The paternal bond between Bruce Wayne and his Robins has been recurring theme throughout the Batman books. Various critically acclaimed storylines have induced change within the then-status quo in order to examine the depth of the relationship between the Dark Knight and his proteges.  In the current storyline, Batman Inc (2010), Batman and Co. embrace greater responsibilities while reaffirming their familial love for one another. One former sidekick, however, remains conspiciously absent: Jason Todd. In recent years, the former "rebel" Robin descended into brutal, Judge Dreddesque "heroism" as the Red Hood. Contrasting the fall of the second Robin, Dick Grayson, the first Robin and widely deemed the "favorite", ascended to the mantle of Batman, inheriting Gotham City, Robin, and its in-house Rogues. But what keeps the Red Hood from unveiling his shroud and joining his Bat-Bretheren? What makes Dick Grayson so special?  
 
Writer Frank Miller hinted at the warmth between Batman and Grayson in his widely lauded The Dark Knight Returns (1986). While never actually encountering his former sidekick, a highly cynical Caped Crusader makes numerous references to Grayson in his half-crazed monologues. Within the same storyline, Batman recruits the Sons of Batman, a group of deliquents reminiscent of the departed Jason Todd.   
 
The Dark Knight Strikes Back  (2001) marks the harsh reality between Batman and his Boy Wonders within the context of the plot. Mirroring the return of Jason Todd, Grayson reappears under the mantle of his mentor's bete noir, the Joker. Controversially, Batman labels the "Joker Boy" as ineffectual and weak, thrusting him into a smoldering explosion.     
 
Interestingly enough, Miller's Batman favors Jason Todd as the ideal Robin. Personality-wise, Todd equates to everything Grayson is not: aggressive, insensitive, murderous. Even in his death, Todd sublty influences the new philosophy espoused by Batman: in order to protect, one must govern the people. Aside from planning world domination, the Detective even turns a blind eye to Hawkboy murdering Lex Luthor. His reason? It's the future, and these are our new options. Evolve or die.  Tenets that chillingly echo the game plan followd by the Red Hood.    
 
Now back to Dick Grayson. What led to the schism in the original Dynamic Duo?  Was it the missing Grayson and his missing sensitivity that compelled Batman to adopt followers of the exact opposite temperameant? And how will seemingly Grayson-inspired Batman Inc. grow as opposed to Todd-inspired S.O.B.s?   
 
Also, what led Batman to fire his ol' chum? 
 
In the widely-reviled All Star Batman and Robin, Wayne makes it a point to praise Grayson's potential:   
 

In fact, during the course of Miller's Batman trilogy (All Star Batman and Robin, The Dark Knight Returns, and The Dark Knight Strikes Back), Wayne expresses a high esteem toward his protege, remarking that they boy could even surpass his fighting ability. Clearly, a love existed between the two of them. Maybe even a romantic love?  As comic book aficionados, we are all aware of the accusations of homosexuality targeted at our favorite rodent-themed vigilante and his colorful boy-mate. What if their dynamic fallout was the end result of a romantic quarrel? Readers never did receive a proper explanation behind those declarations of love Grayson bellowed in TDKSB. And a homosexual affair (read: shudo) gone sour would explain why Wayne nursed a preference for decidely unflamboyant, masculine soldiers. In that context, the climatic brawl between Batman and Joker Boy rings true; according to Frank Miller, the relationship between Batman and Joker is a "homophobic nightmare".      
 
Feedback, anyone?

I always saw the relationship between Batman and Robin as father-son like.

I'm so sick of the homosexual references with Batman and Robin, Bruce thinks of the Robin's as his sons plain and simple.  Dick's "declarations" of love could just be as Bruce as his father, can't a son love say they love their "father" or father figure without it be homosexual?  Those who want to interject homosexuality between the two need to be knocked up side of their heads.  Why is it so strange for Bruce to have a loving carrying relationship with those he is closest to?  The only sexual desire Bruce has is towards Selina and Talia, and Sable, and maybe still Vicki.  The love between Bruce and Dick are as father and son, family.   This topic has been done to death.
 

