Wow I'm glad this hasn't completely devolved into post-crisis whining.
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Which character has improved the most under the New 52...?
Most Improved
Animal Man
Aquaman
Constatine
Hawkman
Red Hood
Swamp Thing
Supergirl
Wonder Woman
Some Improved
Black Canary
Deadman
Cyborg
Harley Quinn
Starfire
Zatanna
a few good stories doesn't mean that the characters themselves have improved and a few bad stories from Pre52 doesn't mean that they were bad
You say this as if Superman had many good stories Post-Crisis.
BB
a veritable sh!t-ton of good stories...especially compared to the New 52
I wonder if the people who mentioned Animal Man and Swamp Thing even read their previous series.
Wonder Woman's current situation could have fit into Post-Crisis continuity
They actually rebooted the character unlike most in the reboot. How would have it worked in the previous continuity?
BB
I didn't read Animal Man nor Swamp Thing pre-reboot to be honest so I guess you could put them in the Aquaman category being that they were just fine and only got more publicity during New 52. As for Wonder Woman, they could have set up a story where it's revealed Zeus was always Diana's father and no one ever knew except Hera and made the clay story up. That's pretty much what they did for this Diana. She was originally thought to have been made from clay but was later told it was a lie.
There are several stories where the fact that Wonder Woman was made of clay crops up --- the Divided We Fall arc of JLA where the Cathexis revert her back to a clay statue, the Primeval one-shot, the False Faces story with Clayface, etc etc. None of those stories would make any sense if the clay origin was revealed to be a lie.
I know of those stories, I've read them lol. Assuming Post-Crisis stayed and DC wanted to change her origin I'm sure the writers would find a way to work with it or around it, that's their job, isn't it? Or perhaps they'd have killed off Diana completely and reincarnated her that way. I dunno, I just think DC could and would have found a way to reboot Diana while in Post-Crisis continuity if they wanted.
they could have made all the changes to Wonder Woman really easily...they had her set up perfectly for a reboot in her Pre52 series
a few good stories doesn't mean that the characters themselves have improved and a few bad stories from Pre52 doesn't mean that they were bad
You say this as if Superman had many good stories Post-Crisis.
BB
a veritable sh!t-ton of good stories...especially compared to the New 52
Psshh what good in continuity stories did he have? :P
BB
@frozen: The New 52 has been doing a good job establishing a story for Captain Marvel, but it didn't have to ruin his character to do it. Trying to make him a rough kid who learns to be good is very unoriginal, and a bit lazy. I would have much rather enjoyed a story about Billy being good, and facing the challenges that come from being such a pure good person. I think that would be more interesting and far more original. Plus I don't like his new costume, don't get me wrong, that's probably one of the few things I can forgive, but I still think they could have done a better job redesigning it.
Wonder Woman, but to be honest I didn't read much before the New 52 but was completely taken with Azzarello and Chiang's work on the series.
@outside_85: but wasn't he still meant to be stronger than superman?
He was meant to be a replacement satan, I don't think Kirby invented Darkseid to compete with Superman.
I only mentioned Animal Man because with the reboot he became more popular.People started mentioning him left and right although he had a great previous series with Grant Morrison on it.But it seems like people prefer Lemire's run more than Morrison's one.
I wonder if the people who mentioned Animal Man and Swamp Thing even read their previous series.
I only mentioned Animal Man because with the reboot he became more popular.People started mentioning him left and right although he had a great previous series with Grant Morrison on it.But it seems like people prefer Lemire's run more than Morrison's one.
He got more popular sure but I wouldn't call it improving a character, and almost all prefer Morrison's over Lemire's.
BB
Superman for me.
DC ran out of stories. So bad that they took Supes out of Action for a while and had him roaming around in "Walking".
N52 Superman is just a better character, a more rounded character with a better supporting cast. All we need to do is axe Lobdell from the Superman title and we'll have Soule, Pak and Geoff on Superman. Talking All-Stars.
