Was Death of the Family rendered pointless?

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#51 Posted by gettogaara (164 posts) - - Show Bio

@entropy_aegis: Come on man, I like Damian too. Hell he was my favorite character in DC which is one of the reasons this has got me so angry but it's not even a little fair to compare him(a character who developed for close to 7 years) to Lincoln March(who had a few issues) Despite the fact that I enjoyed it I can understand how you would see DotF as cliche since a lot of it wasn't new information. I personally liked the whole face/mask thing and the tray that kept making us think that someone was inside only to realize it was Joker screwing around but that's me. I don't see how Court Of Owls is cliche at all though considering the whole idea was new.

Now the problem with Damian's death isn't simply that he died but how he died. It just felt unnatural and like it was just there for shock value. Yes I know that he had planned to kill him originally but he had put that aside due to the character's popularity. Suddenly, he wants everyone to know that Damian gets killed so badly that it's advertised in newspapers before the comic is even released? He claims he saves the world and goes out like an absolute hero but is just brutalized by a older clone of himself before dying in fear. The only one he managed to save was that girl in red. I'm sorry but that's not good writing to me.

#52 Posted by FatihBATMAN (1389 posts) - - Show Bio

@gettogaara said:

brutalized by a older clone of himself before dying in fear. The only one he managed to save was that girl in red. I'm sorry but that's not good writing to me.

hes 10 years old, no matter how much a badass you are, if your 10 your still afraid.... thats just natural

#53 Posted by gettogaara (164 posts) - - Show Bio

@FatihBATMAN said:

@gettogaara said:

brutalized by a older clone of himself before dying in fear. The only one he managed to save was that girl in red. I'm sorry but that's not good writing to me.

hes 10 years old, no matter how much a badass you are, if your 10 your still afraid.... thats just natural

Obviously. I would question the writing more if he wasn't scared. I'm just saying that Morrison made it sound like Damian was going to sacrifice himself for a greater purpose or something along those lines when that was the total opposite of what happened.

#54 Edited by The_Tree (7246 posts) - - Show Bio

I found Death of the Family to already be pointless but Inc. just solidifies that thought.

Scott probably should've held off releasing the story if he wanted some sort of impact. After all, he has known that Damian dies since his start on Batman.

Online
#55 Posted by FatihBATMAN (1389 posts) - - Show Bio

howd you know that ? that scott knows he dies?

#56 Posted by Humanoid (132 posts) - - Show Bio

@havoc1201 said:

Morrison does not care about the other writers all he cares about is his story and legacy in which after he is gone the rest of the writers will fix the mess he left behind. Morrison is a one man show who takes nothing but what he wants into consideration. I really liked a lot of his stuff but INC is just a dumb idea with C level characters and now with him killing Damian just because it is his character im done with his stories and i cant wait for him to leave so the other writers can fix this.

Apart from Batman & Robin, the rest of the Bat titles have been pretty forgettable. I'm happy he's not tainting his flawless work by involving others. Rock on Morrison.

#57 Posted by The_Tree (7246 posts) - - Show Bio

@FatihBATMAN said:

howd you know that ? that scott knows he dies?

Online
#58 Posted by FatihBATMAN (1389 posts) - - Show Bio

Well, Legends of the dark knight is nice i think, also TDK...

#59 Posted by FatihBATMAN (1389 posts) - - Show Bio

@The_Tree said:

@FatihBATMAN said:

howd you know that ? that scott knows he dies?

oh god! :O

#60 Posted by gettogaara (164 posts) - - Show Bio

@The_Tree: Got to admit, didn't see that coming. I suppose Snyder's the one to blame for bad timing of DotF then. If it had come before Court Of Owls then things probably would've worked out better. I went over to Snyder's twitter and in another tweet he said "Grant shared an outline for Batman Inc long ago."

So did all of the other writers get these outlines as well? If that's the case I guess we can't criticize him on that front then lol.

#61 Edited by The_Tree (7246 posts) - - Show Bio

@gettogaara said:

@The_Tree: Got to admit, didn't see that coming. I suppose Snyder's the one to blame for bad timing of DotF then. If it had come before Court Of Owls then things probably would've worked out better. I went over to Snyder's twitter and in another tweet he said "Grant shared an outline for Batman Inc long ago."

So did all of the other writers get these outlines as well? If that's the case I guess we can't criticize him on that front then lol.