"I'm so sick of the homosexual references with Batman and Robin, Bruce thinks of the Robin's as his sons plain and simple.  Dick's "declarations" of love could just be as Bruce as his father, can't a son love say they love their "father" or father figure without it be homosexual?  Those who want to interject homosexuality between the two need to be knocked up side of their heads.  Why is it so strange for Bruce to have a loving carrying relationship with those he is closest to?  The only sexual desire Bruce has is towards Selina and Talia, and Sable, and maybe still Vicki.  The love between Bruce and Dick are as father and son, family.   This topic has been done to death. "

Well sure, but Batman according to Frank Miller ISN'T gay, and Batman and Robin are basically father and son.

"Well sure, but Batman according to Frank Miller ISN'T gay, and Batman and Robin are basically father and son. "

" @batmanary said:

"Well sure, but Batman according to Frank Miller ISN'T gay, and Batman and Robin are basically father and son. "

True, but as for the gay factor, maybe that's where TDKR diverges from canon.  Miller himself noted that "[he'd] be much healthier if he were gay." (Sharrett 38). And Millar isn't exactly known for portraying the most mentally sound Batman. "

I don't have anything to say on topic but that Robin vs GL page reminds me how I hate Miller's All-Star Batman.

" I'm so sick of the homosexual references with Batman and Robin, Bruce thinks of the Robin's as his sons plain and simple.  Dick's "declarations" of love could just be as Bruce as his father, can't a son love say they love their "father" or father figure without it be homosexual?  Those who want to interject homosexuality between the two need to be knocked up side of their heads.  Why is it so strange for Bruce to have a loving carrying relationship with those he is closest to?  The only sexual desire Bruce has is towards Selina and Talia, and Sable, and maybe still Vicki.  The love between Bruce and Dick are as father and son, family.   This topic has been done to death.  "

No, he isn't gay with Robin.

Batman loves dick. I don't have to say anything after that. Ignoring the fact that he's talking about Robin, this joke writes itself. Congratulations on making one of the most inappropriate titles on the Vine. 

" This is a hrash topic to Batman fans "

" No, he isn't gay with Robin. "

" @VampireSelektor: 
 So, instead of it being father and son (which they both refer to it as), Batman is a pedophile?     
 

 

And a homosexual affair (read: shudo) gone sour would explain why Wayne nursed a preference for decidely unflamboyant, masculine soldiers. In that context, the climatic brawl between Batman and Joker Boy rings true; according to Frank Miller, the relationship between Batman and Joker is a "homophobic nightmare".      
 

"@daredevil21134 said:

" This is a hrash topic to Batman fans "

Interesting, seeing as how Harley and Ivy banging off panel is readily welcomed and encouraged almost constantly. 
 
@InnerVenom123 said:

" No, he isn't gay with Robin. "

I love it when people disregard grammar to distinguish homosexuality from heterosexuality. He can't be gay with Robin, he couldn't even if they were both very overtly gay, you either are or you aren't. He could swim with Robin, eat with Robin, swing on swingsets with Robin but he can't gay with Robin nor can he be gay specifically with Robin. It's like saying "Oh those two aren't Jewish together, they just read the Torah" 
 
@batman_is_god said:

" @VampireSelektor: 
 So, instead of it being father and son (which they both refer to it as), Batman is a pedophile?     
 

Okay, I have to ask, how is it that this would make Bruce a pedophile? He's known Dick since he was young, sure, but he has been of age for a really long time and Bruce hardly took him into an atmosphere that was conventionally family-oriented so don't even bother with the incest implication either. 
 
Here's how I see it - I understand if you interpret their relationship as being more that of a father and son and I respect that because it's how it resonates with you. But what is really all that offensive about the implication, the theory, the slight notion that there is homoerotic subtext? I've seen so very many female characters given oodles and oodles of lesbian subtexts without a single fan batting a lash yet when it comes to Batman & Robin everyone is on the defensive as though it's somehow detrimental to the formula of the Batman mythology. It's an interpretation and clearly one that resonates with a lot and a lot of people or else it wouldn't come up as often as it does. How is it that no one expects this in a genre that is so very much about identity, the concealing of identity, desires, alter-egos, expression of convictions, descrimination, I'm sorry if this is some great revelation to you that I must deliver but comics have been highly gay friendly for these reasons. 
 

