses his effect on criminals, he can still beat them up but Batman prevents some crime just by being this supernatural thing, Dick could start smiling like the Joker which would also scare criminals but that's as out of character as if he just never smiled again. Dick Grayson represents things and Batman represents different things
offtopic: is it me or the current batmobiles are really ugly? i love the design in Batman beyond but what they use now is just horrible in my opionin
What did you think of the Batmobile from when Dick was Batman? I actually liked the coupe/hovercar look and thought it could work really well for him as Nightwing. It still exists in the new 52 btw! The Batman Beyond version might just be my favorite design of the vehicle.
@BlackArmor said:
I hate the idea of a Dick Grayson Batman, the role doesn't suit his character. Dick is a knight not a dark knight
lol can you imagine Bruce as Nightwing?? xD If there's one story I'd love to see published besides Damian meeting a childhood version of Dick as Robin...this one might just take the cake. Very interesting scenario for a guy who relies on patience/fear, to jump headlong into a situation having to trust his athleticism and skill of timing. Sporting a leotard no less. I just think that's an honor in of itself Dick can flip between both personas so fluidly. When he wants to(or usually when Bruce is m.i.a.)Dick morphs into a pseudo-detective/planner and drops the goofball man-child aspect completely. Seemingly, whenever his mentor is around his resolve remains strong but he won't be as grounded. If only Tim were as multifaceted.. :l
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