Chris Burnham (artist for Batman Inc.) has known since April 2011. Tomasi said in a recent interview with CBR that he's known for quite awhile as well. So it kind of makes you wonder about how far in advance the head Batman writers have known this.

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#62 Posted by FatihBATMAN (1389 posts) - - Show Bio

....hmm, good point, scott and all the others had to publish their arc, no matter the batman inc progression...you know, to give us shock value.

#63 Posted by entropy_aegis (14533 posts) - - Show Bio

Burnham also stated that they'd all seen the INC outlines long ago,lol @ those claiming it was Morrisons fault.@Phaedrusgr said:

@entropy_aegis: I said it's a cliché, cause it was unnecessary, it's the second Robin that dies and I'm a little bit over the head with all these "heroic" deaths. Having this said, I can't say I haven't enjoyed his run. I don't like how he ends it. Of course, it's his call, but I'm entitled to my own opinion. I would expect much more from the guy that wrote Arkham Asylum.

The second Robin who dies almost 25 years and it makes perfect storyline sense and keeping in view Damian's character,he died trying to prevent his parents from fighting,killed by his own reflection that had embraced the dark side.@gettogaara said:

@entropy_aegis: Come on man, I like Damian too. Hell he was my favorite character in DC which is one of the reasons this has got me so angry but it's not even a little fair to compare him(a character who developed for close to 7 years) to Lincoln March(who had a few issues) Despite the fact that I enjoyed it I can understand how you would see DotF as cliche since a lot of it wasn't new information. I personally liked the whole face/mask thing and the tray that kept making us think that someone was inside only to realize it was Joker screwing around but that's me. I don't see how Court Of Owls is cliche at all though considering the whole idea was new.

Now the problem with Damian's death isn't simply that he died but how he died. It just felt unnatural and like it was just there for shock value. Yes I know that he had planned to kill him originally but he had put that aside due to the character's popularity. Suddenly, he wants everyone to know that Damian gets killed so badly that it's advertised in newspapers before the comic is even released? He claims he saves the world and goes out like an absolute hero but is just brutalized by a older clone of himself before dying in fear. The only one he managed to save was that girl in red. I'm sorry but that's not good writing to me.

Lincoln March was the big bad of a story that lasted a year and spanned more than 2 dozens titles,I expect a little more than"HOO I'm your brother" which was only brought up at the climax.

The girl secured the Oroborus trigger,and yes he was brutalized by someone who was VASTLY superior to him.Damian losing to Heretic is good writing,Damian beating him(a guy who wiped the floor with Batman) would have been bad writing.There was also nothing new about the Court.

#64 Posted by papabearg4d (110 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheCowman said:

It doesn't overshadow it for me, but sadly others might see it that way.

I applauded Snyder's ballsy decision to not kill or maim anyone at the end of Death of the Family. It took a lotta guts in today's comic world where every event has to have "lasting consequences", "up the ante", and "shake the hero to his core", to say, 'yeah, nobody dies. The Joker was just ****ing with them the whole time'.

I loved that aspect of the story cause it really drove home the fact that you really have NO idea what the Joker might do. The Joker really is capable of anything, including NOT killing anybody.

Why?

Nobody knows. He's the frickin' Joker.

But sadly many will now focus on Damian's death. Cause, y'know, THAT'S something really new, ain't it? <------- (sarcasm is sarcastic)

Very well said.

#65 Posted by Shipster360 (46 posts) - - Show Bio

@FatihBATMAN: thank you for the positivity! ive been reading alot of negatiive reactions to the events going on. im loving it all!

#66 Posted by FatihBATMAN (1389 posts) - - Show Bio

@Shipster360 said:

@FatihBATMAN: thank you for the positivity! ive been reading alot of negatiive reactions to the events going on. im loving it all!

no probs man! :D

#67 Posted by gettogaara (164 posts) - - Show Bio

@entropy_aegis: @entropy_aegis said:

Lincoln March was the big bad of a story that lasted a year and spanned more than 2 dozens titles,I expect a little more than"HOO I'm your brother" which was only brought up at the climax.

The girl secured the Oroborus trigger,and yes he was brutalized by someone who was VASTLY superior to him.Damian losing to Heretic is good writing,Damian beating him(a guy who wiped the floor with Batman) would have been bad writing.There was also nothing new about the Court.

