The Enemy Within, Captain Marvel/Avengers Assemble Crossover.

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#51 Posted by Soupnazi (32 posts) - - Show Bio

Captain Marvel #12 came out today, and it's set the scene perfectly for The Enemy Within. Why does this have to be a monthly book?! Then again, ideally one issue would come out per day and obviously that's not reasonable.

Anyway, with the lowish sales of Captain Marvel, I have a suspicion that a lot could be riding on The Enemy Within, so if anyone reading this has been on the fence, please check Captain Marvel out now!

#52 Posted by ClericalError (3 posts) - - Show Bio

@soupnazi said:

Seriously, guys, not liking the new series is fine, but fans of the series might actually like to discuss it without every other post being "I don't like this." If you're not going to quantify your negative opinions so as to start discussion, you're just being rude.

I wish to clarify a few things before I get to my rant. I agree with @soupnazi completely here. Just saying, "you don't like something" without explaining why you do not like it means you're just leaving a comment to justify your own feelings and are not contributing in any way to the conversation. You are entitled to your opinions, but they are just that. Opinions, not problems.

So to follow this up with some problems I have noticed with the Captain Marvel title (rather than the Ms Marvel title).

After the House of M storyline, Carol Danvers awoke with a desire to be "The Best of the Best". From that point she fought off hundreds of Skrulls on the streets of New York City protecting the people of the city; she formed her own group under S.H.I.E.L.D to try and hunt down A.I.M groups that had gotten out of control, she sacrificed her life to stop Norman Osborn from acquiring Ascension, She led the Avengers, she fought the Phoenix and of course, dated Spider-man like she promised. Now she's walking kids home and taking Chewie to the vet.

Tony Stark made her an indestructible fabric sash that's able to suffocate the Absorbing Man (Captain Marvel #1). Let's, just for a second ignore the fact that there is probably some danger in letting Absorbing Man TOUCH indestructible material, or that choking a man made completely out of rock might not work at all. Instead we'll focus on the fact that Ms Marvel's energy based costume changing power has been with her since day one. She is able to change from her current costume into her "civvies" in a moments notice. Her costume is just an energy projection that behaves like normal clothes. As a long time Ms Marvel fan just having to take 5 seconds to process the idea that she converts her current clothes to her Captain Marvel outfit, but still keeps the red sash was a bad move from a writing perspective. Also... Tony Stark isn't really known for making cloth... more the high tech stuff like armor and flying aides (we'll come back to that one later).

Ms Marvel was able to absorb energy and project it back at people. She was also able to convert energy into a substitute for oxygen (allowing her to go into space for extended periods of time). If she hadn't absorbed any energy, she couldn't breathe in space and the energy she could throw around was not as powerful. That's it. That's all her energy absorbing abilities ever did. Her indestructibility and super-strength are always on. Yet in Captain Marvel #10 we see her absorb energy from the train tracks because she can't lift a train carriage without it. Just a quick reminder, Carol Danvers has a strength comparable to the Hulk and Thor. If she required energy to absorb in order to have that level of strength previously, she'd be long dead.

Captain Marvel and Captain Marvel team up to defeat an underwater transformer robot thing. I face-palmed in this issue and ranted to my roommate for a few hours on this one; but I'll save you guys the long version. If Carol Danvers is taking over the name Captain Marvel and there is already someone named Captain Marvel, probably not a good move to point out the massive screw-up to everyone reading the title. Even worse to have them do some kind of weird combo-our-powers-in-a-way-that-does-not-work way to defeat something way below their pay-grade. Ms Marvel just finished fighting the Phoenix in space and meeting a resurrected Captain Marvel on the Kree home world. She then gets sucked back in time. Then acknowledges to "a friend" that she stole her name without permission and for no reason apart from, "Cap thought it'd be a good idea".

