Black Widow and The Avengers?

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#1 Posted by War Killer (20251 posts) - - Show Bio

Okay she's not with the Mighty Avengers anymore, and S.H.I.E.L.D. is gone, all I see of her is in Caps book, I was just wondering, should she join the New Avengers?, she's Cap's girlfriend and she's allways with him and you would think she would be on the team, most of the members are staying at Cap's house. Back to the point, Should Black Widow join the New Avengers?

#2 Posted by SUNMAN (7239 posts) - - Show Bio

no they should kill her off or something

#3 Posted by Nighthunter (28582 posts) - - Show Bio

don't see any reason why not

#4 Posted by SUNMAN (7239 posts) - - Show Bio

She has nothing she can really bring to the team.

#5 Posted by Vance Astro (91262 posts) - - Show Bio
SUNMAN said:
"She has nothing she can really bring to the team."
Natasha has been around the Avengers since she first appeared...do you really think they would have let her stick around if she has nothing to offer? Black Widow has plenty to offer.
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#6 Posted by War Killer (20251 posts) - - Show Bio
SUNMAN said:
"She has nothing she can really bring to the team."

She's Hot

SUNMAN said:
"no they should kill her off or something"
Wow...Harsh
#7 Posted by PrinceIMC (5422 posts) - - Show Bio

Black Widow is dating Bucky? I don't think the New Avengers need her either, they've already got Cap, Ronin and Mockingbird. Though I bet Bobbi would be more interested in Clint if Natasha was around more. But the team is just a bit full already.

#8 Posted by SUNMAN (7239 posts) - - Show Bio
War Killer said:
"SUNMAN said:
"She has nothing she can really bring to the team."

She's Hot

SUNMAN said:
"no they should kill her off or something"
Wow...Harsh"
I was joking (sort of) I just am not a big fan of hers. And honestly Ms. Marvel and Spider-Woman are hotter.

She has no powers, or skills that would greatly aid the New Avengers. Cap and Hawkeye are superior fighters as well.

I don't thing she brings a significant contacts or other resources to the group. There already 3 chicks on the team. I would rather see Echo on the team if we need another girl than Black widow. Heck I'd rather see Black Cat instead of  Black Widow.
#9 Posted by War Killer (20251 posts) - - Show Bio
SUNMAN said:
"War Killer said:
"SUNMAN said:
"She has nothing she can really bring to the team."

She's Hot

SUNMAN said:
"no they should kill her off or something"
Wow...Harsh"
I was joking (sort of) I just am not a big fan of hers. And honestly Ms. Marvel and Spider-Woman are hotter.

She has no powers, or skills that would greatly aid the New Avengers. Cap and Hawkeye are superior fighters as well.

I don't thing she brings a significant contacts or other resources to the group. There already 3 chicks on the team. I would rather see Echo on the team if we need another girl than Black widow. Heck I'd rather see Black Cat instead of  Black Widow.
"
You never know, with what happens in Spideys book that Black Cat idea could happen, and well I was just saying it would make more sence if she joined

PrinceIMC
said:
"Black Widow is dating Bucky? I don't think the New Avengers need her either, they've already got Cap, Ronin and Mockingbird. Though I bet Bobbi would be more interested in Clint if Natasha was around more. But the team is just a bit full already."
Yeah there dating. yeah the team's big but I still think it would make more sence, she really dosen't have anywhere else to go if you think about it, Ms. Marvel's pretty hot, but Spider-Woman, not so much.

#10 Posted by Vance Astro (91262 posts) - - Show Bio
PrinceIMC said:
"Black Widow is dating Bucky? 
Where have you been?
Moderator
#11 Posted by Dane (10596 posts) - - Show Bio

Yeah thats what the New Avengers need, another street level martial artist/weapons master type.

#12 Posted by Nova`Prime` (4165 posts) - - Show Bio

Well with the "death" of Ms. Marvel they are gonna need to replace her with someone. Also I don't know if its 100% true or not but a friend of mine told me that Widow would be taking over as Cap's side kick.... Bucky.

#13 Posted by Dane (10596 posts) - - Show Bio

"A friend of mine" seems like a pretty reliable source. Getting rid of Ms Marvel is a stupid as hell idea, she was a powerful member and they're seriously lacking in power. Dark Avengers would probably mop the floor with them just because Dark Avengers have members whose powers compliment each other.

