Blue Beetle: Old Vs. New

Posted by CircularLogic (282 posts) - - Show Bio

I, like many people, fell in love with the original volume of Jaime Reyes as the Blue Beetle. To me, it felt very similar to Robert Kirkman's Invincible, in that it was such a fun, almost optimistic series that just seemed in love with the very idea of being a superhero book, but all the while it was very much aware of the fact that it needed to have both conflict and drama to drive the story, and it definitely managed to pull it off. The setting and character dynamics were all fun and creative, and I really enjoyed following Jaime as he slowly came into his own as a hero. For me, the main theme behind the series was learning what it means to be a hero, even if you don't necessarily know what that means, and in some runs, such as the later arc where he has to confront the realities of illegal immigration, really sold that. It was a fantastic book, and it makes perfect sense to me why it became so beloved among comic fans.

That said, I really dislike the post-reboot volume, and I wish they just left the character as he was, because none of the changes really improve the story.

Now, there's plenty of little details to complain about when reading this volume. The spanglish gets annoying really fast, and I noticed that even when they're being translated, Tony Bedard still includes unnecessary spanish words and phrases as if to keep nudging us going "see? They're TOTALLY hispanic, honest", which really dehumanizes the characters, since it makes them all sound the same. I know Bedard is in fact hispanic himself, but that just makes it worse since he's going out of his way to make sure we understand their from mexico, instead of just letting natural interactions between characters reveal it as time goes on. I also hate the inclusion of the Flash Thompson-esque douchebag, and the rehashing of the "will they, won't they" between him and Brenda, especially since the last volume made it perfectly clear they won't. And that leads to the other most common complaint, the fact that everything we're reading is just kind of tedious to those familiar with the character, since it makes only the smallest of changes (how he got the scarab, the lack of Final Crisis in the story) to the origin as a whole. Jaime had already had his battle with the reach, so everything we're seeing is just being unnecessarily redone, especially since the Reach haven't changed much at all from the last volume.

But the real problems I have with this story are the dramatic shift in tone from the last one, and the flat out unnecessary changes to his supporting cast, which are just terrible, in my opinion.

First of all, I don't really have any kind of feel for Jaime in the new 52. Like, at all. In the first arc of the original solo series, the issues were split between him appearing one year later after the crisis, with flashbacks establishing who he was and who his friends were, as well as his family dynamic. We saw how his parents were strict, but also compassionate. We saw him have interact with his friends, and all the while get his origin told, which helps us care for him as a person. The new volume just shoves us in, and while we get some information, it doesn't make us care about him. In the 5 issues I've read, I can't properly describe Jaime other than the Mexican kid with armor whose confused about his new powers. Really sounds exciting, doesn't he. When you look at something like Swamp Thing, as a counter-example, we had a good 7 issues setting up who Alec Holland is and the situations surrounding him, and only after that did he become the Swamp thing. Blue Beetle should have taken the necessary time to do this, or have it told in a better way than they did

But that's all stuff that can be built up later, even though it was desperately needed when he was introduced. What I really dislike more than anything are the changes done to his supporting cast. Paco, his boastful, strong best friend with gang ties just doesn't feel the same. In the original, the "gang" he joined was just a bunch of guys trying to protect their home territory. In this one, they're full on bangers, complete with guns and low riders. Instead of seeing almost noble, despite being a goof, he just becomes a dumb kid with dumb, dangerous friends, who toes the line between being uninteresting and unlikable.

Brenda and her aunt also loose the dynamic that made them interesting. La Dama might have been a "bad guy", but she was still an ally of the Blue Beetle, an unlikely partnership driven by the fact that Brenda didn't know her aunt was a mob boss, and she wanted it kept that way since despite her faults, she did love her niece and wanted a good life for her. In this one, it seems like no pretense has even been made that La Dama hides her identity from Brenda, especially since Jaime's parents are completely aware of the fact that she's a mob boss, and armed guards are perfectly visible at her place. La Dama just seems like a standard Kingpin-esque villain now, and making her the one responsible for Jaime's powers just makes her unlikable, and to me destroys most of her chances of being at least somewhat sympathetic to us.