Carol Danvers has an anomaly in her brain. NO SHE DOESN'T. I am not going to talk about her indestructibility or her healing-factor here. No no. These obvious and glaring problems need not distract from the bigger problem here. The bigger problem is the Storyteller brains from War of the Marvels. Some of you newer readers who are just picking up this new title probably have no idea what I'm talking about, so let me clarify. Short version of the story is that prior to the Dark Reign storylines Carol Danvers started to lose control of her powers. Using her powers was killing her. But she needed to stop the bad guy, cause that is what she does. So she saves the day but dies in the process. A character named the Storyteller (a small child with the ability to create anything her reads or imagines) was saved by Ms Marvel. He also read about her adventures in space as Binary, worshiped her as his favorite hero, etc, etc. This boy was cloned and jarred as small brains for Advanced Idea Mechanics to use to create their own world, but in doing so the brains cried out for Ms Marvel to save him. Due to the nature of the Storyteller powers, he resurrected/recreated Ms Marvel as he imagined and remembered her. More powerful than she was before, but with the same memories and such. My point being, I doubt very much that this kid decided to recreate Carol with an anomaly in her brain. If new information comes out in future issues about someone using a ray or something to create it in her... please look back to my healing-factor and indestructibility notes.

Some powers make her head hurt, others don't? She's not allowed to fly because it hurts her brain and might kill her, fair enough. But lifting the subway car hurt her too and she didn't fly there. Was it the absorbing electricity bit? Does her being indestructible ALL THE TIME hurt her head? If not, why not?

Captain America gives her a flying motorcycle. First of all... You're getting your sewing done by Tony Stark and you're getting your flying aides given to you buy the guy from World War II. Switch those two around!!! Get Tony Stark to make you a freaking repulsor backpack or SOMETHING. He hacked your phone to get your attention and he hand-picked you to lead the Avengers (Mighty Avengers #1). Also YOU'RE A PILOT!!! Go talk to Colonel Rhodes about some gear to help.The flying motorcycle is just stupid for Carol. She likes going a lot faster than that.

While you're at it, go talk to Beast, Hank Pym, Reed Richards, Tony Stark, Bruce Banner, Stephen Strange or The Storyteller about fixing the thing in your brain!

Dinosaurs for no reason. Hey, just a quick note: you were thrown back in time for reasons you don't understand and now you're fighting dinosaurs in New York City for reasons you never bother to investigate. Perhaps you should go talk to someone about space-time continuum stuff. No? you'd rather take your cat to the vet? Okay. At least you have your priorities sorted. This might've been the warning people needed to stop the Age of Ultron. You know, the series you are dead in?

Helmet? No Helmet? Spiked Hair? Flowing Hair? Pick one. I don't mind the idea that she's decided to style it in different ways, with all the spare time she has NOT saving the world and chatting with neighbors. But I don't think her hair changing length is really going to help people with recognizing her. I don't have a problem with her wearing a helmet either. Just pick one and stop swapping.

Andrade's art work. Nothing against the guy, but please just leave my favorite character alone. I am sure that there are many people out there that love this style of art and there is probably a market for comics drawn in this fashion. But Carol Danvers didn't get to her level of popularity by looking like that. She is an INCREDIBLY SEXY drawn character. She is beautiful, she has an amazing fantasy body, the look in her eyes is as meaningful as the arc of the punch she is throwing. Comic books are a VISUAL MEDIUM. We pick up a comic because of how it looks. If you're looking for a sexy super-heroine, you're not going to find it in this book. In this book you're going to find an expressionist interpretation of Aeon Flux after a stroke who lost their fingers in an unfortunate smelting accident. I'm only half kidding there. In some shots she doesn't even have hands! After a few Andrade's issues I am relieved to see she still has a nose.

These issues I have raised could all be solved by one simple thing. Changing the character's name from Carol Danvers to anything else. Let's call her Lana Lane and just pretend that Carol Danvers is still on the Kree home world. That's a lot easier to believe than anything that's happened so far.

TL;DR: Stark fabric, Flying motorcycle, powers not working correctly, no possible way she could have a brain issue, looks different issue to issue and the artwork has no place in a Carol Danvers comic.