I hadn't paid attention to what the girl had in her arms in my first reading to be honest so after looking at the comic again, I'm glad that Damian's death wasn't completely meaningless but I don't think you're getting my point on why I consider it bad writing. Obviously he's scared and obviously he's not going to defeat Heretic(although the various arrows didn't exactly make it a fair fight) but it's about the way he died just feeling plain unnatural. It didn't help that we knew what was going to happen before even picking the comic up but we probably won't be able to see eye to eye on this.

As for the Court of Owls, how was there nothing new? I mean yeah Bruce has had a brother before but we don't even know if Lincoln March is actually his brother. We also don't know if he's even alive or dead which means he might come back for more development at a later point in time. The whole idea of a group made up of the oldest and wealthiest families in Gotham who watch over the city by removing those in power who they don't agree with is fairly original. The closest thing I can think of is the League of Assassins and that's just because they're both societies that kill.

#68 Posted by FatihBATMAN (1389 posts) - - Show Bio

yeanagree that they spoiled it at dc... advertising there was a death

#69 Posted by UncleEmu (179 posts) - - Show Bio

DotF was okay. I feel like for all the planning, for everything that the Joker set up, to be foiled by a leak is kind of lame. There are parts that had me feeling some serious fright, and others that I just really didn't like. Overall, when I was done reading it I wasn't really in awe, and there really isn't much to talk about. For Damian's death, I've really enjoyed all of Batman Inc and it hit really hard. It's something that will remain a conversation point.

#70 Posted by UncleEmu (179 posts) - - Show Bio

Court of Owls was recycled Batman material. A villain who tries to shake Bruce's world by claiming his family? Doctor Hurt from Batman RIP. Group of elitists making decisions about the future and controlling and infiltrating and using highly trained assassins? League of Shadows and every Illuminati type group that exists. A group of people trying to drive Batman insane? The Black Glove, and sometimes the Arkham crew. I liked Court of Owls ok, but there wasn't much original stuff there other than Batman being a pansy and the owl look.

#71 Posted by Shark_Repellent_Bat_Spray (745 posts) - - Show Bio

@havoc1201 said:

Morrison does not care about the other writers all he cares about is his story and legacy in which after he is gone the rest of the writers will fix the mess he left behind. Morrison is a one man show who takes nothing but what he wants into consideration. I really liked a lot of his stuff but INC is just a dumb idea with C level characters and now with him killing Damian just because it is his character im done with his stories and i cant wait for him to leave so the other writers can fix this.

I agree with you on this.

#72 Posted by FatihBATMAN (1389 posts) - - Show Bio

why does morrison have so much freedom!! aaaaarghhh

#73 Edited by gettogaara (164 posts) - - Show Bio

@UncleEmu: You can't simplify it that much man. By that logic basically all of the stories in comics would be recycled material(Which is possible considering how long Superman and Batman have been around lol). Someone is always going to try to drive Batman crazy no matter what you're reading, that's pretty much a recurring theme. The league is similar but they also have their differences from the court including their purposes. Obviously Court of Owls wasn't the most original story but it brought a few fresh ideas to the table while remaining enjoyable at the same time. To me that's what matters.

@FatihBATMAN said:

why does morrison have so much freedom!! aaaaarghhh

Like you said earlier, the guy's been at this for a long time. Now that he's leaving I guess DC just wants to let him end things the way he wants.

#74 Posted by FatihBATMAN (1389 posts) - - Show Bio

i understnd that but....lets see how inc. ends, and its up to the other writerds to set back the pieces though right?

#75 Posted by havoc1201 (491 posts) - - Show Bio

@FatihBATMAN said:

i understnd that but....lets see how inc. ends, and its up to the other writerds to set back the pieces though right?

yup it is

#76 Posted by entropy_aegis (14533 posts) - - Show Bio

@gettogaara said:

@UncleEmu: You can't simplify it that much man. By that logic basically all of the stories in comics would be recycled material(Which is possible considering how long Superman and Batman have been around lol). Someone is always going to try to drive Batman crazy no matter what you're reading, that's pretty much a recurring theme. The league is similar but they also have their differences from the court including their purposes. Obviously Court of Owls wasn't the most original story but it brought a few fresh ideas to the table while remaining enjoyable at the same time. To me that's what matters.

@FatihBATMAN said:

why does morrison have so much freedom!! aaaaarghhh

Like you said earlier, the guy's been at this for a long time. Now that he's leaving I guess DC just wants to let him end things the way he wants.