As for the tone, even more of what made the Blue Beetle great was lost. It's just much darker, and shares the same mood that Teen Titans and Superboy, the other Teen books, have, and neither of those books are that good. It feels very generic now, missing the same joy the original had going for it. Jaime feels like a kiddy Venom, having to wrestle over control with the scarab, unlike in the other where it felt a bit like a buddy cop comedy, where Jaime just told the scarab he wasn't going to kill anybody, and we all just shook are heads with a chuckle going "oooohhh that wacky alien". The series focused on the two understanding each other and becoming partners, whereas in this one it seems like it's just going to be a battle of wills, seeing whose stronger, the scarab or Jaime, and that is just so played out it's not even funny.

And I know some might feel I'm being unfair comparing the two books after a reboot, especially since I've used that argument to defend certain titles. And it is true that the new Blue beetle title could very well stand on it's own. But the reason that Blue Beetle was given his own series was because the original was so well received, and DC wanted to try and get that same success while using the sales push the new 52 provided to give the book the readership it felt it deserved. That's why the origin story and setting is still fairly close, in a VERY broad sense of the word, to the original. It's not like Batman, where people complaining about shifts between writers is sometimes petty because of how many writers have gone through it over the years. This book exists because of the old one, so you can't look at the new without comparing them together, and because of this, it fails utterly.

Of course, this is all my take. Is their anyone that actually prefers the new to the old, or disagrees with some of the specifics I've pointed out? Feel free to give me your thoughts on this, I'll be glad to hear them.

#1 Posted by Superguy0009e (2259 posts) - - Show Bio

I agree that the first arc of BB wasnt the best, but first issue into the new one and I'm pulled in. For me (Spoiler warning)

the end where you see the guy with clocks piecing around his body and a kid turned into an old man makes a great hook to keep me on.

everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but think the book is bound to get better.

#2 Posted by CircularLogic (282 posts) - - Show Bio

@Superguy0009e: I got no doubt that once the series breaks from it's roots it'll get better, and most of the complaints haven't by any means ruined the book forever. I guess as long as the book goes on, there's the chance another writer who can handle the character better can take over, but part of me misses the wasted potential

#3 Posted by htb106 (1641 posts) - - Show Bio

I reckon youd still need to get a bit more time to experience more of dcnu jamie

#4 Posted by CircularLogic (282 posts) - - Show Bio

@htb106: 5 issues didn't make me care at all. not really the best track record, especially since the original got me in less than 2

#5 Posted by Jonny_Anonymous (27424 posts) - - Show Bio
@CircularLogic: I agree with everything you said, I'm all for the new and there isn't many changes in the DCnU that I don't like but this version of BB has completely turned me of from the character, it's lost all the charm that made me love the original series and now even though I'v read all the issues so far it just doesn't interest me any more. Also moving Jaime from El Paso to New York is just dumb considering the whole reason he was from that area is beacuse there is lit no heroes from there and now he's in New York just like every other hero   
#6 Posted by Rixec (341 posts) - - Show Bio

Blue Beetle is getting better so I say it's time to give it another chance. I find it as good as the old series but in different ways. Issue 9 is really gonna be good since he's fighting Kyle Rayner and then the New Guardians fight the Reach in issues 9 & 10 of Green Lantern: New Guardians.

@spiderbat87 said:

@CircularLogic: I agree with everything you said, I'm all for the new and there isn't many changes in the DCnU that I don't like but this version of BB has completely turned me of from the character, it's lost all the charm that made me love the original series and now even though I'v read all the issues so far it just doesn't interest me any more. Also moving Jaime from El Paso to New York is just dumb considering the whole reason he was from that area is beacuse there is lit no heroes from there and now he's in New York just like every other hero

Jaime's move to New York is temporary.

@CircularLogic said:

@htb106: 5 issues didn't make me care at all. not really the best track record, especially since the original got me in less than 2

Too bad you didn't read issue six; it was AMAZING with Paco being the Blood Beetle and the physical and emotional battles between them.

#7 Posted by Jonny_Anonymous (27424 posts) - - Show Bio
@Rixec said:

Blue Beetle is getting better so I say it's time to give it another chance. I find it as good as the old series but in different ways. Issue 9 is really gonna be good since he's fighting Kyle Rayner and then the New Guardians fight the Reach in issues 9 & 10 of Green Lantern: New Guardians.