I created an account here to post this comment. I have a lot of patience, but when you collect your favorite comic character's stories for years and years and suddenly she starts to not make sense, look completely different and inspire nothing that drew you to it in the first place it is time to put the character to rest. I have stopped collecting Captain Marvel, effective immediately.

#53 Posted by ClericalError (3 posts) - - Show Bio

Actually yeah, good point.

Just pretend that this character is NOT Carol Danvers and everyone should be happy.

#54 Posted by Soupnazi (32 posts) - - Show Bio

@clericalerror: Ooh, those are some fantastic points! There are a few I take issue with, though.

"Captain Marvel and Captain Marvel team up to defeat an underwater transformer robot thing. I face-palmed in this issue and ranted to my roommate for a few hours on this one; but I'll save you guys the long version. If Carol Danvers is taking over the name Captain Marvel and there is already someone named Captain Marvel, probably not a good move to point out the massive screw-up to everyone reading the title."

Eh? According to ComicVine's page for Monica Rambeau, she hasn't been Captain Marvel for a while, and is currently operating under her real name.

"Some powers make her head hurt, others don't? She's not allowed to fly because it hurts her brain and might kill her, fair enough. But lifting the subway car hurt her too and she didn't fly there. Was it the absorbing electricity bit? Does her being indestructible ALL THE TIME hurt her head? If not, why not?"

It's always seemed to me that the lesion can cause her pain at any time, and flying is a guaranteed no-no.

"Captain America gives her a flying motorcycle. First of all... You're getting your sewing done by Tony Stark and you're getting your flying aides given to you buy the guy from World War II. Switch those two around!!! Get Tony Stark to make you a freaking repulsor backpack or SOMETHING. He hacked your phone to get your attention and he hand-picked you to lead the Avengers (Mighty Avengers #1). Also YOU'RE A PILOT!!! Go talk to Colonel Rhodes about some gear to help.The flying motorcycle is just stupid for Carol. She likes going a lot faster than that."

Captain America gave her the motorcycle, but nowhere is it said he made it, just that he has it. It does seem more logical for Tony to make her a backpack thing, but Carol never went in search of a solution--Wendy Kawasaki found her one. She is later seen in issue #12 wearing what looks like a jetpack, so it seems reasonable that that was her long-term solution, whereas the motorcycle was short-term. The motorcycle seems to go quite fast, anyway.

"While you're at it, go talk to Beast, Hank Pym, Reed Richards, Tony Stark, Bruce Banner, Stephen Strange or The Storyteller about fixing the thing in your brain!"

Carol doesn't think that the thing in her brain is an issue. That's the whole point.

"But Carol Danvers didn't get to her level of popularity by looking like that. She is an INCREDIBLY SEXY drawn character. She is beautiful, she has an amazing fantasy body, the look in her eyes is as meaningful as the arc of the punch she is throwing."

Seriously? Seriously? Did you just spend an entire post talking about how this new Carol isn't true to her character, then expected her to be made sexy? And complained that an artist isn't making her look sexy enough? Don't you see how gross and contradictory that is?

Your complaints with the comic seem to stem entirely from plot holes (which is perfectly valid!), inconsistencies with her powers, and the artwork, so I'm confused as to why you seem to hate it so much if you love Carol Danvers. You don't seem to think her character is any different, and the only thing you mention that drew you to her character is that she's sexy, so on the one hand, you're very perceptive to plot holes, and yet you come off as some creepy dude who can't get into a book if there isn't a sexually attractive woman in every panel.

#55 Posted by ClericalError (3 posts) - - Show Bio

@soupnazi: Didn't mean to come off as creepy :( I was only trying to illustrate the point that on of the things that makes her Carol Danvers is her sexual appeal (not her DEFINING point, but a very legitimate one) and that drawing her in a way that makes her look like a balloon animal isn't true to the character. Similar to hiring a different actor to play the same character in a movie. It just doesn't feel right and disconnects the audience from the experience.

