Do the Avengers really take care of their own?

#1 Posted by War Killer (20213 posts) - - Show Bio

“She is an Avenger. We take care of our own.”


Captain America #619
Thor said this in Avengers #12.1 when Spider-Woman went missing. Now this statement sounded cool and to me would be something Thor would say. But today on my way home from the comic book store, I started thinking about what Thor said while reading Captain America #618. (Now heads up, this may contain minor spoilers from the issue) but what Thor said and how the Avengers reacted to this along with what’s happening to Bucky right now got me wondering: Do the Avengers really “take care of their own”? The reason I was wondering about this is because when Spider-Woman went missing, Steve Rogers assembled ALL THREE Avengers teams to find her, gathering the best members from each team who would be best suited for the task and in the end they were able to track her down and rescue her. But what I’m wondering is, if the Avengers really do take care of their own, why aren’t they doing more to help Bucky? The man is/was Captain America and an Avenger, not only fighting alongside the team in saving the world during Avengers/Invaders, but helped save the world during Secret Invasion, fought alongside the New Avengers during Norman Osborn’s Dark Reign, fought in defending Asgard during Siege, and helped save the whole of reality from Kang the Conqueror. If that doesn’t make you an Avenger, I don’t know what would.

But as I was reading Captain America #618, I noticed the interaction between Black Widow and Sharon Carter and how the two treated the situation that Bucky is in currently. From how it went, Black Widow was stopping at nothing to prove the man she loves’ innocence, but Sharon on the other hand seemed to care more about Steve getting in trouble than clearing Bucky’s name. The whole time Bucky’s been in prison it seems that the only people who have cared about him are Black Widow and Steve.

Now I understand that some Avengers may feel different about Bucky, we saw how Hawkeye felt during the Trail of Captain America. But the man was cleared for his crimes in America and was going to be let free, it was right then that the Russian government showed up claiming that Bucky had killed two innocent Russian citizens years ago and he was then extradited back to Russian, leaving Steve with no way to help his former partner. Now if you’ve been reading the recent issues of Captain America, we know that Bucky was somehow set up by the Russian government and is being held in prison for darker reasons than the they wanted Steve or anyone to know about. But my point is, if the Avengers supposedly take care of their own, where are they when Bucky, their former teammate and friend, needs them the most?

I mean when Spider-Woman went missing, Steve Rogers assembled ALL of the Avengers to find her, gathering those best for the job. But what I don’t understand is why aren’t any other Avengers trying to help clear Bucky’s name? Steve and Black Widow have proof that there’s more going on with all of this than what’s being said, but if what Thor said is true, then why aren’t teams like the Secret Avengers being brought in to help Steve and Widow work faster to get down to the bottom of what the Russians really want with Bucky and bringing their teammate home? I mean even Falcon, who was his partner, doesn’t even seem to care and hasn’t even tried to help Steve or Natasha in their search at all.

If the Avengers truly do take care of their own, then why aren’t they doing more to help clear Bucky’s name?

#2 Posted by iLLituracy (13537 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't think it's the same situation. Spider-Woman was abducted and being held against her will. While it's similar with Bucky, it's not exactly the same seeing as there's red tape. There's not really anything they can do, IMO.

#3 Posted by Primmaster64 (21138 posts) - - Show Bio

Man..poor Bucky.

#4 Posted by War Killer (20213 posts) - - Show Bio
@Dean.:
@iLLituracy:

Yes and that's what I figured as well. But when I saw Black Widow's reaction and seeing how far she's willing to go to clear his name, I just couldn't help but think of what Thor said. I mean this is Thor, the guy wouldn't care about "red tape", and you'd think when Black Widow and Steve bring up that they have PROOF that something is up with all of this, people like Wolverine, Hawkeye, and Iron Man wouldn't give a crap about red tape. Not to mention Steve has a covert team for situations just like this, so why aren't we seeing them helping to uncover what's really going down, I mean wouldn't things work faster with characters like Ant-Man sneaking into secret government facilities, stealing information and old documents or having someone like Beast working to hack into Russian servers to dig up more info?

I mean the Avengers haven't even mentioned Bucky, he just vanished and freakin' Red Hulk took his slot on the team. It just seems like the Avengers don't eve care that their teammate is being held for something he obviously didn't do.
#5 Posted by iLLituracy (13537 posts) - - Show Bio

  @War Killer: I'm pretty sure that's not the case, and if Steve wanted the Avengers to take action then Steve would have made the call.