@spiderbat87 said:

@CircularLogic: I agree with everything you said, I'm all for the new and there isn't many changes in the DCnU that I don't like but this version of BB has completely turned me of from the character, it's lost all the charm that made me love the original series and now even though I'v read all the issues so far it just doesn't interest me any more. Also moving Jaime from El Paso to New York is just dumb considering the whole reason he was from that area is beacuse there is lit no heroes from there and now he's in New York just like every other hero

Jaime's move to New York is temporary.

@CircularLogic said:

@htb106: 5 issues didn't make me care at all. not really the best track record, especially since the original got me in less than 2

Too bad you didn't read issue six; it was AMAZING with Paco being the Blood Beetle and the physical and emotional battles between them.

yea but the writer said it's be a long while before he'll be back in Texas as they want to put him in the larger world
#8 Posted by Rixec (341 posts) - - Show Bio

@spiderbat87 said:

@Rixec said:

Blue Beetle is getting better so I say it's time to give it another chance. I find it as good as the old series but in different ways. Issue 9 is really gonna be good since he's fighting Kyle Rayner and then the New Guardians fight the Reach in issues 9 & 10 of Green Lantern: New Guardians.

@spiderbat87 said:

@CircularLogic: I agree with everything you said, I'm all for the new and there isn't many changes in the DCnU that I don't like but this version of BB has completely turned me of from the character, it's lost all the charm that made me love the original series and now even though I'v read all the issues so far it just doesn't interest me any more. Also moving Jaime from El Paso to New York is just dumb considering the whole reason he was from that area is beacuse there is lit no heroes from there and now he's in New York just like every other hero

Jaime's move to New York is temporary.

@CircularLogic said:

@htb106: 5 issues didn't make me care at all. not really the best track record, especially since the original got me in less than 2

Too bad you didn't read issue six; it was AMAZING with Paco being the Blood Beetle and the physical and emotional battles between them.

yea but the writer said it's be a long while before he'll be back in Texas as they want to put him in the larger world

Exactly, the LARGER world. He's bound to go to a few other places - with heroes and without - and then head back to Texas once he's been established as a hero.

#9 Posted by Jonny_Anonymous (27424 posts) - - Show Bio
@Rixec said:

@spiderbat87 said:

@Rixec said:

Blue Beetle is getting better so I say it's time to give it another chance. I find it as good as the old series but in different ways. Issue 9 is really gonna be good since he's fighting Kyle Rayner and then the New Guardians fight the Reach in issues 9 & 10 of Green Lantern: New Guardians.

@spiderbat87 said:

@CircularLogic: I agree with everything you said, I'm all for the new and there isn't many changes in the DCnU that I don't like but this version of BB has completely turned me of from the character, it's lost all the charm that made me love the original series and now even though I'v read all the issues so far it just doesn't interest me any more. Also moving Jaime from El Paso to New York is just dumb considering the whole reason he was from that area is beacuse there is lit no heroes from there and now he's in New York just like every other hero

Jaime's move to New York is temporary.

@CircularLogic said:

@htb106: 5 issues didn't make me care at all. not really the best track record, especially since the original got me in less than 2

Too bad you didn't read issue six; it was AMAZING with Paco being the Blood Beetle and the physical and emotional battles between them.

yea but the writer said it's be a long while before he'll be back in Texas as they want to put him in the larger world

Exactly, the LARGER world. He's bound to go to a few other places - with heroes and without - and then head back to Texas once he's been established as a hero.

And that is a completely stupid idea 
#10 Posted by Rixec (341 posts) - - Show Bio

@spiderbat87 said:

@Rixec said:

@spiderbat87 said:

@Rixec said:

Blue Beetle is getting better so I say it's time to give it another chance. I find it as good as the old series but in different ways. Issue 9 is really gonna be good since he's fighting Kyle Rayner and then the New Guardians fight the Reach in issues 9 & 10 of Green Lantern: New Guardians.

@spiderbat87 said:

@CircularLogic: I agree with everything you said, I'm all for the new and there isn't many changes in the DCnU that I don't like but this version of BB has completely turned me of from the character, it's lost all the charm that made me love the original series and now even though I'v read all the issues so far it just doesn't interest me any more. Also moving Jaime from El Paso to New York is just dumb considering the whole reason he was from that area is beacuse there is lit no heroes from there and now he's in New York just like every other hero

Jaime's move to New York is temporary.