Ms Marvel's been a favorite character of mine for a very long time. She's ambitious, determined, stands up for herself, is able to make correct snap judgements and is a strong independent woman in a realm mostly filled with men. Hulk, Thor, Hurcules, Doctor Doom, Ironman, Sentry, Nova, etc, etc. She's one of FEW female characters that is on a similar power scale (okay, maybe not Sentry. lol) and I loved that about her. Wasp, Scarlet Witch, Black Widow, Spider-woman, etc aren't even close but are still sexy. The fact that she is also sexy doesn't mean that I am a creepy dude that ONLY reads books with sexy females in them. It was these traits that brought me to the comic in the first place, and the beautiful artwork just added to the experience. There are many many many alternatives out there for people interested in being "creepy dudes".

The Carol Danvers I know wouldn't be in denial about her health condition. In fact previously when she lost her powers, or gained them again she would spend ages in the lab with Beast trying to figure out what was wrong with her. She hated not being able to fly the X-Men into space, but realised the right course of action was to figure out what was wrong with her. In Project Ascension she didn't have that luxury because time was of the essence. If she stopped running, investigating and fighting Norman Osborn would've become unstoppable just as he was planning his attack on Asguard. Again, she made the right call to do what was right in that moment. In Captain Marvel she's purposefully ignoring the symptoms, being stubborn and hoping it all goes away. This shows weakness of character, not strength.

It seems clear to me that this person is NOT Carol Danvers. She doesn't act like her, she doesn't think like her, talk like her, have her same powers or look like her.

Also, I never said the new comics were horrible or that I hated them. I just don't want to read this series and I loved the old ones. I'm loving the Superior Spider-Man series as well as Age of Ultron and going back and reading some old classics. I just CHOOSE not to spend my money on something I think is damaging the franchise that is Carol Danvers. You remember that long period when Spider-Man wasn't Peter Parker and it was a clone and he did all kinds of things that made you not like him as a character? I didn't buy those either after reading the first few. I didn't like the Star Wars Prequels or the Matrix sequels either. Same reasons.

I am really glad that you're enjoying the series. I hope you continue to enjoy it, and I also appreciate that you took the time to reply to my rant (as this topic is very important to me). My reply was just giving some "quantified reasons" why someone might not enjoy the series. Hope I seem less creepy now! lol

#56 Posted by Soupnazi (32 posts) - - Show Bio

@clericalerror: Fair enough; you make some really great points. I'm really glad to be able to have such a calm discourse on this topic (though I must admit I got pretty irate at you... sorry), but I can't say I particularly disagree with anything you say there, so my post is going to be pretty short. XD

#57 Edited by Havokx (6 posts) - - Show Bio

I hate the fact that she is ground. I want her to be 100%healthy and to get a new artist.

#58 Posted by V_Scarlotte_Rose (6286 posts) - - Show Bio

@havokx: There's a new artist starting with the mini-event, and supposedly the brain condition will be explored in it, so she may get cured within the next few issues. :)

#59 Posted by xkoenig (394 posts) - - Show Bio

Wow, well I like the current Captain Marvel, I'm a huge fan of Carol Danvers and I'm really looking forward to Enemy Within. And evidently Scott Hepburn is the new artist.

#60 Posted by V_Scarlotte_Rose (6286 posts) - - Show Bio

@xkoenig: From what I've seen, he looks like he could be a pretty good fit for this series. :)

#61 Edited by xkoenig (394 posts) - - Show Bio

@xkoenig: From what I've seen, he looks like he could be a pretty good fit for this series. :)

I hope so. I like Andrade well enough, but I'm ready for a conventional artist again for a while. My biggest wish would be for Dexter Soy to come back, but I think that's out of the question.

#62 Posted by akbogert (3222 posts) - - Show Bio

@clericalerror: I won't lie: I find it grimly amusing that you hate this book's mistreatment of a character you've cherished for years, but you're enjoying Superior Spider-Man....