Obviously stories get recycled from time to time but the Court tried to recycle story tropes(evil brother/relative,secret society) waaay too soon after the Black Glove and Hush storylines.@gettogaara said:

@entropy_aegis: @entropy_aegis said:

Lincoln March was the big bad of a story that lasted a year and spanned more than 2 dozens titles,I expect a little more than"HOO I'm your brother" which was only brought up at the climax.

The girl secured the Oroborus trigger,and yes he was brutalized by someone who was VASTLY superior to him.Damian losing to Heretic is good writing,Damian beating him(a guy who wiped the floor with Batman) would have been bad writing.There was also nothing new about the Court.

I hadn't paid attention to what the girl had in her arms in my first reading to be honest so after looking at the comic again, I'm glad that Damian's death wasn't completely meaningless but I don't think you're getting my point on why I consider it bad writing. Obviously he's scared and obviously he's not going to defeat Heretic(although the various arrows didn't exactly make it a fair fight) but it's about the way he died just feeling plain unnatural. It didn't help that we knew what was going to happen before even picking the comic up but we probably won't be able to see eye to eye on this.

As for the Court of Owls, how was there nothing new? I mean yeah Bruce has had a brother before but we don't even know if Lincoln March is actually his brother. We also don't know if he's even alive or dead which means he might come back for more development at a later point in time. The whole idea of a group made up of the oldest and wealthiest families in Gotham who watch over the city by removing those in power who they don't agree with is fairly original. The closest thing I can think of is the League of Assassins and that's just because they're both societies that kill.

He was never gonna defeat Heretic ever unless you think Damian can beat Batman,and how was it unnatural.Hush says hi to the bolded part,Snyder didn't make us care about Lincoln,how much development did he get prior to the big reveal? and the cliffhanger is generic.

The only problem with the Court was that WE DONT KNOW WHO THEY ARE,who the frick are these wealthy families? simple answer they're nobodies,and what's their fascination with owls may I ask?

Snyder had 11 issues and an annual to flesh out the Court,he couldn't do it(not counting the dozen tie inns),sorry but that's poor writing.

#77 Posted by gotwillpower (679 posts) - - Show Bio

@havoc1201 said:

Morrison does not care about the other writers all he cares about is his story and legacy in which after he is gone the rest of the writers will fix the mess he left behind. Morrison is a one man show who takes nothing but what he wants into consideration. I really liked a lot of his stuff but INC is just a dumb idea with C level characters and now with him killing Damian just because it is his character im done with his stories and i cant wait for him to leave so the other writers can fix this.

I agree, but some of his stories have been good (despite messing other stuff up).

#78 Posted by FatihBATMAN (1389 posts) - - Show Bio

yup! i like hus Gothic arc from LOTDK

#79 Posted by gettogaara (164 posts) - - Show Bio

@entropy_aegis: Maybe I missed something in Hush but why exactly are you comparing it to Court Of Owls? Tommy was his childhood friend, not his relative. As for Black Glove yes it had a secret society and a relative but it was over six years back. On top of that, like I told UncleEmu they may be similar but they have different purposes and that's what counts. I mean seriously, are writers supposed to not make an organization now just because someone else made another one? If we disregarded every new organization that came along and only accepted the League of Assassins then we wouldn't have much to read.

The whole point of the Court(Talons not included) is that they're unknown and keep themselves hidden behind those Owl masks. Exposing them and giving us information on each of the families involved would defeat the purpose. Lincoln could have gotten a bit more development but it was still surprising and enjoyable.

I wasn't claiming that Damian could beat Heretic, just that his chances would've been better without being shot by archers. As for the death itself, unnatural may be the wrong word. It was just unnecessarily brutal. He gets shot by at least four arrows, beaten down, thrown through a wall and then impaled. I think, it's pretty clear he was trying to shock people by showing he had no problems inflicting all of this on a ten year old. In the end though it just comes down to a difference of opinion. You think Snyder's run is poor writing while I think just the opposite. Morrison's run of Batman Inc in the New 52 was so dull to me I dropped it at issue 5.

#80 Posted by entropy_aegis (14533 posts) - - Show Bio

@gettogaara said:

@entropy_aegis: Maybe I missed something in Hush but why exactly are you comparing it to Court Of Owls? Tommy was his childhood friend, not his relative. As for Black Glove yes it had a secret society and a relative but it was over six years back. On top of that, like I told UncleEmu they may be similar but they have different purposes and that's what counts. I mean seriously, are writers supposed to not make an organization now just because someone else made another one? If we disregarded every new organization that came along and only accepted the League of Assassins then we wouldn't have much to read.