@CircularLogic said:

@htb106: 5 issues didn't make me care at all. not really the best track record, especially since the original got me in less than 2

Too bad you didn't read issue six; it was AMAZING with Paco being the Blood Beetle and the physical and emotional battles between them.

yea but the writer said it's be a long while before he'll be back in Texas as they want to put him in the larger world

Exactly, the LARGER world. He's bound to go to a few other places - with heroes and without - and then head back to Texas once he's been established as a hero.

And that is a completely stupid idea

If that's a stupid idea, then all comics are stupid because even the big league heroes have left their home grounds at some point. And because of this "stupid idea" we now get THIS:

It’s BLOOD BEETLE vs. BLUE BEETLE – with Jaime’s life and reputation as a hero on the line!

#11 Posted by Jonny_Anonymous (27424 posts) - - Show Bio
@Rixec said:

@spiderbat87 said:

@Rixec said:

@spiderbat87 said:

@Rixec said:

Blue Beetle is getting better so I say it's time to give it another chance. I find it as good as the old series but in different ways. Issue 9 is really gonna be good since he's fighting Kyle Rayner and then the New Guardians fight the Reach in issues 9 & 10 of Green Lantern: New Guardians.

@spiderbat87 said:

@CircularLogic: I agree with everything you said, I'm all for the new and there isn't many changes in the DCnU that I don't like but this version of BB has completely turned me of from the character, it's lost all the charm that made me love the original series and now even though I'v read all the issues so far it just doesn't interest me any more. Also moving Jaime from El Paso to New York is just dumb considering the whole reason he was from that area is beacuse there is lit no heroes from there and now he's in New York just like every other hero

Jaime's move to New York is temporary.

@CircularLogic said:

@htb106: 5 issues didn't make me care at all. not really the best track record, especially since the original got me in less than 2

Too bad you didn't read issue six; it was AMAZING with Paco being the Blood Beetle and the physical and emotional battles between them.

yea but the writer said it's be a long while before he'll be back in Texas as they want to put him in the larger world

Exactly, the LARGER world. He's bound to go to a few other places - with heroes and without - and then head back to Texas once he's been established as a hero.

And that is a completely stupid idea

If that's a stupid idea, then all comics are stupid because even the big league heroes have left their home grounds at some point. And because of this "stupid idea" we now get THIS:

It’s BLOOD BEETLE vs. BLUE BEETLE – with Jaime’s life and reputation as a hero on the line!

It's stupid because the idea should have been to bring the DCU in to Texas not for it to get completely ignored also this Blood Beetle crap is the worst thing to ever happen to the Blue Beetle series. What was once Jaimes strong and charming best friend is now a douche bag and a lame villain 
#12 Posted by Kallarkz (3303 posts) - - Show Bio

Im enjoying this series

#13 Posted by evilvegeta74 (4517 posts) - - Show Bio

Well I think Reyes utilizes the powers of the scarab better than the previous Beetle Kord1

#14 Posted by CircularLogic (282 posts) - - Show Bio

@evilvegeta74: Probably because Kord never used the Scarab

#15 Posted by CircularLogic (282 posts) - - Show Bio

@spiderbat87 said:

@Rixec said:

@spiderbat87 said:

@Rixec said:

@spiderbat87 said:

@Rixec said:

Blue Beetle is getting better so I say it's time to give it another chance. I find it as good as the old series but in different ways. Issue 9 is really gonna be good since he's fighting Kyle Rayner and then the New Guardians fight the Reach in issues 9 & 10 of Green Lantern: New Guardians.

@spiderbat87 said:

@CircularLogic: I agree with everything you said, I'm all for the new and there isn't many changes in the DCnU that I don't like but this version of BB has completely turned me of from the character, it's lost all the charm that made me love the original series and now even though I'v read all the issues so far it just doesn't interest me any more. Also moving Jaime from El Paso to New York is just dumb considering the whole reason he was from that area is beacuse there is lit no heroes from there and now he's in New York just like every other hero

Jaime's move to New York is temporary.

@CircularLogic said:

@htb106: 5 issues didn't make me care at all. not really the best track record, especially since the original got me in less than 2

Too bad you didn't read issue six; it was AMAZING with Paco being the Blood Beetle and the physical and emotional battles between them.

yea but the writer said it's be a long while before he'll be back in Texas as they want to put him in the larger world

Exactly, the LARGER world. He's bound to go to a few other places - with heroes and without - and then head back to Texas once he's been established as a hero.