From an editorial and writer's standpoint, it would be iffy to have Bendis write a comment in Avengers from one of the characters about something that's happening in the Captain America title. Those things don't usually cross over into other titles for a while even if Bucky's been off the team for a whole arc. There's also the whole "this is a Captain America book" thing, at a certain point you have to look at it that way, I think Brubaker wants to leave the Avengers teams out of it because they simply don't fit into this story.

Now, from an in-universe standpoint, while Thor did say that the Avengers watch out for one another, they're not always in one another's affairs. Natasha and Bucky are closer than anyone on the Avengers could be closer to Bucky, Agent 13 is acting for Steve's benefit and Steve feels like Bucky is his responsibility. The rest of the Avengers don't have those types of relationships with Bucky, and despite the Avengers vowing to take care of one another they really only do so when it comes to doing it as a team, and I simply don't see that team meeting going down or ever ending with "yeah, f*ck Russia, they're sheisty, lets go get our guy."

What is Thor supposed to do? Descend on Russia? Spit on them and snatch Bucky from their clutches? That's not how it goes down. The Avengers may be a group of superheroes and a fraternity of do-gooders but I don't think that's a line that they're going to cross. At least the current Avengers. Black Widow and Sharon Carter? That's a different story, that's what they do, they're espionage through and through, but to tack the banner of "The Avengers" on a push to get Bucky freed from the Russians is borderline abuse of power and hypocrisy.

As far as mention, I'm sure it'll come soon if Bendis feels like mentioning it. Then again he has a thing where he doesn't really acknowledge what he's not directly involved with, so it may not. And even then it may be a passing remark that'll lead nowhere like he did post-Secret Invasion when it came to Echo.

#6 Posted by War Killer (20213 posts) - - Show Bio
@iLLituracy: First off I'm not saying that the Avengers should go in throwing around lightning and Repulsors, I understand the whole red tape issue what I meant by that is those guys would be the one that you'd think wouldn't be worried about stepping on toes to get their buddy back. But my point of this is that I just find it funny how Steve isn't trying harder to get to the bottom of this, you'd think he'd cover more ground in uncovering what's really going on with the Secret Avengers aiding him, Black Widow, and Sharon in their search because if I'm not mistaken, this is the kind of thing that characters like Ant-Man and Beast would come in handy with.

Also I do find it funny how Steve has no idea what's going on with Bucky and what kind of crap the Russians are putting him through, there was mention that Iron Man and Ms. Marvel would be checking on him every now and then, but you'd think he'd at least have Falcon or one of the Avengers going undercover there watching his back so that he doesn't get killed before Steve can find a way to free him.

And how is that hypocrisy? Aren't the Avengers supposed to be "avenging" the wrongs caused by villains? Like I said before, I'm not saying they should go in guns a'blazing. You'd just think that if this were Steve, or Hawkeye, or Iron Man we were talking about, they'd be getting ALL of the Avengers or at least some of them to help in freeing their friend and teammate. Which is what Bucky is, no matter how long he was an Avenger, the guys a war hero, fought along side the Invaders, and has helped save the world multiple times along side his fellow Avengers. He's grown close to characters like Stark and Hawkeye, not to mention his history with Wolverine. To me is just felt like no one really gave a crap that Bucky's literally rotting in prison and no one is trying to help free him.

I can understand Bendis not having to, but I mean it was just seemed random that Bucky's there one moment and then poof! He's gone and no one even cares, I mean there have been times we're Clint or Spidey will ask where Wolverine is and someone will just say he left for California, why is it so hard to mention why Bucky's not there....not to mention that even though he isn't there, they still counted him a member in the point-one issue of Avengers which didn't make sense at all.
#7 Posted by Shadow_Thief (2509 posts) - - Show Bio

This isn't the first time the Avenger's have seemingly let down one of their own. Back when Ms. Marvel was taken to another dimension by her mind-controlling date rapist "son," they just kind of stood around, shrugging.

#8 Posted by Kairan1979 (16751 posts) - - Show Bio
@War Killer:
after the Civil War the formula "Avengers take care of their own"  is absolete.
#9 Posted by SC (13120 posts) - - Show Bio

They were probably whispering behind Thor's back that thats not how they do things at all... then again, last time Thor tried to take care of another Avenger he zapped him with lightening *grin* and before that, it took a drunk Hercules, to tell all the Avengers at a funeral they were <insert a Greek Swear word> for not recognizing and realizing that Thor had died. Then there is Sentry... and Wanda... and D-Man... 


