Ms. Marvel Misstep?

#1 Edited by DMC (1551 posts) - - Show Bio

I just read Brain Andersons' review of Ms Marvel #44. It's not so much a review but more his feelings about the character and the book itself. I know it's a long read but I felt it was important to include everything, sorry guys.  I'll highlight the important stuff
 

 Dear Ms. Marvel,


You know that I love ya, girl. Right? I mean, how can any self respecting fanboy/girl worth his/her mylar bag not have a soft spot for you? You’re the ultimate survivor! You’ve had two solo starring series, been a member of the Avengers, an unofficial part of the X-Men, had various different power sets, numerous code names,  got pregnant by your otherworldly boyfriend and than gave birth to the same otherworldly boyfriend (something you, nor your writers/editors talk about much) and had your entire identity and powers stolen. What a storied life. Yet somehow, despite all the odds, you’re still here, still fighting for relevance. If you ask me, that’s something to be admired.
So let me get to the point of this letter. It concerns your latest adventure, 

Ms. Marvel #44

The whole “War of the Marvels” multi-part, mega-story pitting you (I think?) against the current usurper of your Ms. Marvel title - the villain formerly knows as Moonstone. Honestly, I don’t much care for the Moonstone-y Ms. Marvel, and, I hate to say, I have a very difficult time finding the energy to care about you nowadays. Despite my earlier assurance that I love you and your character, the honest truth is, I don’t much like you. I love you but I’m not in love with you. I love the concept of you but not so much the current execution of who you are in your current book. And I really and truly want to love your book. I want nothing more than to see you, and it, succeed. To do something few (none?) Marvel heroines have accomplished - big time sales success. Alas, I don’t see top selling status in the cards for you with this issue.

Here’s why:  I have no idea what the frack is going on. And I have read every issue of your book and frankly I’m not sure that I care to know. From what I’ve gathered there’s now two versions of you, one superpowered and one, boringly, not. So after you supposedly died a few issues back - which was met with zero response from the Marvel readers (which I think speaks volumes about the status of your current book) - you came back split into two separate beings? A heroically crazy version and a mild-mannered writer? I get it that having these various versions of you running around is supposed to be all mysterious and stuff, the storyline is supposed to be filled with oodles of twists and turns and intrigue, but all I find myself thinking is – blah. This book should be a nail-biter, there are lots of great elements in it; like a sociopathic co-star, all those Dark Avengers running around (to help sell books), the whole Dark Reign emblem on your front cover (to boost sales); so on paper it all sounds totally fab! But in reality everything just falls flat.

For me it’s the lack of characterization. Who is Carol Danvers anymore? Why should I still love you much as I used too? Where’s the spice and the excitement in your character that I used to enjoy so much?  Your book has bounced around from one Marvel event to the next, with subplots getting tossed to the wayside along the way, leaving me feeling confused and empty. There’s no emotional weight to your stories anymore. It’s just “Charge” all the time. Charge headlong into the fray here, spring boarding from one event story arch to the next there, with no time sit back and develop your character. I want to know more about you. Not the Ms. Marvel side but the beautiful, confident, person behind the mask. Peter Parker is a much-loved character because the readers get to know him outside his Spider-Man costume. We care because he has a supporting cast we get to know and love, he has a job, he has romantic problems, money problems, he’s identifiably human. Peter Parker is someone people can relate too. Ms. Marvel? Not so much. I don’t know anything about your personal life anymore. I just see the empty, endless, hero battles, and I get none of the nutritional interpersonal stories I so crave and depend on to keep me interested in you and your book.

So please, Ms. Marvel, Carol, or whatever your two selves wants to call themselves, please take the time to develop who you are. The non-super-sash side of you. That is something I want to read about. That is something that will help rekindle my dying love. After all, great solo books have a rich supporting cast; they have terrific quite moments, everyday human interactions, everyday trails and tribulations, on top of their cosmic battles and costume adventures. I believe in you, girl. You haven’t come this far to fail now! So get it together!

Yours truly,
Brian Andersen
 
 
In terms of characterization and back story, Ms Marvel #31 & #32, are the best if not the only issues... of those I've read anyway.  Ms Marvel #47 does look promising. 
#2 Posted by pixelized (62882 posts) - - Show Bio

Brian Reed can't write Moonstone, i'd be surprised if anyone liked her after his run.

#3 Edited by Vance Astro (91291 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't blame Brian Reed.I blame Quesada for people having to keep characters within Bendis's parameters.Reed anything Ms.Marvel before Secret Invasion and it's magic.It's these damn events.