And that is a completely stupid idea

If that's a stupid idea, then all comics are stupid because even the big league heroes have left their home grounds at some point. And because of this "stupid idea" we now get THIS:

It’s BLOOD BEETLE vs. BLUE BEETLE – with Jaime’s life and reputation as a hero on the line!

It's stupid because the idea should have been to bring the DCU in to Texas not for it to get completely ignored also this Blood Beetle crap is the worst thing to ever happen to the Blue Beetle series. What was once Jaimes strong and charming best friend is now a douche bag and a lame villain

Blood Beetle? Seriously? What kind of generic, ridiculous crap is this...

and the problem with going to New York is that the first arc didn't do anything at all to set up Jaime's situation other than retelling it slightly with more spanish and more generic supporting cast. Then, with absolutely nothing set up, he just runs off to New York, with no adequately explained reason for choosing that location. And if he does return to texas soon, that just makes the run even more pointless.

And having read the later issues since posting, I can say that Jaime is completely unlikable to me because he hasn't felt any guilt over slapping Brenda around and threatening his parents (sure, the scarab technically did that, but he should have felt something). All he did was complain about how people see him as a villain now. Great hero material.

It's just... not that good. especially not compared to the original.

#16 Posted by Jonny_Anonymous (27424 posts) - - Show Bio
@CircularLogic said:

@spiderbat87 said:

@Rixec said:

@spiderbat87 said:

@Rixec said:

@spiderbat87 said:

@Rixec said:

Blue Beetle is getting better so I say it's time to give it another chance. I find it as good as the old series but in different ways. Issue 9 is really gonna be good since he's fighting Kyle Rayner and then the New Guardians fight the Reach in issues 9 & 10 of Green Lantern: New Guardians.

@spiderbat87 said:

@CircularLogic: I agree with everything you said, I'm all for the new and there isn't many changes in the DCnU that I don't like but this version of BB has completely turned me of from the character, it's lost all the charm that made me love the original series and now even though I'v read all the issues so far it just doesn't interest me any more. Also moving Jaime from El Paso to New York is just dumb considering the whole reason he was from that area is beacuse there is lit no heroes from there and now he's in New York just like every other hero

Jaime's move to New York is temporary.

@CircularLogic said:

@htb106: 5 issues didn't make me care at all. not really the best track record, especially since the original got me in less than 2

Too bad you didn't read issue six; it was AMAZING with Paco being the Blood Beetle and the physical and emotional battles between them.

yea but the writer said it's be a long while before he'll be back in Texas as they want to put him in the larger world

Exactly, the LARGER world. He's bound to go to a few other places - with heroes and without - and then head back to Texas once he's been established as a hero.

And that is a completely stupid idea

If that's a stupid idea, then all comics are stupid because even the big league heroes have left their home grounds at some point. And because of this "stupid idea" we now get THIS:

It’s BLOOD BEETLE vs. BLUE BEETLE – with Jaime’s life and reputation as a hero on the line!

It's stupid because the idea should have been to bring the DCU in to Texas not for it to get completely ignored also this Blood Beetle crap is the worst thing to ever happen to the Blue Beetle series. What was once Jaimes strong and charming best friend is now a douche bag and a lame villain

Blood Beetle? Seriously? What kind of generic, ridiculous crap is this...

and the problem with going to New York is that the first arc didn't do anything at all to set up Jaime's situation other than retelling it slightly with more spanish and more generic supporting cast. Then, with absolutely nothing set up, he just runs off to New York, with no adequately explained reason for choosing that location. And if he does return to texas soon, that just makes the run even more pointless.

And having read the later issues since posting, I can say that Jaime is completely unlikable to me because he hasn't felt any guilt over slapping Brenda around and threatening his parents (sure, the scarab technically did that, but he should have felt something). All he did was complain about how people see him as a villain now. Great hero material.

It's just... not that good. especially not compared to the original.

yip, all this
#17 Posted by Rixec (341 posts) - - Show Bio

@CircularLogic said:

@spiderbat87 said:

@Rixec said:

@spiderbat87 said:

@Rixec said:

@spiderbat87 said:

@Rixec said:

Blue Beetle is getting better so I say it's time to give it another chance. I find it as good as the old series but in different ways. Issue 9 is really gonna be good since he's fighting Kyle Rayner and then the New Guardians fight the Reach in issues 9 & 10 of Green Lantern: New Guardians.