Anyhow, I read the first issue of Captain Marvel and loved it, but part of that was Soy and part was the flight stuff, and both are currently gone. I'm also nervous about the "serious consequences for her relationship with Jessica" thing. I want to support this book at what sounds like a crucial juncture, but I'd hate to invest in it only to get angry at the fallout of the event -- something that interview suggests may well happen.

#63 Posted by V_Scarlotte_Rose (6286 posts) - - Show Bio

@akbogert: Both series have been good, so I imagine the event will be pretty good.

Where did you see the words 'serious consequences' used? I've seen 'big repercussions', which is a bit less scary. Big repercussions doesn't necessarily mean a falling out, so hopefully that's not what it is.

@xkoenig:

Dexter Soy would be good, but yeah, I'm happy enough with someone conventional.

#64 Posted by akbogert (3222 posts) - - Show Bio

@v_scarlotte_rose: oh, I didn't quote exactly, but suffice to say I don't see the difference; both phrases alarm me equally. My mind immediately turns over possible outcomes, like getting rid of the lesion producing amnesia, etc. etc.

That interview suggested that fans will be upset. Whatever the repercussions, I get the sense that you (who love that relationship now) aren't going to be happy :/

#65 Posted by V_Scarlotte_Rose (6286 posts) - - Show Bio

@akbogert: It is worrying, and it does seem quite possible that I could be unhappy with the outcome. Just hoping for the best.

#66 Posted by akbogert (3222 posts) - - Show Bio

@v_scarlotte_rose: way Marvel's treated me and the characters I love lately, I've resolved myself to pessimism. But by all means I'd love to see this turn out in a way which pleases all Carol fans, old and new,

#67 Posted by V_Scarlotte_Rose (6286 posts) - - Show Bio

@akbogert: If it is something negative, it'll at least be interesting to see how characters deal with it. If Carol and Jessica stop being friends, they can always make it up later, and it's not like we've been seeing loads of interaction between them recently. I'd be unhappy, but I could live with it, and hope it can be resolved soon. :)

I don't think of how Marvel's treating me. Instead of on the company in general, I tend to focus my liking or disliking on the creative teams of individual titles, so my enjoyment of Captain Marvel and Avengers Assemble makes me feel O.K. about the future of both.

#68 Edited by Havokx (6 posts) - - Show Bio
#69 Posted by Aiden Cross (15569 posts) - - Show Bio

I really like the idea of her having a real arch nemesis :)

#70 Posted by darthfury78 (844 posts) - - Show Bio

@akbogert:

If it is something negative, it'll at least be interesting to see how characters deal with it. If Carol and Jessica stop being friends, they can always make it up later, and it's not like we've been seeing loads of interaction between them recently. I'd be unhappy, but I could live with it, and hope it can be resolved soon. :)

I don't think of how Marvel's treating me. Instead of on the company in general, I tend to focus my liking or disliking on the creative teams of individual titles, so my enjoyment of Captain Marvel and Avengers Assemble makes me feel O.K. about the future of both.

I doubt that anything will happen to Jessica and Carol's friendship. But they do share one thing in common: Peter Parker.

#71 Edited by V_Scarlotte_Rose (6286 posts) - - Show Bio

@darthfury78: Do you think he'll be involved? It's just, he's not on any of the covers. I suppose he could be in there somewhere.

@aiden_cross:

Yeah, it could be interesting to see what he's like nowadays. I only know him from old Mar-Vell Captain Marvel issues.

#72 Posted by MPScrimshaw13 (7 posts) - - Show Bio

@fadetoblackbolt: Yes, cancel this book that dares change the hallowed status quo and does the best thing wit hthe character we've seen in 20 years! Down With Change!

#73 Posted by MPScrimshaw13 (7 posts) - - Show Bio

On a completely different note, am I the only one that finds it really annoying that in all the other books (especially Avengers) Carol is being drawn with short, cropped hair like the artists never bothered to look past the covers of Captain Marvel?