Moderator
#4 Posted by pixelized (62882 posts) - - Show Bio
@Vance Astro said:
" I don't blame Brian Reed.I blame Quesada for people having to keep characters within Bendis's parameters.Reed anything Ms.Marvel before Secret Invasion and it's magic.It's these damn events. "
i just blame him for his slaughtering of Karla's personality. Scheming, Condescending, and Manipulative, that's all.
#5 Posted by Drafta (690 posts) - - Show Bio
@pixelized: God.  I know.  I love Moonstone so much,  but this run of her is just crud.
#6 Posted by DMC (1551 posts) - - Show Bio
@Drafta said:
" @pixelized: God.  I know.  I love Moonstone so much,  but this run of her is just crud. "
I was hoping Moonstone's run in the Ms Marvel book would be rooted in what we saw in Dark Avengers #1 when we saw a Karla who looked genuinely glad to be an Avenger. Moonstones first issue, #38 (I believe) was good, it was all about her.
#7 Posted by xerox_kitty (15762 posts) - - Show Bio

I was tempted to pick up Ms Marvel, but now I'm glad I didn't... It sounds pretty bad.

#8 Posted by Drafta (690 posts) - - Show Bio
@DMC: Yeah, #38 was pretty good.
#9 Posted by CATMANEXE (17052 posts) - - Show Bio
@Vance Astro said:
" I don't blame Brian Reed.I blame Quesada for people having to keep characters within Bendis's parameters.Reed anything Ms.Marvel before Secret Invasion and it's magic.It's these damn events. "
isnt that the truth. by almost Dark Reign when it was announced the would be a new Ms.Marvel soon, i sadly relished that fact because the book was putting me to sleep as it was.
#10 Posted by DMC (1551 posts) - - Show Bio
@xerox-kitty said:
"

I was tempted to pick up Ms Marvel, but now I'm glad I didn't... It sounds pretty bad.

"
Maybe not now but I do recommend Ms Marvel #47, I'm buying this one.  
 

Ms Marvel #47
 
THE STORY:
The War of The Marvels is over, but before Carol Danvers can deal with it’s aftermath, she must brace herself as she faces down the biggest mistake she made before her apparent death…promising Spider-Man she’d go out with him. Brian Reed teams with Mark Robinson (SKRULL KILL KREW) to bring you THE AMAZING SPIDER-DATE! Rated T
 
  November 25, 2009 
 
#11 Posted by pixelized (62882 posts) - - Show Bio

you're recommending a book based off the solicit????
 
interesting.

#12 Edited by Vance Astro (91291 posts) - - Show Bio
@pixelized said:

" @Vance Astro said:

" I don't blame Brian Reed.I blame Quesada for people having to keep characters within Bendis's parameters.Reed anything Ms.Marvel before Secret Invasion and it's magic.It's these damn events. "
i just blame him for his slaughtering of Karla's personality. Scheming, Condescending, and Manipulative, that's all. "
Well that's kind of how she came across to me in Warren Ellis's Thunderbolts.Hiding Osborn's meds,ordering the Thunderbolts to half kill the heroes they were hunting.I don't too much give a crap about Karla anyway but it's possible Reed just doesn't know what to do with her being that his comic has to tie-in with some bullsh#t Bendis is writing.Reed's Ms.Marvel was good until SI.The beginning portion and the conclusion was garbage and the tie-in with Spider-Man was a complete waste of money and did nothing for the progression of the story.
Moderator
#13 Posted by pixelized (62882 posts) - - Show Bio
@Vance Astro said:
" @pixelized said:

" @Vance Astro said:

" I don't blame Brian Reed.I blame Quesada for people having to keep characters within Bendis's parameters.Reed anything Ms.Marvel before Secret Invasion and it's magic.It's these damn events. "
i just blame him for his slaughtering of Karla's personality. Scheming, Condescending, and Manipulative, that's all. "
Well that's kind of how she came across to me in Warren Ellis's Thunderbolts.Hiding Osborn's meds,ordering the Thunderbolts to half kill the heroes they were hunting.I don't too much give a crap about Karla anyway but it's possible Reed just doesn't know what to do with her being that his comic has to tie-in with some bullsh#t Bendis is writing.Reed's Ms.Marvel was good until SI.The beginning portion and the conclusion was garbage and the tie-in with Spider-Man was a complete waste of money and did nothing for the progression of the story. "
How Karla progresses is one thing, but all he hasn't portrayed her personality properly. I could pull 3 lines from three different character and have you guess who said what, and you wouldn't know which was said by Karla because she's written as someone who is just there. It's like she's filler until DR is over. I understand he may not like her, he may not want to write her, but he's washed her of all identifiable character traits.
#14 Posted by DMC (1551 posts) - - Show Bio
@pixelized said:
" you're recommending a book based off the solicit????  interesting. "
 
Two reasons.
 
1) She made the deal with Spidey waaay back before Dark Reign started and I know I'm not the only one who wanted to see that date.
 