@spiderbat87 said:

@CircularLogic: I agree with everything you said, I'm all for the new and there isn't many changes in the DCnU that I don't like but this version of BB has completely turned me of from the character, it's lost all the charm that made me love the original series and now even though I'v read all the issues so far it just doesn't interest me any more. Also moving Jaime from El Paso to New York is just dumb considering the whole reason he was from that area is beacuse there is lit no heroes from there and now he's in New York just like every other hero

Jaime's move to New York is temporary.

@CircularLogic said:

@htb106: 5 issues didn't make me care at all. not really the best track record, especially since the original got me in less than 2

Too bad you didn't read issue six; it was AMAZING with Paco being the Blood Beetle and the physical and emotional battles between them.

yea but the writer said it's be a long while before he'll be back in Texas as they want to put him in the larger world

Exactly, the LARGER world. He's bound to go to a few other places - with heroes and without - and then head back to Texas once he's been established as a hero.

And that is a completely stupid idea

If that's a stupid idea, then all comics are stupid because even the big league heroes have left their home grounds at some point. And because of this "stupid idea" we now get THIS:

It’s BLOOD BEETLE vs. BLUE BEETLE – with Jaime’s life and reputation as a hero on the line!

It's stupid because the idea should have been to bring the DCU in to Texas not for it to get completely ignored also this Blood Beetle crap is the worst thing to ever happen to the Blue Beetle series. What was once Jaimes strong and charming best friend is now a douche bag and a lame villain

Blood Beetle? Seriously? What kind of generic, ridiculous crap is this...

and the problem with going to New York is that the first arc didn't do anything at all to set up Jaime's situation other than retelling it slightly with more spanish and more generic supporting cast. Then, with absolutely nothing set up, he just runs off to New York, with no adequately explained reason for choosing that location. And if he does return to texas soon, that just makes the run even more pointless.

And having read the later issues since posting, I can say that Jaime is completely unlikable to me because he hasn't felt any guilt over slapping Brenda around and threatening his parents (sure, the scarab technically did that, but he should have felt something). All he did was complain about how people see him as a villain now. Great hero material.

It's just... not that good. especially not compared to the original.

Reread them then, because Jaime does still feel bad about hitting Brenda and Jaime said he went to New York in order to meet other heroes so he could learn more and Blood Beetle is an awesome villain because Jaime's best friend has been turned against him against his own will and Jaime needs to keep his distance in order to make sure the Blood Beetle has no reason to come out and attack. You're so obsessed with hating this you're missing the answers to things you say aren't there.

#18 Posted by CircularLogic (282 posts) - - Show Bio

@Rixec said:

@CircularLogic said:

@spiderbat87 said:

@Rixec said:

@spiderbat87 said:

@Rixec said:

@spiderbat87 said:

@Rixec said:

Blue Beetle is getting better so I say it's time to give it another chance. I find it as good as the old series but in different ways. Issue 9 is really gonna be good since he's fighting Kyle Rayner and then the New Guardians fight the Reach in issues 9 & 10 of Green Lantern: New Guardians.

@spiderbat87 said:

@CircularLogic: I agree with everything you said, I'm all for the new and there isn't many changes in the DCnU that I don't like but this version of BB has completely turned me of from the character, it's lost all the charm that made me love the original series and now even though I'v read all the issues so far it just doesn't interest me any more. Also moving Jaime from El Paso to New York is just dumb considering the whole reason he was from that area is beacuse there is lit no heroes from there and now he's in New York just like every other hero

Jaime's move to New York is temporary.

@CircularLogic said:

@htb106: 5 issues didn't make me care at all. not really the best track record, especially since the original got me in less than 2

Too bad you didn't read issue six; it was AMAZING with Paco being the Blood Beetle and the physical and emotional battles between them.

yea but the writer said it's be a long while before he'll be back in Texas as they want to put him in the larger world

Exactly, the LARGER world. He's bound to go to a few other places - with heroes and without - and then head back to Texas once he's been established as a hero.