#74 Edited by Soupnazi (32 posts) - - Show Bio

Since there's been talk here of the new art, here's a page from the four-page preview I saw today.

The full preview can be found here.

Personally, I like the art, though Carol's hair is on the ridiculous side and the proportions of the characters when viewed from afar is just... ugh. Really weird.

#75 Posted by BronzeAgeGuy (1 posts) - - Show Bio

I like Andrade's art. The style gives the book a bit of whimsical and also a emotional quality that Ms. Marvel has lacked for some time. Carol has a vulnerability and the art style echoes that. This isn't Thor or Hulk. Yet for some reason Ms. Marvel has been treated as an arrogant brawler for too long.Some people may hate that but I think it is needed badly. Jessica Drew is made compelling as well by this team.

#76 Posted by V_Scarlotte_Rose (6286 posts) - - Show Bio

@soupnazi: That's better, but it still looks a bit odd to me.

#77 Edited by Soupnazi (32 posts) - - Show Bio

Alright! The Enemy Within #1, first part of the crossover, releases tomorrow. With the low sales of Captain Marvel, this crossover is likely the last chance for the series, so if you're still on the fence NOW is the time to check out the series. On the other hand, if you want the series cancelled, now is the time to try to get people to stop reading! XD

For reference, since this is really confusing: The crossover has five parts, the order being:

  1. The Enemy Within #1
  2. Avengers Assemble #16
  3. Captain Marvel #13
  4. Avengers Assemble #17
  5. Captain Marvel #14

Happy reading!

EDIT: Ahaha! Just last month I said that Captain Marvel 12 was the time to check out the series. I am not very good at consistency.

#78 Edited by V_Scarlotte_Rose (6286 posts) - - Show Bio
#79 Posted by darthfury78 (844 posts) - - Show Bio

It ironic that Carol and Jessica can hang out together outside of the Avengers. Yet, Marvel will never allow Peter Parker to hangout with a female superhero like Carol or Jessica?

#80 Edited by V_Scarlotte_Rose (6286 posts) - - Show Bio
#81 Posted by darthfury78 (844 posts) - - Show Bio

@darthfury78: Why's that ironic?

Because it would be nice to see Spidey's costume relationship with a female superhero like Spider-Woman and Captain Marvel be extended outside of the avengers and into Peter's social cycles. This would also include the Black Widow and She-Hulk as well.

#82 Posted by V_Scarlotte_Rose (6286 posts) - - Show Bio

@darthfury78: I don't know if that's irony but I could be wrong.

Yeah, it is nice to see some interaction between them in everyday life. I think it happens with Carol and Jessica because they're good friends generally, probably best friends. Does Peter Parker have a best friend in the Avengers? I don't read Spider-Man solo comics so I don't know who he's close to.

#83 Edited by darthfury78 (844 posts) - - Show Bio

@v_scarlotte_rose said:

@darthfury78:

I don't know if that's irony but I could be wrong.

Yeah, it is nice to see some interaction between them in everyday life. I think it happens with Carol and Jessica because they're good friends generally, probably best friends. Does Peter Parker have a best friend in the Avengers? I don't read Spider-Man solo comics so I don't know who he's close to.

Actually, as far as super heroines goes, Carol Danvers and Jessica Drew are two of Peter's closest friends. Kelly Sue wanted to use Peter Parker in Carol's world. But because of Superior Spider-Man, she could not. As well as the fact that Dan Slott opposes the idea of Peter Parker having a relationship with a super heroine. Here is what Dan Slott had to say:

------------------------------------------------------

Darthfury78,

I know it's a favorite subject of yours. But, honestly, Peter Parker hooking up w/ a super hero just isn't going to happen-- same for a character that's deeply entrenched in another book/universe/dimension's continuity. The main reasons are (though I know you don't agree...)

1. It takes something out of the soap opera column of Peter Parker's life-- and puts it onto the Spider-Man side.

Part of the fun of a monthly Spider-Man title is watching the juxtaposition of Peter's normal life and his Spider-Man life. If you borrow such a big piece from the Peter-side and place it on the Spidey-side, you really don't leave that much for Peter to do.