#14 Posted by SUNMAN (7239 posts) - - Show Bio
Vance Astro said:
"SUNMAN said:
"She has nothing she can really bring to the team."
Natasha has been around the Avengers since she first appeared...do you really think they would have let her stick around if she has nothing to offer? Black Widow has plenty to offer.
"
besides being hot and taking down low level guy she never did that much. I am not counting all the junk in the Ultimates.

Dane said:
"Yeah thats what the New Avengers need, another street level martial artist/weapons master type."
Thank you!!!!
#15 Posted by War Killer (20251 posts) - - Show Bio
Nova`Prime` said:
"Well with the "death" of Ms. Marvel they are gonna need to replace her with someone. Also I don't know if its 100% true or not but a friend of mine told me that Widow would be taking over as Cap's side kick.... Bucky."

Yeah "Death"  she's not going to die, maby depowered or have some o her power taking away, but that's probably it, and besides in Ms. Marvels book, theres going t be that War of the Marvels (I think that's what it's called) so Carol's not going to die (I guess?)
#16 Posted by PrinceIMC (5422 posts) - - Show Bio
Vance Astro said:
"PrinceIMC said:
"Black Widow is dating Bucky? 
Where have you been?
"
Sorry I don't read Captain America and I don't remember seeing it mentioned or referenced in any of the Avengers books.
#17 Posted by Vance Astro (91262 posts) - - Show Bio
PrinceIMC said:
"Vance Astro said:
"PrinceIMC said:
"Black Widow is dating Bucky? 
Where have you been?
"
Sorry I don't read Captain America and I don't remember seeing it mentioned or referenced in any of the Avengers books."
Why aren't you reading Cap...it's good stuff.


SUNMAN said:
"Vance Astro said:
"SUNMAN said:
"She has nothing she can really bring to the team."
Natasha has been around the Avengers since she first appeared...do you really think they would have let her stick around if she has nothing to offer? Black Widow has plenty to offer.
"
besides being hot and taking down low level guy she never did that much. I am not counting all the junk in the Ultimates.
Seeing as how this is completely false I'm just going to assume your basing your opinion of her on appearance and not what she has actually done for the Avengers.
Moderator
#18 Posted by Dane (10596 posts) - - Show Bio

Uh Vance I think it's more powerset wise, she doesn't bring anything to the table they don't have in spades. New Avengers is almost entirely made up of street level brawlers and martial arts types. Getting another martial arts/weapons master lady isn't going to give them the depth they sorely need. None of them are particularly strong compared to guys like Sentry/Wonderman or even Iron Man, I think their strongest blaster is Ms Marvel and Spiderwoman's Bio Electrical-whatevers mmyes very impressive. Their most powerful members are probably also Ms Marvel and Spiderwoman and honestly neither of them is taking down any of the big Avengers Villains. Can you imagine if these guys had to go up against Kang, Ultron, Morgan le Fay, Dr Doom, or Anyone other than some street level thugs? Rightfully the Hood's gang should smash them into pieces, the Hood is supposed to be empowered by Dormammu? what are guys like Wolverine, Spiderman and Cap gonna do against Dormammu man, scratch him, shot web and shield throw vs his dimensional warping magical sh@t? curbstomp of the century incoming.

Long story short: They've got hardly any depth. They could definitely use a powerhouse or a magic user (Dr Strange was easily their most powerful member) or a Thor-type. Black Widow doesn't add anything they dont have to the squad.