2) This is the first issue that's a break from the "Charge" Brian Anderson was talking about in his review. At least we get to see her take some personal time. if anything it's worth looking at. I'll write a review.
#15 Posted by pixelized (62882 posts) - - Show Bio

it still could be written horribly.

#16 Posted by Vance Astro (91291 posts) - - Show Bio
@pixelized said:
How Karla progresses is one thing, but all he hasn't portrayed her personality properly. I could pull 3 lines from three different character and have you guess who said what, and you wouldn't know which was said by Karla because she's written as someone who is just there. It's like she's filler until DR is over. I understand he may not like her, he may not want to write her, but he's washed her of all identifiable character traits. "
Carol was filler until SI was over so why would you be surprised that her replacement isn't doing anything of substance? She's pretending to be someone she's not.It's also very possible that Reed is trying to say..that doesn't work.Bullseye and Venom haven't really been Bullseye and Venom in their books either.
Moderator
#17 Posted by pixelized (62882 posts) - - Show Bio
@Vance Astro said:
" @pixelized said:
How Karla progresses is one thing, but all he hasn't portrayed her personality properly. I could pull 3 lines from three different character and have you guess who said what, and you wouldn't know which was said by Karla because she's written as someone who is just there. It's like she's filler until DR is over. I understand he may not like her, he may not want to write her, but he's washed her of all identifiable character traits. "
Carol was filler until SI was over so why would you be surprised that her replacement isn't doing anything of substance? She's pretending to be someone she's not.It's also very possible that Reed is trying to say..that doesn't work.Bullseye and Venom haven't really been Bullseye and Venom in their books either. "
i don't care about her progression though, i just want her to have live again. I'll read 50 pages of her watching the simpson's as long as she has some good one liners to go with it. Brian Reed's Moonstone puts me to sleep.
#18 Posted by Vance Astro (91291 posts) - - Show Bio
@pixelized said:
" @Vance Astro said:
" @pixelized said:
How Karla progresses is one thing, but all he hasn't portrayed her personality properly. I could pull 3 lines from three different character and have you guess who said what, and you wouldn't know which was said by Karla because she's written as someone who is just there. It's like she's filler until DR is over. I understand he may not like her, he may not want to write her, but he's washed her of all identifiable character traits. "
Carol was filler until SI was over so why would you be surprised that her replacement isn't doing anything of substance? She's pretending to be someone she's not.It's also very possible that Reed is trying to say..that doesn't work.Bullseye and Venom haven't really been Bullseye and Venom in their books either. "
i don't care about her progression though, i just want her to have live again. I'll read 50 pages of her watching the simpson's as long as she has some good one liners to go with it. Brian Reed's Moonstone puts me to sleep. "
I wouldn't know.I've only read the first Moonstone issue..
Moderator
#19 Posted by Nova`Prime` (4165 posts) - - Show Bio

Its obvious Reed doesn't like writing Moonstone. But the biggest problem with the title is the fact that they were squeezing in two characters of the same name, and now there is technically three of them. How can you progress the character any if you're writing for three seperate characters, yet they seem to all be similiar. I'll be happy with the Ms. Marvel title once Moonstone is out and Carol is back to being Carol again.
 
Hopefully it jumps up when that happens, if not it'll be another title that gets dumped.

#20 Posted by Vance Astro (91291 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nova`Prime` said:
" Its obvious Reed doesn't like writing Moonstone. But the biggest problem with the title is the fact that they were squeezing in two characters of the same name, and now there is technically three of them. How can you progress the character any if you're writing for three seperate characters, yet they seem to all be similiar. I'll be happy with the Ms. Marvel title once Moonstone is out and Carol is back to being Carol again.  Hopefully it jumps up when that happens, if not it'll be another title that gets dumped. "
Agreed.
Moderator
#21 Posted by pixelized (62882 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nova`Prime` said:
" Its obvious Reed doesn't like writing Moonstone. But the biggest problem with the title is the fact that they were squeezing in two characters of the same name, and now there is technically three of them. How can you progress the character any if you're writing for three seperate characters, yet they seem to all be similiar. I'll be happy with the Ms. Marvel title once Moonstone is out and Carol is back to being Carol again.  Hopefully it jumps up when that happens, if not it'll be another title that gets dumped. "
But Carol and Catherine seems like a character progression. That side of things should wrap nicely.  Moonstone is her own entity with her own personality, how that can throw someone off their game is beyond me. It's like writing Emma Frost and Rogue and making them behave the same way. It's Wack.
#22 Posted by Nova`Prime` (4165 posts) - - Show Bio
@pixelized: Oh I agree the Carol Catherine angle is a good show for character progression. The problem he is having, that I see, is having to work with Bendis with Moonstone. Bendis writes her horribly in Dark Avengers, so Reed isn't going to show him up in the Ms. Marvel title. Moonstone is a character with alot of unrealized potential, but she'll never get it with Bendis, and Reed just doesn't want to do it.

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