lol, I think you raise a great point. To be honest, I think its more creative decision aimed to make Bucky's arc more dramatic and suspenseful. Sort of as you and others have already discussed. I am more of an Avengers reader though, so I look at it from that perspective and wishes they all well keener to help out each other and ex Avengers when their chips are down. I think there are other sources of drama to be found, then again, I am an old school X-Men fan, I dig when heroes do stuff like play B-Ball. I don't really like Bendis I have enjoy many of his issues when used sparsely where Avengers just hang and talk stuff over (except usually thats played more for lulz than any long term development or character relationship building) 

Cool thread! 
Moderator
#10 Posted by Nova`Prime` (4165 posts) - - Show Bio

I wish I could remember the issue off hand, but Cap is discussing the Bucky issue and he said something like normally he would swoop in with the Avengers and get him out of that prison. But considering his new position and the Avengers, to a lesser extent, being part of the US Government he doesn't want to start an international incident. So from what I took from that issue is that he's willing to let diplomacy and law take their due course, but if anything shady goes down he'll be all over. I don't think the Avengers are leaving Bucky to dangle in the breeze, but he was legally arrested, where SpiderWoman was abducted.

#11 Edited by Kairan1979 (16751 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nova`Prime`:
what's the point of Secret Avengers if they can't handle this without causing international incident?
#12 Posted by Jake Fury (18670 posts) - - Show Bio

Bucky is in prison? Sweet Christmas come early!
#13 Posted by Nova`Prime` (4165 posts) - - Show Bio
@Kairan1979 said:
@Nova`Prime`: what's the point of Secret Avengers if they can't handle this without causing international incident?
I didn't say I had the right answer I just said that's what they made it imply.
#14 Posted by War Killer (20213 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nova`Prime` said:
I wish I could remember the issue off hand, but Cap is discussing the Bucky issue and he said something like normally he would swoop in with the Avengers and get him out of that prison. But considering his new position and the Avengers, to a lesser extent, being part of the US Government he doesn't want to start an international incident. So from what I took from that issue is that he's willing to let diplomacy and law take their due course, but if anything shady goes down he'll be all over. I don't think the Avengers are leaving Bucky to dangle in the breeze, but he was legally arrested, where SpiderWoman was abducted.
You'd have to tell what issue that was in cause I don't remember Steve saying that.
 
But as for the other thing, I don't see much diplomacy when Bucky's literally being thrown into prison cage fights and almost killed, along with every sing;e prison part of some soviet secret group to either kill him or use him. And Steve already knows something "shady" is going down, he and Black Widow have learned that what Bucky has been arrested for was fishy and that he was framed for something he didn't do. You'd think what's they learned of that, Steve would at least bring in the Secret Avengers to help get down to the bottom of all this quicker. Not to mention that it's been mentioned that Iron Man and Ms. Marvel would check in on Bucky every once and while, but I would have thought Steve would have gotten someone like Falcon to go with Bucky to make sure he doesn't get killed before Steve can come to his aid.

@Kairan1979 said:
@Nova`Prime`: what's the point of Secret Avengers if they can't handle this without causing international incident?
I kinda have to agree with, it does seem kind of pointless to have a covert team that can't even handle something like this, I mean they'll fight on mars but can't find a way to free a fellow Avenger who has been wrongly imprisoned, what's up with that?
#15 Posted by CellphoneGirl (18855 posts) - - Show Bio

I wonder this when thinking about Wanda.

#16 Posted by Nova`Prime` (4165 posts) - - Show Bio
@War Killer: When I get home tomorrow I'll give you the issue number and scans if my scanner works.
#17 Posted by War Killer (20213 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nova`Prime` said:
@War Killer: When I get home tomorrow I'll give you the issue number and scans if my scanner works.
Cool. And just for the record, I didn't say I disagreed or that you were wrong; I just simply wanted know what issue in which that happened. :)
#18 Posted by Nova`Prime` (4165 posts) - - Show Bio
@War Killer said:
@Nova`Prime` said:
@War Killer: When I get home tomorrow I'll give you the issue number and scans if my scanner works.
Cool. And just for the record, I didn't say I disagreed or that you were wrong; I just simply wanted know what issue in which that happened. :)
No problem I hate not knowing the issue, I was looking through the Cap comics, but there are just to many.
#19 Posted by Midnight Monk (225 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm pretty all that those dead or simply missing Minority Avengers who aren't Luke Cage(though his days are numbered) can answer that one

This edit will also create new pages on Comic Vine for:

Beware, you are proposing to add brand new pages to the wiki along with your edits. Make sure this is what you intended. This will likely increase the time it takes for your changes to go live.

Comment and Save

Until you earn 1000 points all your submissions need to be vetted by other Comic Vine users. This process takes no more than a few hours and we'll send you an email once approved.