#19 Posted by Vance Astro (91262 posts) - - Show Bio
Dane said:
"Uh Vance I think it's more powerset wise, she doesn't bring anything to the table they don't have in spades. New Avengers is almost entirely made up of street level brawlers and martial arts types. Getting another martial arts/weapons master lady isn't going to give them the depth they sorely need. None of them are particularly strong compared to guys like Sentry/Wonderman or even Iron Man, I think their strongest blaster is Ms Marvel and Spiderwoman's Bio Electrical-whatevers mmyes very impressive. Their most powerful members are probably also Ms Marvel and Spiderwoman and honestly neither of them is taking down any of the big Avengers Villains. Can you imagine if these guys had to go up against Kang, Ultron, Morgan le Fay, Dr Doom, or Anyone other than some street level thugs? Rightfully the Hood's gang should smash them into pieces, the Hood is supposed to be empowered by Dormammu? what are guys like Wolverine, Spiderman and Cap gonna do against Dormammu man, scratch him, shot web and shield throw vs his dimensional warping magical sh@t? curbstomp of the century incoming.Long story short: They've got hardly any depth. They could definitely use a powerhouse or a magic user (Dr Strange was easily their most powerful member) or a Thor-type. Black Widow doesn't add anything they dont have to the squad. "
What do you mean "powerset" wise.She doesn't have any powers.Most of the time Black Widow was around whether she was working for S.H.I.E.L.D or for the Avengers,she never had to actually leave headquarters to be helpful.She brings skills to an Avengers team that nobody on any current Avengers team has.I would rather have Black Widow on the New Avengers than Mockingbird,she's a better fighter,has more skills,she's been around long and there are a whole host of other reasons I won't bother to layout.The New Avengers don't need any depth..they were made up of street levelers for a reason.They are purposely the weakest team.The New Avengers are never going to fight Kang,Ultron,Morgan Le Fay,or Dr.Doom,You know why? Because the writers know they can win..so they take on street level threats.The Hood's gang shouldn't smash the New Avengers.In all actually the writers are amping the gang so they can compete with them.Iron Fist alone has beaten alot of those guys as a team by himself.Most of the hood's gang is canon fodder.Ms.Marvel is the most powerful New Avenger as far as I am concerned..screw Strange.
Moderator
#20 Posted by avengpymhawk (371 posts) - - Show Bio

Sunman said,

She has no powers, or skills that would greatly aid the New Avengers. Cap and Hawkeye are superior fighters as well.

The Black Widow has better fighting skills than Clint Barton. As much as she has appeared in the Avengers, I have always thought that she was best suited for Shield, and maybe a pop-up now and again in the Avengers when needed. I think it would be worth exploring her and Tony Stark's relationship.
The Black Widow has takeen-out the Red Skull, gone toe to toe with Daredevil, and has both lead the Avengers and Shield.
Not to mention she has had more relationships with other heroes than even Tigra. Were talking about Clint Barton, Tony Stark, Steve Rogers, Bucky Barnes, Daredevil. Hercules, and Red Guardian off the top of my head.
#21 Posted by Vance Astro (91262 posts) - - Show Bio
avengpymhawk said:
"Sunman said,
She has no powers, or skills that would greatly aid the New Avengers. Cap and Hawkeye are superior fighters as well.

The Black Widow has better fighting skills than Clint Barton. As much as she has appeared in the Avengers, I have always thought that she was best suited for Shield, and maybe a pop-up now and again in the Avengers when needed. I think it would be worth exploring her and Tony Stark's relationship.
The Black Widow has takeen-out the Red Skull, gone toe to toe with Daredevil, and has both lead the Avengers and Shield.
Not to mention she has had more relationships with other heroes than even Tigra. Were talking about Clint Barton, Tony Stark, Steve Rogers, Bucky Barnes, Daredevil. Hercules, and Red Guardian off the top of my head.
"
Now you're going overboard.Black Widow is not a better fighter than Clint.
I don't see the point of exploring her relationship with Stark when Stark just made Pepper Potts and "Iron Woman" suit and he's obviously in love with her and he's been doin Maria Hill and what's more she's already with Cap\Bucky.
Daredevil owned Black Widow and there are other people who led Avengers teams that weren't considered to be one now.Monica Rambeau ring a bell? 
Everyone on the current New Avengers has just as much ties to other Avengers as Black Widow.

I think Black Widow should be a New Avenger simply for the reason I want Falcon to be one.Why have two able-bodied Avengers sitting around in Cap's book when there is a perfectly good Avengers book that could use them...and where the Hell was Falcon during Secret Invasion?
Moderator
#22 Edited by Dane (10596 posts) - - Show Bio

Yeah let's get Black Widow in, Falcon, Sharon Carter too, shes been a SHIELD agent. Daredevils another good one, Elektra too. I haven't seen Echo in awhile either, she should come back and Hawkeye could be Hawkeye again. We got Spiderman and Spiderwoman but I haven't seen Arachne in awhile, she could be in too. Actually, lets just have every street level hero join the New Avengers and have 500 people with really similar powers in the same team, it'll be great because Vance enjoys Cap comics, yeah. I'm bloated with sweet ideas.