Superman definitely improved IMO. His New-52 character concept much more to my liking than previous one.
Wonder Woman. I finally managed to read her first seventeen New-52 issues. If Azzarello still writing her title on a level, then it definite improvement over what she had a couple of years before Flashpoint.
Swamp Thing. Maybe it’s not a New-52-related, but what Soule writes is very interesting and solid storytelling.
Guy Gardner probably. First time ever I actually can tolerate him.
Just a couple days ago I finished reading New-52 Captain Atom’s limited run. That’s a strong pretendent in “improved characters” list.
Quite many people said encouraging things about Animal Man, Aquaman and Green Arrow.
I wonder if the people who mentioned Animal Man and Swamp Thing even read their previous series.
I only mentioned Animal Man because with the reboot he became more popular.People started mentioning him left and right although he had a great previous series with Grant Morrison on it.But it seems like people prefer Lemire's run more than Morrison's one.
He got more popular sure but I wouldn't call it improving a character, and almost all prefer Morrison's over Lemire's.
BB
It's a slight improvement in popularity not in character's growth or role in the universe.It is understandable why they prefer Morrison's one.
@jayc1324: Which only happened when not very good writers got their hands on him. The difference was that Darkseid wasn't a villain everyone gets to pile up on like Thanos is over at Marvel. As for silly slapping, Darkseid can do that too.
Darkseid: Superman I command you to...FAP
Superman: Yes master Darkseid, "looks at a Wonder Woman photo" fap fap fap fap fap fap fap fap fap
@2cool4fun: he doesn't need that when he can just actually have wonder woman
Aquaman ( the new 52 is like a whole new life to this guy )
Mera
Batwoman
Red Hood
Animal Man
Arsenal ( was never a big fan of him, but now he is a really good character )
Deathstroke ( he showed us from issue 1 that he is the biggest badass around )
Kyle Rayner ( The dude finally got his own book, and becoming a white lantern bumped him from my 2nd to my #1 favorite lantern character )
Guy Gardner ( always hated him, but ever since he became a Red Lantern I started loving him as a character, plus now all 4 main human lanterns have their own book, instead of being crammed in 1/2 books )
Phantom Stranger
Deadman
Larfleeze
Lois Lane ( showing that she does not always have to be Superman's love interest, but can also play the friend role )
Supergirl ( most of you might disagree, but until now, she was just Kal El in a female body, now she at least has a different personality to go with all this, plus I find this a much better origin than the one from Superman/Batman where she just f**king accepts the lose of her planet and learns a whole language in under 1 month )
Kryprro, he looks way mroe badass!
- Aquaman
- Barry Allen
- Steve Trevor
Improved
Barry Allen- Everything for him in the New 52 has been amazing for him and the rest of the Flash cast. All that is missing is Wally.
Aquaman- More people respect him which is great! Aquaman has always been a cool character though now DC and the fans are finally noticing him.
Martian Manhunter- Martian Manhunter now seems to be more important. I know they took him off the main League and I have been constantly bitching about I do like the treatment he has been getting. Before New 52 he was dead and I didn't have much too do with the League. Now it does seem he has been everywhere and more mysterious though I do miss him being on the main team.
Steve Trevor- Actually is cool now!
Dick Grayson- Yes they ruined the Nightwing mantle and they took away a lot of the Robin history it the concept of him being a spy has kinda got me excited. Grayson is evolving and his book will step out of the Bat family books meaning Dick can stop living in the shadows of Batman events.
The Spectre- Haven't read anything with him in it though I have seen Jim Corrigan learned what pants are. Hurray for Spectre!
Phantom Stranger- I knew of him and what he was about though it never did seem like he had much to do with anything in the DCU.
Red Hood- As much as I hate Jason I actually don't mind him being alive.
Frankenstein- I like how much he has been involved. I find it fun having Frankenstein fight with the Justice League and is part of a Justice League and agency.
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