 

And a homosexual affair (read: shudo) gone sour would explain why Wayne nursed a preference for decidely unflamboyant, masculine soldiers. In that context, the climatic brawl between Batman and Joker Boy rings true; according to Frank Miller, the relationship between Batman and Joker is a "homophobic nightmare".      
 

 
 I don't think Batman has anything to do with it actually, at least not his characterization. We come from a generation that didn't celebrate the hero in tights and the new cliche is the cut-throat, unbeatable, dark, leather-clad, womanizer, stubble-faced, gravely-voiced, and almost comically (though unintentionally) pessimistic. Rorschach, Wolverine, Cable, Marv, Daredevil...they're pretty much grumpy old men given young forms with compensation issues. Since they hit it big, it's become all the rage to be desperately dark and aggressively resistant to any kind of sensitivity- look at Cyclops from the X-men! He used to be a boyscout who just wanted to chop logs in Alaska and now he's ordering hits and banging Emma Frost.   People are terrified of Robin, people are terrified of him possibly just being optimistic or softer than Bruce because all of a sudden a million fans get intrusive imagery of Robin's first costume with the bare legs, blatant innuendo, and campiness. They have to have an equally hoaky but more masculine balance to that equation so it's a guy who went nuts wearing red and black who's angry and screwed up.  In other words, the tenderness Bruce feels is probably still there but for fear of how it could possibly, almost, maybe, theoretically be interpreted, it's avoided like the plague.        "

-___-
 
I think this was just an excuse to use that title..........

People are way too jaded and cynical these days. Reading between the lines isn't a bad thing, but when there's really nothing there it's just obnoxious ignorance. Not everything has some hidden meaning to it. This discussion is totally opinionated because there's no proof either way. Comics are awesome. I love them to death. But most of the time they are just meant to entertain, not question your beliefs. Batman is awesome. It's that simple.

"

Batman is not gay "

" @Dark Walker said:

" I'm so sick of the homosexual references with Batman and Robin, Bruce thinks of the Robin's as his sons plain and simple.  Dick's "declarations" of love could just be as Bruce as his father, can't a son love say they love their "father" or father figure without it be homosexual?  Those who want to interject homosexuality between the two need to be knocked up side of their heads.  Why is it so strange for Bruce to have a loving carrying relationship with those he is closest to?  The only sexual desire Bruce has is towards Selina and Talia, and Sable, and maybe still Vicki.  The love between Bruce and Dick are as father and son, family.   This topic has been done to death.  "

(slow claps) Great post. "

"
Again,  the question was: 
 
"Is Batman secretly closeted WITHIN THE CONFINES OF THE DARK KNIGHT RETURNS?" "

God, why is it so difficult to have a discussion without rash feedback? Are those images listed above from The Dark Knight Returns ? No, but apparently the popular strategy among fanboys involves reinforcing Batman's sexuality with out-of-context "evidence". Batman could have a harem with the Birds of Prey for all I care. No one criticized Mark Millar for writing Ultimate Colossus as gay. There wasn't a single inflammatory response (save for Rob Liefield) when Shatterstar made out with Rictor.  Of course Batman is a much larger icon than the former two characters, but calm down, people! All I did was draw parallels between current continuity and TDKR and present the main question, which has nothing to do with canon. CALM THE FUCK DOWN, PEOPLE!

"@daredevil21134 said:

" This is a hrash topic to Batman fans "

Interesting, seeing as how Harley and Ivy banging off panel is readily welcomed and encouraged almost constantly. 
 
@InnerVenom123 said:

" No, he isn't gay with Robin. "

I love it when people disregard grammar to distinguish homosexuality from heterosexuality. He can't be gay with Robin, he couldn't even if they were both very overtly gay, you either are or you aren't. He could swim with Robin, eat with Robin, swing on swingsets with Robin but he can't gay with Robin nor can he be gay specifically with Robin. It's like saying "Oh those two aren't Jewish together, they just read the Torah" 
 
@batman_is_god said:

" @VampireSelektor: 
 So, instead of it being father and son (which they both refer to it as), Batman is a pedophile?     
 