#23 Posted by Vance Astro (91262 posts) - - Show Bio
Dane said:
"Yeah let's get Black Widow in, Falcon, Sharon Carter too, shes been a SHIELD agent. Daredevils another good one, Elektra too. I haven't seen Echo in awhile either, she should come back and Hawkeye could be Hawkeye again. We got Spiderman and Spiderwoman but I haven't seen Arachne in awhile, she could be in too. Actually, lets just have every street level hero join the New Avengers and have 500 people with really similar powers in the same team, it'll be great because Vance enjoys Cap comics, yeah. I'm bloated with sweet ideas."
Sharon Carter sucks,Daredevil works alone and so does Elektra.I don't know where Echo is but nobody seems to care.The team acknowledged that she wasn't there then just left it alone.I'm sure Ronin doesn't want to talk about her or who she is because his wife is back and he's been doin Echo.Clint can't be Hawkeye again because Kate and Bullseye are Hawkeye.We don't need 3 Hawkeye's.I don't know if you are being sarcastic but I would never go as far as to say we need to have every street leveler on the New Avengers.i just don't see the point of having Avengers sitting around..veteran Avengers and not using them for anything.
Moderator
#24 Posted by Dane (10596 posts) - - Show Bio

Dude most of the awesome Avengers that I'd want to read about aren't on any of the teams. And I was taking the piss out of you.

#25 Posted by Vance Astro (91262 posts) - - Show Bio
Dane said:
And I was taking the piss out of you."
I just peed..I didn't need your help...
Moderator
#26 Posted by Dane (10596 posts) - - Show Bio
Vance Astro said:
"Dane said:
And I was taking the piss out of you."
I just peed..I didn't need your help...
"
I get that all the time in the Men's Room. Lighten up Vance :)
#27 Posted by Vance Astro (91262 posts) - - Show Bio
Dane said:
"Vance Astro said:
"Dane said:
And I was taking the piss out of you."
I just peed..I didn't need your help...
"
I get that all the time in the Men's Room. Lighten up Vance :)"
gross...
Moderator
#28 Posted by Dane (10596 posts) - - Show Bio

you're such a serious guy Vance...

#29 Posted by Vance Astro (91262 posts) - - Show Bio
Dane said:
"you're such a serious guy Vance..."
What makes you think I was serious?
Moderator
#30 Posted by Dane (10596 posts) - - Show Bio

Well you didn't want my help taking a piss, that's just offensive dude.

#31 Edited by Vance Astro (91262 posts) - - Show Bio
Dane said:
"Well you didn't want my help taking a piss, that's just offensive dude."
I'm grown I can hold my own johnson.
Moderator
#32 Posted by Dane (10596 posts) - - Show Bio
Vance Astro said:
"Dane said:
"you're such a serious guy Vance..."
What makes you think I was serious?
"
^
#33 Posted by Nova`Prime` (4165 posts) - - Show Bio

I am just curious why is it Black Widow is getting kicked around about not having powers and can't compete with some super villians, yet Batman has no powers and he gets a pass?