And that is a completely stupid idea

If that's a stupid idea, then all comics are stupid because even the big league heroes have left their home grounds at some point. And because of this "stupid idea" we now get THIS:

It’s BLOOD BEETLE vs. BLUE BEETLE – with Jaime’s life and reputation as a hero on the line!

It's stupid because the idea should have been to bring the DCU in to Texas not for it to get completely ignored also this Blood Beetle crap is the worst thing to ever happen to the Blue Beetle series. What was once Jaimes strong and charming best friend is now a douche bag and a lame villain

Blood Beetle? Seriously? What kind of generic, ridiculous crap is this...

and the problem with going to New York is that the first arc didn't do anything at all to set up Jaime's situation other than retelling it slightly with more spanish and more generic supporting cast. Then, with absolutely nothing set up, he just runs off to New York, with no adequately explained reason for choosing that location. And if he does return to texas soon, that just makes the run even more pointless.

And having read the later issues since posting, I can say that Jaime is completely unlikable to me because he hasn't felt any guilt over slapping Brenda around and threatening his parents (sure, the scarab technically did that, but he should have felt something). All he did was complain about how people see him as a villain now. Great hero material.

It's just... not that good. especially not compared to the original.

Reread them then, because Jaime does still feel bad about hitting Brenda and Jaime said he went to New York in order to meet other heroes so he could learn more and Blood Beetle is an awesome villain because Jaime's best friend has been turned against him against his own will and Jaime needs to keep his distance in order to make sure the Blood Beetle has no reason to come out and attack. You're so obsessed with hating this you're missing the answers to things you say aren't there.

Yep, because Reading all 8 issues, and providing arguments backed up with examples is just me being petty.

Besides the generic as hell name of Blood beetle (let the 90's die, DC), and the complete lack of sense it makes for Jaimes' scarab to produce other scarabs with strength that surpasses the Blue Beetle and no visible defects, despite coming from a "defective" model, all this looks like to me is the venom symbiote. Actually, Blood Beetle looks more and more like Carnage every time I re-read it. Also, pitting best friends against each other due to berserker rage fueled by blame? seriously? I don't think you can argue that it's not generic after all this.

And you know what? I don't buy that Jaime is guilty about all this. Not once do we see him show any real regret, he doesn't seem horrified about the thing inside him and wants to be rid of it, he doesn't show any real pathos. He just shrugs and goes "whoops! better make sure that doesn't happen again. Loose-control-of-my-body-and-viciously-attack-my-female-friend-while-threatening-my-mother-and-sister and-simultaneously-putting-her-through-the-guilt-of-having-left-Brenda-to-die-in-order-to-save-her-own-child once, shame on you. Do it twice, shame on me!". Yeah.

And, pro-tip, avoid run on sentences. Punctuate a bit more.

#19 Posted by Rixec (341 posts) - - Show Bio

@CircularLogic said:

@Rixec said:

@CircularLogic said:

@spiderbat87 said:

@Rixec said:

@spiderbat87 said:

@Rixec said:

@spiderbat87 said:

@Rixec said:

Blue Beetle is getting better so I say it's time to give it another chance. I find it as good as the old series but in different ways. Issue 9 is really gonna be good since he's fighting Kyle Rayner and then the New Guardians fight the Reach in issues 9 & 10 of Green Lantern: New Guardians.

@spiderbat87 said:

@CircularLogic: I agree with everything you said, I'm all for the new and there isn't many changes in the DCnU that I don't like but this version of BB has completely turned me of from the character, it's lost all the charm that made me love the original series and now even though I'v read all the issues so far it just doesn't interest me any more. Also moving Jaime from El Paso to New York is just dumb considering the whole reason he was from that area is beacuse there is lit no heroes from there and now he's in New York just like every other hero

Jaime's move to New York is temporary.

@CircularLogic said:

@htb106: 5 issues didn't make me care at all. not really the best track record, especially since the original got me in less than 2

Too bad you didn't read issue six; it was AMAZING with Paco being the Blood Beetle and the physical and emotional battles between them.

yea but the writer said it's be a long while before he'll be back in Texas as they want to put him in the larger world

Exactly, the LARGER world. He's bound to go to a few other places - with heroes and without - and then head back to Texas once he's been established as a hero.