The whole point of the Court(Talons not included) is that they're unknown and keep themselves hidden behind those Owl masks. Exposing them and giving us information on each of the families involved would defeat the purpose. Lincoln could have gotten a bit more development but it was still surprising and enjoyable.

I wasn't claiming that Damian could beat Heretic, just that his chances would've been better without being shot by archers. As for the death itself, unnatural may be the wrong word. It was just unnecessarily brutal. He gets shot by at least four arrows, beaten down, thrown through a wall and then impaled. I think, it's pretty clear he was trying to shock people by showing he had no problems inflicting all of this on a ten year old. In the end though it just comes down to a difference of opinion. You think Snyder's run is poor writing while I think just the opposite. Morrison's run of Batman Inc in the New 52 was so dull to me I dropped it at issue 5.

Thomas Elliot=Lincoln March,both represent the exact same thing,they are the same villains only difference being their outlook/ gimmick.

The writers cans make organizations all the want,they shouldn't however execute them as horribly as the Court.The only problem with your Court=unknown theory is that Batman DOES KNOW,it's us the readers who dont and the reason for that is simple they're nobodies,the writer never made us care,they're useless,faceless mooks.I found nothing surprising about Lincoln,I could see his turn to villainy coming from a mile way,he was the only new character in the arc.

I dont see why Damian's age excuses him,he went in to trouble and he got his ass whooped,it happens.

#81 Posted by drphilter (109 posts) - - Show Bio

I think the notion that DotF could have really severed Bruce and Damian's relationship in his last weeks/months is a pretty big deal. I would be that will be explored, so DotF wasn't for nothing. It definitely is completely overshadowed thanks to Damian's death but oh well. I am one of the few who thought DotF was brilliant because it didn't go where everyone expected it to go. Everyone assumed people were dying, it has to be him or her and I think it would be a cop out to deliver something people expect. I think playing mental games with the Bat-family and Bats himself is every bit as awesome as having Joker murder someone (again). Also, it wasn't Snyder who cut his face off, just to clear that up.

I have enjoyed Morrison's work a lot, I don't really have any complaints in how it was handled aside from the fact that it didn't seem like ultra heroic necessarily. I mean he went out fighting and kicking ass, but I guess scale wise it seemed a little contained. I am personally really interested to see where the Bat books go. I REALLY hope Damian stays dead longer than Bruce did... please let it be maybe a couple of years, is that too much to ask for?

#82 Posted by FatihBATMAN (1389 posts) - - Show Bio

after watching the spoiler video including the damian dying scene, made me sob...damn

#83 Posted by gettogaara (164 posts) - - Show Bio

@entropy_aegis: I'm sorry but how are Hush and Lincoln March the same villain? The biggest similarity that come to mind are that they both have a connection to Batman's past and made him investigate to realize that connection. There's also the possibility that Lincoln's name might be Thomas as well but that shouldn't really matter. Besides for their outlooks, they also have completely different upbringings and reasons for being how they are. That's of course ignoring the differences in their designs, fighting styles and etc. Of course you could see him as a possible villain, I did as well. I think everyone gets suspicious of new characters but could you predict him claiming to be Bruce's brother? That's why it was surprising.

As for the Court, yes Batman knows them. He most likely took a look at all of the faces of those who were poisoned. I also remember Alfred telling him that he now knew several of the Court's most important members. However, what I'm saying is it would defeat the purpose to the readers if they were revealed. If Snyder wanted to he easily could have shown us some of the members earlier on and built them up but that wasn't the point. So yes, in a way they were nobodies but that in no way makes it horribly executed.

Again, on Damian we won't be able to see eye to eye on it so there's no point discussing his death any further.