#34 Posted by SUNMAN (7239 posts) - - Show Bio
Nova`Prime` said:
"I am just curious why is it Black Widow is getting kicked around about not having powers and can't compete with some super villians, yet Batman has no powers and he gets a pass?"
because Batman has way more impressive feats and skills
#35 Posted by Vance Astro (91262 posts) - - Show Bio
Nova`Prime` said:
"I am just curious why is it Black Widow is getting kicked around about not having powers and can't compete with some super villians, yet Batman has no powers and he gets a pass?"
That wasn't the point being made..the point was Black Widow has nothing to offer the New Avengers other than skills that people on the team already have.It's false but that was the point.
Moderator
#36 Posted by Vance Astro (91262 posts) - - Show Bio
SUNMAN said:
"Nova`Prime` said:
"I am just curious why is it Black Widow is getting kicked around about not having powers and can't compete with some super villians, yet Batman has no powers and he gets a pass?"
because Batman has way more impressive feats and skills
"
That doesn't matter.
Moderator
#37 Posted by SUNMAN (7239 posts) - - Show Bio
Vance Astro said:
"SUNMAN said:
"Nova`Prime` said:
"I am just curious why is it Black Widow is getting kicked around about not having powers and can't compete with some super villians, yet Batman has no powers and he gets a pass?"
because Batman has way more impressive feats and skills
"
That doesn't matter.
"
it does when this dude tries to bring Batman in here for no reason
#38 Posted by Vance Astro (91262 posts) - - Show Bio
SUNMAN said:
"Vance Astro said:
"SUNMAN said:
"Nova`Prime` said:
"I am just curious why is it Black Widow is getting kicked around about not having powers and can't compete with some super villians, yet Batman has no powers and he gets a pass?"
because Batman has way more impressive feats and skills
"
That doesn't matter.
"
it does when this dude tries to bring Batman in here for no reason
"
It really doesn't.He didn't understand the point being made..but you made it so you understand perfectly.Batman just like Black Widow has different skills than other street levelers to offer.He may have some that the others have but no street leveler will ever have the same exact skill set as Batman.Not a Robin,A Batwoman,A Batgirl,A Nightwing,or a Red Robin.
Moderator
#39 Edited by Dane (10596 posts) - - Show Bio
Vance Astro said:
"Nova`Prime` said:
"I am just curious why is it Black Widow is getting kicked around about not having powers and can't compete with some super villians, yet Batman has no powers and he gets a pass?"
That wasn't the point being made..the point was Black Widow has nothing to offer the New Avengers other than skills that people on the team already have.It's false but that was the point.
"
She doesn't have superpowers and they need someone with some strong superpowers imo. Firstly you never stated that she could do something the others cant and secondly, it was always my opinion of "what the new avengers need" nothing else. I don't really mind what your opinion is. I just don't think she brings anything significant to the party, she could join and I wouldn't really care but if they're recruiting I think they should go for War Machine or Justice or Thor they're all ex-Avengers, good ones imo, and they should be on a team.
#40 Posted by Vance Astro (91262 posts) - - Show Bio
Dane said:
"Vance Astro said:
"Nova`Prime` said:
"I am just curious why is it Black Widow is getting kicked around about not having powers and can't compete with some super villians, yet Batman has no powers and he gets a pass?"
That wasn't the point being made..the point was Black Widow has nothing to offer the New Avengers other than skills that people on the team already have.It's false but that was the point.
"
She doesn't have superpowers and they need someone with some strong superpowers imo. Firstly you never stated that she could do something the others cant and secondly, it was always my opinion of "what the new avengers need" nothing else. I don't really mind what your opinion is. I just don't think she brings anything significant to the party, she could join and I wouldn't really care but if they're recruiting I think they should go for War Machine or Justice or Thor they're all ex-Avengers, good ones imo, and they should be on a team."
I know she doesn't have superpowers and I never said she did.The New Avengers don't need anyone one with powers.It doesn't matter.
If the New Avengers need anyone it's Black Widow.You say Black Widow doesn't bring anything significant to the party..well of course with her having no powers she's not going to come in and be a dominant force but they could use her.She has skills that some don't.Is anyone on the New Avengers the on the level of tactical expertise that Natasha is? NO! The New Avengers are severely lacking tactical options and direction.There leadership is terrible and they are always in some sh#t because of it.

War Machine is caught up in his own mess
Justice is the leader of the New Warriors
and Thor has a Kingdom to protect

I never stated that Black Widow can do something the others can't? WTF do you think my entire argument has been about? Do you not read my posts?

Vance Astro said:
 Black Widow has different skills than other street levelers

Vance Astro said:

That wasn't the point being made..the point was Black Widow has nothing to offer the New Avengers other than skills that people on the team already have.It's false but that was the point."

Vance Astro said:
 Black Widow has plenty to offer."
Moderator
#41 Edited by Dane (10596 posts) - - Show Bio

yeah you kinda hadn't said what they were. I don't see Black Widow coming into a leadership role though, wouldn't suit imo. I'd like to see if Clint mans up to it a bit, he has Avengers experience out the wazoo so it could work.