Okay, I have to ask, how is it that this would make Bruce a pedophile? He's known Dick since he was young, sure, but he has been of age for a really long time and Bruce hardly took him into an atmosphere that was conventionally family-oriented so don't even bother with the incest implication either. 
 
Here's how I see it - I understand if you interpret their relationship as being more that of a father and son and I respect that because it's how it resonates with you. But what is really all that offensive about the implication, the theory, the slight notion that there is homoerotic subtext? I've seen so very many female characters given oodles and oodles of lesbian subtexts without a single fan batting a lash yet when it comes to Batman & Robin everyone is on the defensive as though it's somehow detrimental to the formula of the Batman mythology. It's an interpretation and clearly one that resonates with a lot and a lot of people or else it wouldn't come up as often as it does. How is it that no one expects this in a genre that is so very much about identity, the concealing of identity, desires, alter-egos, expression of convictions, descrimination, I'm sorry if this is some great revelation to you that I must deliver but comics have been highly gay friendly for these reasons. 
 

 

And a homosexual affair (read: shudo) gone sour would explain why Wayne nursed a preference for decidely unflamboyant, masculine soldiers. In that context, the climatic brawl between Batman and Joker Boy rings true; according to Frank Miller, the relationship between Batman and Joker is a "homophobic nightmare".      
 

 
 I don't think Batman has anything to do with it actually, at least not his characterization. We come from a generation that didn't celebrate the hero in tights and the new cliche is the cut-throat, unbeatable, dark, leather-clad, womanizer, stubble-faced, gravely-voiced, and almost comically (though unintentionally) pessimistic. Rorschach, Wolverine, Cable, Marv, Daredevil...they're pretty much grumpy old men given young forms with compensation issues. Since they hit it big, it's become all the rage to be desperately dark and aggressively resistant to any kind of sensitivity- look at Cyclops from the X-men! He used to be a boyscout who just wanted to chop logs in Alaska and now he's ordering hits and banging Emma Frost.   People are terrified of Robin, people are terrified of him possibly just being optimistic or softer than Bruce because all of a sudden a million fans get intrusive imagery of Robin's first costume with the bare legs, blatant innuendo, and campiness. They have to have an equally hoaky but more masculine balance to that equation so it's a guy who went nuts wearing red and black who's angry and screwed up.  In other words, the tenderness Bruce feels is probably still there but for fear of how it could possibly, almost, maybe, theoretically be interpreted, it's avoided like the plague.        "

My dad loves me and i love my father, i know gay people that hates his father, i mean the fact you love your father make you gay, i am sick and tired of this dumb point of view, Batman is the father of Robin like Alfred is the father of Batman.
Is not Romantic love.
We never see anything romantic about this two.

"People are way too jaded and cynical these days. Reading between the lines isn't a bad thing, but when there's really nothing there it's just obnoxious ignorance. Not everything has some hidden meaning to it. This discussion is totally opinionated because there's no proof either way. Comics are awesome. I love them to death. But most of the time they are just meant to entertain, not question your beliefs. Batman is awesome. It's that simple. "

" There's tons of proof regarding Bruce being heterosexual lol. I know what you're saying though. "

Between Dick and Bruce they have been with basically every women on the planet

LOL @ the fanboys crying.
 
 
 
Is he gay? Doubt it. But I dont care if he is or not. Batman is still cool.

" I'm so sick of the homosexual references with Batman and Robin, Bruce thinks of the Robin's as his sons plain and simple.  Dick's "declarations" of love could just be as Bruce as his father, can't a son love say they love their "father" or father figure without it be homosexual?  Those who want to interject homosexuality between the two need to be knocked up side of their heads.  Why is it so strange for Bruce to have a loving carrying relationship with those he is closest to?  The only sexual desire Bruce has is towards Selina and Talia, and Sable, and maybe still Vicki.  The love between Bruce and Dick are as father and son, family.   This topic has been done to death.  "

Batman is not homosexual...there's no more need for any discussion. It's not bad to be gay, but Bat's just isn't...hell I have a hard time believing someone as obsessed as him has any sexual interest in anyone. I forget the name of the artist on Year One, but he had a good point on this subject. Bruce is very much not an adult. He's stuck at eight years old emotionally, so his relationship with Dick, Jason, Tim, ect. is more of a brother or friend thing. The guy made a good point about Catwoman being a threat in the way that little girls scare little boys.