And that is a completely stupid idea

If that's a stupid idea, then all comics are stupid because even the big league heroes have left their home grounds at some point. And because of this "stupid idea" we now get THIS:

It’s BLOOD BEETLE vs. BLUE BEETLE – with Jaime’s life and reputation as a hero on the line!

It's stupid because the idea should have been to bring the DCU in to Texas not for it to get completely ignored also this Blood Beetle crap is the worst thing to ever happen to the Blue Beetle series. What was once Jaimes strong and charming best friend is now a douche bag and a lame villain

Blood Beetle? Seriously? What kind of generic, ridiculous crap is this...

and the problem with going to New York is that the first arc didn't do anything at all to set up Jaime's situation other than retelling it slightly with more spanish and more generic supporting cast. Then, with absolutely nothing set up, he just runs off to New York, with no adequately explained reason for choosing that location. And if he does return to texas soon, that just makes the run even more pointless.

And having read the later issues since posting, I can say that Jaime is completely unlikable to me because he hasn't felt any guilt over slapping Brenda around and threatening his parents (sure, the scarab technically did that, but he should have felt something). All he did was complain about how people see him as a villain now. Great hero material.

It's just... not that good. especially not compared to the original.

Reread them then, because Jaime does still feel bad about hitting Brenda and Jaime said he went to New York in order to meet other heroes so he could learn more and Blood Beetle is an awesome villain because Jaime's best friend has been turned against him against his own will and Jaime needs to keep his distance in order to make sure the Blood Beetle has no reason to come out and attack. You're so obsessed with hating this you're missing the answers to things you say aren't there.

Yep, because Reading all 8 issues, and providing arguments backed up with examples is just me being petty.

Besides the generic as hell name of Blood beetle (let the 90's die, DC), and the complete lack of sense it makes for Jaimes' scarab to produce other scarabs with strength that surpasses the Blue Beetle and no visible defects, despite coming from a "defective" model, all this looks like to me is the venom symbiote. Actually, Blood Beetle looks more and more like Carnage every time I re-read it. Also, pitting best friends against each other due to berserker rage fueled by blame? seriously? I don't think you can argue that it's not generic after all this.

And you know what? I don't buy that Jaime is guilty about all this. Not once do we see him show any real regret, he doesn't seem horrified about the thing inside him and wants to be rid of it, he doesn't show any real pathos. He just shrugs and goes "whoops! better make sure that doesn't happen again. Loose-control-of-my-body-and-viciously-attack-my-female-friend-while-threatening-my-mother-and-sister and-simultaneously-putting-her-through-the-guilt-of-having-left-Brenda-to-die-in-order-to-save-her-own-child once, shame on you. Do it twice, shame on me!". Yeah.

And, pro-tip, avoid run on sentences. Punctuate a bit more.

Then take a good look at their expressions because there is much praise about the art, especially their expressions as people and in armor. Plus, he ran away because of the danger his friends and family have been in because of the scarab. And Jaime's scarab didn't "produce" the scarab, it was a fail safe designed by the Reach if a scarab wasn't completing its mission. Jaime making the the scarab help save Paco activated it. I get the feeling you haven't read any Blue Beetle and are just citing things you have heard. That, or you just don't pay any attention.

#20 Posted by CircularLogic (282 posts) - - Show Bio

@Rixec: It came directly from the scarab's left hand, and was called a "transbiotic antitrauma unit", or as Jaime called it, a "first aid kit", and it also had the function of an emergency back up protocol. So I repeat, the scarab produced from it's body another form of itself complete with no defects and superior skill and function to the original, despite coming from a defective source. And yes, Jaime did feel some guilt over Paco's injuries, that's why i instead singled out his attack of Brenda, which he showed VERY little guilt, much less than he should have, and he even rationalizes that hitting Brenda was ok, because he quote "Did what i had to do to change him back". Not even a vague hint of remorse for the fact that he hit a 16 year old girl with no super powers. Even Hank Pym was more sympathetic than this. Fact is, Jaime seems to have spent issues 7 and 8 blaming the scarab for these things more than his inability to control it. So yeah it's sad that he can't go home, but it lacks the same impact than if he had actually blamed himself for not having the willpower to stop it. He comes across as a victim, not a hero experiencing conflict.

Don't try to be condescending about whether or not I have read or understood it when again i bring up specific moments from the comic multiple times. Just back your arguments up better, please

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