I wasn't aware that Justice was back in New Warriors, I don't read that book. Wolverine is in like 25 comics so I can't see why Thor and War Machine shouldn't magically find time for Avengers. I honestly really miss having a proper Avengers lineup and I understand that New Avengers hasn't been that book for a long time (since Civil War obviously) but I really wish it would get back to that, I'm sick of buying two comics that feel like they each have half a team. Mighty and New Avengers, neither of them felt like teams that worked. It really feels like the writers are sacrificing the big picture in order to maintain their ludicrous story arcs and shitty subplots. Do not want.

#42 Posted by Vance Astro (91262 posts) - - Show Bio
Dane said:
"yeah you kinda hadn't said what they were. P.S. Wolverine and Bucky might have a little bit of combat experience between them. I don't see Black Widow coming into a leadership role, wouldn't suit imo. I'd like to see if Clint mans up to it a bit, he has Avengers experience out the wazoo so it could work."
I shouldn't have to say what skills she has.People were acting like they new her so well."She doesn't have any skills or powers to offer?" That just tells me people are basing there posts on ignorance.If you don't like Black Widow just say that instead of making up stuff.Clint doesn't have the tactical mind that Black Widow does.Not at all.I doubt he will serve the Avengers any better than Cage did.Wolverine and Bucky have way more than a little bit of combat experience...as does Black Widow.Hawkeye is a good character and a solid team player but he's not a leader.Not a good one anyway.Also Black Widow has just as much experience as he does...if not more.Now that I think of it I believe she does have more experience than he does.
Moderator
#43 Edited by Dane (10596 posts) - - Show Bio

You have to understand Vance that I'm not always serious. Also, I do like Black Widow and I am and have always based my posts on my opinion. I thought she was good in Mighty Avengers because her skill set complimented the team. New Avengers need more fire power. It's your opinion that the New Avengers should only ever tackle street level threats and thats cool, thats what they've been doing and if they like being in one piece its what they'll keep doing. But is that the Avengers for you? it's not the Avengers for me. A group brought together for threats that no single hero could defeat. Dude theres more than a few single heroes who could snap crackle and pop the Hood's whole krew in about 5 seconds. I'm sure you can think of several and honestly I think the Avengers deserves a better class of villain.

#44 Posted by avengpymhawk (371 posts) - - Show Bio

Vance Astro said:

Now you're going overboard.Black Widow is not a better fighter than Clint.

No Way!  I am a big Barton fan, but he did not know any major martial arts till he joined the New Avengers.  Then bam! He is this great martial arts fighter, yeah right! Like I said I'm a huge fan, but no way Clint would win against Natasha. She is better trained, better skilled, and just better over all.

#45 Posted by Vance Astro (91262 posts) - - Show Bio
avengpymhawk said:
"Vance Astro said:
Now you're going overboard.Black Widow is not a better fighter than Clint.

No Way!  I am a big Barton fan, but he did not know any major martial arts till he joined the New Avengers.  Then bam! He is this great martial arts fighter, yeah right! Like I said I'm a huge fan, but no way Clint would win against Natasha. She is better trained, better skilled, and just better over all.

"
Liiiiiiies.
Moderator
#46 Posted by Vance Astro (91262 posts) - - Show Bio
Dane said:
"You have to understand Vance that I'm not always serious. Also, I do like Black Widow and I am and have always based my posts on my opinion. I thought she was good in Mighty Avengers because her skill set complimented the team. New Avengers need more fire power. It's your opinion that the New Avengers should only ever tackle street level threats and thats cool, thats what they've been doing and if they like being in one piece its what they'll keep doing. But is that the Avengers for you? it's not the Avengers for me. A group brought together for threats that no single hero could defeat. Dude theres more than a few single heroes who could snap crackle and pop the Hood's whole krew in about 5 seconds. I'm sure you can think of several and honestly I think the Avengers deserves a better class of villain."
.................
Moderator
#47 Posted by BlackWidowBoy (27 posts) - - Show Bio

Okay guys as the most biased memeber here i too will offfer my two cents and frankly set the record straight.,

1) i think we can all agree theat the new avengers was a semi cool concept driven terribly wrong by the combined, civil war, secret invasion, and now dark reign nonsense. the team is pretty flat lacking any real diversity that would add the team truth we have a total of 5 brawleer types: Cap,mockingbird, ronin, wolverine, luke. whichis just rediculous and boring. so adding her when there are already so many similar types would just continue to hit the ailr the head. they need other allies and to loose the pointless non-belongers like: spider-man, and wolverine. and replace for some equaly and more appropriate characters such as hellcat, and arachne. Somone with some ties or how bout this, get creative and make somone new..