"

Batman is not gay "

"@daredevil21134 said:

"

Batman is not gay "

YAY looks a LOT better than her with jason "

after reading all of these posts im a little annoyed at the homophobic sentiments from alot of batman fans.  
 
there is alot of evidence pointing both ways but i do believe mainstream batman is straight while miller's elseword batman has major repressed homosexual tendencies. 

"after reading all of these posts im a little annoyed at the homophobic sentiments from alot of batman fans.   there is alot of evidence pointing both ways but i do believe mainstream batman is straight while miller's elseword batman has major repressed homosexual tendencies.  "

I still can't believe you're shocked that people reacted negatively to you making a statement that their favourite character is a pedophile.  This isn't a new theory, it's not even a legitimate one. It's just sad. 
 
As for the comments regarding Miller's record, he wrote a lot of great books. He's also written a lot of crap. DKSA falls into that category. 
 
George Lucas created Star Wars. He also created the prequels. Just because someone was good once, does not mean everything they touch is gold.

 @entropy_aegis said:

" @Valas said:

"after reading all of these posts im a little annoyed at the homophobic sentiments from alot of batman fans.   there is alot of evidence pointing both ways but i do believe mainstream batman is straight while miller's elseword batman has major repressed homosexual tendencies.  "

Yeah and miller is a hack plus its elseworld,supes was a communist in elseworlds and there is no evidence bothways,the guy who cooked this up was on a mission to destroy comics .BATMAN IS NOT GAY.@HexThis: Why are you so detemined to prove that he's gay? well guess what he's NOT, sorry to disappoint . show me a single instance of him doing something questionable with in context. "

" I still can't believe you're shocked that people reacted negatively to you making a statement that their favourite character is a pedophile.  This isn't a new theory, it's not even a legitimate one. It's just sad.   As for the comments regarding Miller's record, he wrote a lot of great books. He's also written a lot of crap. DKSA falls into that category.   George Lucas created Star Wars. He also created the prequels. Just because someone was good once, does not mean everything they touch is gold. "

@FadeToBlackBolt said:

" I still can't believe you're shocked that people reacted negatively to you making a statement that their favourite character is a pedophile.  This isn't a new theory, it's not even a legitimate one. It's just sad.   As for the comments regarding Miller's record, he wrote a lot of great books. He's also written a lot of crap. DKSA falls into that category.   George Lucas created Star Wars. He also created the prequels. Just because someone was good once, does not mean everything they touch is gold. "

I love how Bruce Wayne having feelings, theoretically, for Dick Grayson immediately makes him a pedophile. How old is Dick now?   "

" No, he isn't gay with Robin. "

"

Batman is not gay "

" I always saw the relationship between Batman and Robin as father-son like. "

Batman is gay for dudes.

" @HexThis: the subtext you are discussing does not fit with the context of the time. Who were the books marketed to back in the gold and silver age of comics (the ones you seem to refer to)? Little kids, mostly little boys. We're talking about the same little boys that invent things like cooties, don't let girls join their clubs, and generally see all contact with any female who aren't their mothers as fundamentally wrong. Maybe you have to be a man and go through this stage as a child to understand that this behavior has nothing to do with desiring a homosexual partnership with the other boys around you, at that time in life for most children the opposite sex is...scary and hard to understand (not sure if that changes much as we all mature lol). The book of the gold and silver age were aimed at these boys so they were written to relate to them. So there was no interest in women in these old books, and there was a lot of what has been interpreted as homosexual subtext but in reality is just supposed to reflect the closeness of childhood friendships. In all reality there are very few relationships in life as close those you had when you were a kid. Your emotions were new and you weren't extremely "deep" and you were around these other kids all the time. You'd get to go out and do something, you'd go see if the neighbor kid was home, there is a closeness there. This view of homosexual context is just a misinterpretation from old eyes, that forget what it was like back then."

Uhhh, Batman's sexual preferences shouldn't be of our concern O_O