#84 Posted by FatihBATMAN (1389 posts) - - Show Bio

@drphilter said:

I have enjoyed Morrison's work a lot, I don't really have any complaints in how it was handled aside from the fact that it didn't seem like ultra heroic necessarily. I mean he went out fighting and kicking ass, but I guess scale wise it seemed a little contained. I am personally really interested to see where the Bat books go. I REALLY hope Damian stays dead longer than Bruce did... please let it be maybe a couple of years, is that too much to ask for?

hes still a kid though, hes bound to have sme sort of fear in him...still hehe

#85 Posted by entropy_aegis (14533 posts) - - Show Bio

@gettogaara said:

@entropy_aegis: I'm sorry but how are Hush and Lincoln March the same villain? The biggest similarity that come to mind are that they both have a connection to Batman's past and made him investigate to realize that connection. There's also the possibility that Lincoln's name might be Thomas as well but that shouldn't really matter. Besides for their outlooks, they also have completely different upbringings and reasons for being how they are. That's of course ignoring the differences in their designs, fighting styles and etc. Of course you could see him as a possible villain, I did as well. I think everyone gets suspicious of new characters but could you predict him claiming to be Bruce's brother? That's why it was surprising.

As for the Court, yes Batman knows them. He most likely took a look at all of the faces of those who were poisoned. I also remember Alfred telling him that he now knew several of the Court's most important members. However, what I'm saying is it would defeat the purpose to the readers if they were revealed. If Snyder wanted to he easily could have shown us some of the members earlier on and built them up but that wasn't the point. So yes, in a way they were nobodies but that in no way makes it horribly executed.

Again, on Damian we won't be able to see eye to eye on it so there's no point discussing his death any further.

They both represent the exact same thing dude,an evil reflection/brother type.Both were the main villains of major and overhyped year long stories,both hate Bruce for...no reason at all,both were presented to us as good guys,both died,both look cool,both have next to no character or depth(Hush didn't when he was first introduced).It's the same villain with a different gimmick.

Yes I predicted Owlman and I predicted Lincoln March's turn to villainy,I didn't predict a brother cause I didn't expect the writer to be a hack.

And who exactly are these most important members? the reason why it was executed horribly is cause the writer was going for a mystery only for it to fizzle out.

#86 Posted by FatihBATMAN (1389 posts) - - Show Bio

@gettogaara said:

Again, on Damian we won't be able to see eye to eye on it so there's no point discussing his death any further.

one can still talk 'bout it right :D

#87 Posted by gettogaara (164 posts) - - Show Bio

@entropy_aegis: Okay, yeah they've got a couple of things in common but it's not like one is practically a clone of the other. Their hate is certainly irrational but they at least have their reasons. They're just psychos who think reasons like Bruce's father saving Hush's mother and Bruce not visiting a brother he never heard about are good reasons to want to kill someone lol. Also, when did Hush die? I might have missed it since I haven't read all of the comics involving him but I've read most of them.

I don't really think Snyder's a hack just because he wanted to incorporate Bruce's brother(I'm just going to call him his brother instead of possible from now on because after rereading it, I believe him) into the story line. I mean after all it is the New 52 so some events will have to be repeated considering history has been pretty much wiped.

As for the Court, I really think it just comes down to how you interpret the story. I thought that the Court wasn't revealed because who they were behind the masks wasn't really important to the story. Then again it could just be that Snyder was lazy or that he's going to bring them back in a later issue and reveal them since Batman knows most of them now.

@FatihBATMAN: Eh. At this point, I'm sort of moving past the death itself and am just interested in what the consequences will be.

#88 Posted by John Valentine (16307 posts) - - Show Bio

Yes, but I enjoyed it nonetheless.

#89 Posted by FatihBATMAN (1389 posts) - - Show Bio

me2 :)

#90 Posted by TDK_1997 (14480 posts) - - Show Bio

The crossover was indeed pointless and Morrison proved that he doesn't care what the others are thrying to do and what they are making because he is continuing his story and he should finish it.

#91 Posted by SupBatz (1705 posts) - - Show Bio

Absolutely not.

#92 Posted by BatWatch (2366 posts) - - Show Bio

Yeah, it pretty much seems like a complete reversal from what Snyder claimed was meant to happen at the end, but on that note, I never really bought into the idea that Joker's plan had caused a deep divide in the family. As best as I can tell, the story ended with all the different members withdrawing into their own little world to lick their wounds, but I did not see this as a long term action. They all needed a little time to figure things out, but their bonds were not really broken.

How do you think he ends his run :)?

Good question. Do you know something we don't, Phaed?

For more news, reviews, and commentary for the entire Bat Family, check out BatWatch.net.

#93 Edited by Eternal19 (2076 posts) - - Show Bio

We all knew from the beginning that DOTF wasnt going to have a major effect

#94 Posted by consolemaster001 (4991 posts) - - Show Bio
#95 Edited by Saren (25332 posts) - - Show Bio

You can't render pointless that which was pointless to begin with.

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