2) as far as her skills they are quite comparable to Batman, she Is frequently said to be the best spy in the world menaing she has formidable expertise in intelegence gathering, sabatage, computers, anhas extensive contacts throught the intelegence and superhero comunity that cant be given by anone else except arguably bucky who has his hands full just trying to be a half good cap. She is a master of several forms of martial arts in the same as batman and has also been trianed by cap durring her tenure with the avengers the same that Ronin, and Bucky have. However in addition to her training by him she was the partner and obviously sparring partner of Daredevil, and As revealed in Wolverine origins was trained by him in her youth, her retcon Origin also has her being trained By Bucky/Winter soilder along with other as far as skills in weapons (melee, and technoplogical) while at the Red Room since her youth. Served as tactical leader of the Avengers; and has been shopwn to have SHeild status high enough to at times make her defacto commander of SHIELD. she has numerous qualifications that would make her a wonderfuil leader of the team but thats just not going to happen.  why, because it dosent make since right now.

3) as far as powers Natasha is a confirmed super-soilder by russian development. retarding her age in the samee like as Rodgers, posessing healing on a near comparable level. with and incresed tollerance if not near immunity for poisions, and toxins, as well as an higer functioning immune system. she has peak human abilities. as revealed in her las miniseries homecoming, and the things they say about her so also in that respect he is equal and has an edge on the Bat.

4) Barton has proved himself a far than capable leader durring his tenure with the Thunderbolts, which i still think was the best run that book has had. So im more than satisfied he is leader............But BW would kick his ass, firstly because prior to anyone else really, BW and he were partners and she took him under her wing and trained him, which is slightly hinted at in the bowmans agile nature in combat which is a token technique of the widow as well as the captain (credit where due) and she has had more trianing in that arena than him.

5) if there is one thing she could add that the others would be lacking it would possibly be...organization, as a strategist first whoes life is always on the line from seen, and unseen enimies she always has to stay two steps ahead, she is also a reformed "villian" who has since killed, and done things that may not be considered Avengers worthy but would allow them to keep up witha twisted psyche liek osborn, daken, bullseye, handling criimnals and villians, who are driven by passion, and intrigue is her speciality as a professional and as somone who lives in that world. one could argue bucky could also do the same, but to face it he is not cap and does not have the ability to organize as throughly as she would  nore with an arm the color of a sportscar get where she can get.

#48 Posted by War Killer (20251 posts) - - Show Bio

Oops...I think I started a War. But I really think they should do more with Natalia, like I said all I have seen of her is in Caps book and with the Avengers living in Caps house I thought it would make more sence if she joined the team (But That's Just Me) and if you think about it with Norman ruling the world the New Avengers are going ot need all the help they can get with fighting the Dark Avengers and The Hood and his gang. (Pules Natalia's just good character and needs to be with a team, but again that's just me)

#49 Edited by AngelFrost (2833 posts) - - Show Bio

You guys are being too harsh on Black Widow ....
She rocked with the Avengers, as a sexy, femme fatale, gun-weilding chick

and I'm glad she's not one of them 1000's who have exrteme superpowers ....
The whole idea of comic heroes are people, discovering they have powers, that they are different .... But yet, theres millions of super-powered people. And Black Widow shows females can kick ass without "Laser Beams" or "Super Strength" ....etc.

So give her a break, and she deserves to be in the spotlight once again.

#50 Posted by War Killer (20251 posts) - - Show Bio
AngelFrost said:
You guys are being too harsh on Black Widow ....She rocked with the Avengers, as a sexy, femme fatale, gun-weilding ... [more]
Thats what I was talking about! She would be great on the Avengers!

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