2. It makes Spidey's super hero life a little easier too-- by having such easy, quick access to another hero.

3. Other continuities/dimensions/titles having such a large effect on Peter Parker's personal life is, at times, a little to "inside baseball" and intimidating to both new readers and fans who JUST want to read about Spidey in his own book.

While a super villain/super hero romance might be a fun shake up in the short term-- trust me-- you are NOT going to see a relationship like that happening as an ongoing status quo.

--------------------------------------------------------

I personally think that Dan opposed to the idea of Peter hanging with a super heroine is because it would have undermine his plans for Superior Spider-Man. I see other heroes like Hawkeye hang out with super heroines outside the Avengers. Yet Peter can't have that? Kelly Sue was able to create a personal interaction between Carol and Peter, as well as Bendis doing the same with Peter and Jessica. Yet, we can't see any other heroines having a mutual friendship with Peter Parker besides Felicia Hardy or Mary Jane? Oh yeah, Felicia no longer knows that Spider-Man was Peter Parker. I believe that they were plans to further develop Carol's relationship with Peter Parker. But that idea got shot down the moment when Dan Slott because full time writer of Spider-Man. Might as well because if he was writing that part of the story, it would not be very good at all. Besides, Slott managed to get rid of Peter Parker and replaced his mind with Dr. Octavian who is now the Superior Spider-Man.

#84 Edited by V_Scarlotte_Rose (6286 posts) - - Show Bio

@darthfury78: Yeah, I knew he was close with them both. I was just wondering if there was someone else closer.

I'd rather not see Carol get into a romantic relationship with Peter. Spider-Man's such a big name, and I'd worry that she'd end up just being called 'Spider-Mans Girlfriend', like people were calling Wonder Woman 'Supermans Girlfriend'. Better to keep her out of someone elses spotlight I think.

#85 Edited by darthfury78 (844 posts) - - Show Bio

@v_scarlotte_rose said:

@darthfury78:

Yeah, I knew he was close with them both. I was just wondering if there was someone else closer.

I'd rather not see Carol get into a romantic relationship with Peter. Spider-Man's such a big name, and I'd worry that she'd end up just being called 'Spider-Mans Girlfriend', like people were calling Wonder Woman 'Supermans Girlfriend'. Better to keep her out of someone elses spotlight I think.

I never said anything about Carol being Peter's girlfriend. This is a reason why I felt that having a list of 6 heroines(excluding the Black Cat) who have feelings for Peter should include

Silver Sable

Spider-Woman

Black Widow

Psylocke

She-Hulk

Ms. Marvel

I feel that the list of the six heroines I have mentioned would make it impossible for any one of them to standout as Peter's potential girlfriend. It would provide a writer to use any one of them as an alternate to the Black Cat as Spider-Man's ally in a guest spot. And it would give a Spider-Man writer a choice. This way, if the writer isn't interested with using the Black Cat, he could pick any one of the following heroines to use since most writers have at least one favorite heroine from the list I created to use for Spider-Man. And just because the super heroine has feelings for Peter Parker, doesn't mean it has to become a romantic relationship in the Earth-616 realm. But a strong long term friendship with Peter in the same manner as Mary Jane, Betty Brant, and Carol Danvers would work out best among the writers involved. Each one provides a different diverse background into Peter Parkers world. Besides, if Peter can be close friends with Wolverine, Captain America, and Human Torch, why can't Peter be close friends with Spider-Woman and Black Widow outside of the Avengers, for example?

#86 Posted by V_Scarlotte_Rose (6286 posts) - - Show Bio

@darthfury78: Oh yeah, hanging around with female heroes as friends would be a great idea. It's nice seeing heroes as friends. I just brought up the relationship thing as I've seen quite a few people mention the possibility of it, and the fact that someone was apparently planning on writing it.

#87 Edited by Ultra_beleco (184 posts) - - Show Bio

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