Off My Mind: Batman Endangering Wayne Enterprise Employees

Posted by G-Man (25906 posts) - 2 years, 16 days ago - Show Bio

It's been a few months (in our time) since Bruce Wayne announced to the world that he has been funding Batman's war against crime. Now that Wayne Enterprises is providing technology for Batman Incorporated, what does that mean for Batman's enemies?
Batman has been fighting evil in Gotham City for years now. He's made a lot of enemies. Villains don't always play by the rules. They are often filled with the need for vengeance or revenge. In many cases, that's what drove them to become evil in the first place. They are not rational human beings. Whether their diabolical schemes have been based on revenge, money or prestige, they've always been thwarted by Batman. Time after time, scheme after scheme, Batman has been there to put a stop to them and send them off to Arkham Asylum.

Now that it's known that the employees of Wayne Enterprises are partners with Batman, in a way, that paints a giant target on every single employee. What better way for a crazed villain to stick it to Batman by threatening any of the innocent workers at Wayne Enterprises (or worse) ? How long until there are deadly casualties? == TEASER ==

It may be perceived that Bruce Wayne is doing the noble thing. He mentioned watching his parents get killed and wanting to do the right thing. Did he consult with his board of directors before making the announcement that they're fighting crime with Batman? Every employee, from the designers of Batman's new gadgets to the front door receptionist, is now in danger. What's to stop one of Batman's rogues from simply blowing up the entire building?

You could argue that everyone working at the Gotham City Police precinct could be facing the same danger. But police arresting bank robbers don't compare to Batman having the Joker or Two-Face locked up.

Soon in the pages of Red Robin #23, an assassin will be making an attempt on the lives of Bruce Wayne and Lucius Fox. Wayne Enterprises might offer great benefits for its employees but when an international assassin comes to town, it's going to take more than Casual Friday or donuts in the morning to make working there desirable.

With Bruce publicly stating that he's helping out Batman, it has added some protection to his secret identity. It helps to explain Bruce's activities and I'm sure this makes life easier for his accountant in explaining where large chunks of his money are going. It just doesn't seem that Bruce took the time to ask his employees if they were okay with this. They always have the option of resigning and getting a new job. I'm sure Bruce would give glowing recommendations. But how is that fair. When they applied for their job and made their life in Gotham, no one told them that someday it could all pose a threat against them.

With all of Bruce's technology and clever mind, he could easily come up with an insane amount of security for the building. He's managed to keep the Batcave safe all these years (for the most part). I still think the employees are now targets along with their families. It's most likely public knowledge who works for Wayne Enterprises. Some crazed villain could easily follow any of the hundreds of employees home at the end of the work day. The last thing Batman would want is the blood of an innocent on his hands. I want to know how he intends on keeping every single one of his employees safe and how long until his crazed enemies start targeting them.

Staff

#1 Posted by TDK_1997 (9657 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

I think the same way but Bruce knows what to do

#2 Posted by The Sadhu (853 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

The same could be said about any employee that works for Tony Stark... but I don't remember a story where someone went after any of his employees (thats not including Rhodes, Pepper or Happy)

Stark obviously thought it out... I'm sure Bruce did the same!

#3 Posted by Veidt (25 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

@The Sadhu: yes, the first thing I thought when reading this was "are Stark's?"
I recall reading some stories of Iron Man from the 60's (yes, that's going far ^^'). At that time, his employees were in danger because of the reds interest in damaging Starks facilities, and that was danger enough. But when Iron Man showed up in the scene "working for Stark", Stark Inc could become a target for his super-villains too. Yet, I don't remember it's facilities being threatened by any one other than the reds at that time (and maybe even an unhappy employee once).

#4 Posted by NightFang (9223 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

@TDK_1997 said:

" I think the same way but Bruce knows what to do "

#5 Posted by Eyz (3094 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

Well, they were already building hitech gadgets, weapons, dangerous technology and stuff.
I guess the villains that want to strike against that will continue, some will try stealing Batman tech from Wayne enterprise probably.

#6 Edited by Evpraksiya (252 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

Bat doesn't need to think about those stuff, he's above..like tony stark, thinking ; they get what they want, "people gets killed? too bad but i saved a few...don't worry i'm the best"
but if i was a villain knowing that Wayne corp gives money to batman...really i don't care since his debut he's got money, so i do my job, i don't give a damn about Wayne's secretary ..and if i'm a crappy villain with a gap between ears (or just a naughty naugthy villain) then i will take hostage and kill people...but it's like everyday..so Wayne/Bat is just passing another level of his godlike personality, too proud, no shame.

i'm a bit harsh sorry to the fan..

#7 Posted by Soldier zero (250 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

Welcome to "How Batman constantly endanger the lives of people around him chapter 2569".

Sorry for the sarcasm, but I think that this article is really just another page of the eternal question if Batman is helping or harming Gotham, onlty taken on a different scale.
I agree with the idea that publicy announcing that he's the one behind Batman's tech wasn't a a smart move in the long run for at least 3 reasons:

He made his employees into targets as G-Man observed;
Someone in the goverment will surely be interested in getting their hands on Batman tech (not to mention JLA tech, also made by the Wayne Industries), and infiltrating the Wayne Industries is surely easier than catching the Bat himself;
How long before someone targets Bruce Wayne to get to be Bat. He said that he built and financed all of Batman's gear since day one, it stand to reason that he might know Batman secret identity.

In my opinion all that Bruce really accomplished is to paint a giant target on his playboy multi-millionare back.

Someone has quoted Stark as an example of how to handle the situation, in a old story from the 70s (I think it was by David Michelinie), Stark had to deal with the worker unions about the super-villains risk that his employees were exposed to. In the end he had to give a substantial raise to all his employees and put together a "super-villain insurance plan", which as funny as it might sound it isn't.

#8 Posted by Emperor Gonzo Noir (19681 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

Living in Gotham in of itself is a health and safety hazard.

#9 Posted by Xenozoic Shaman (410 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

Turn every one of his employees into a Batman/woman.

#10 Posted by sEsposito7 (454 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

This is one of the problems that I have with Batman, Inc. -- I just don't think Bruce would ever 'come out' the way the he did. It was a bad decision, and it's just not characteristic of him.

I've argued before that Batman, Inc. is or is going to be pretty much a flop, and this is one of the more pragmatic reasons behind my argument. Also, Dick is operating in Gotham and we've seen very little presence (in Detective Comics, at least) of Bruce or Wayne-Tech. I think the people of Gotham would have caused a much larger backlash than was shown post-announcement, let alone the people around the world who are effected by Batman, Inc. at the staggeringly fast past of 1/6 of an adventure per 3 months. -.-

When the dust settles, Batman, Inc. is going to be one of those 'meh memories' and Detective Comics, and Dick as Batman in general, will be regarded as one of the great runs of our time. Which is good news, because at least Batman, Inc. won't be a total loss.

#11 Posted by isaac_clarke (4404 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

I doubt Bruce cares about his canon foddger employees. Otherwise he would actually build a prison that would keep his rogue's gallery from not busting out after a few months.

#12 Posted by matthuliz (12 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

Answer is a big YES!!!

Bruce Wayne's only salvation if he will mass produce robocops to protect every citizen!

http://matthuliz.multiply.com/

#13 Posted by Blurred View (362 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

This would be an interesting story to explore, especially if it's used to bring about the inevitable end of Batman Incorporated.

#14 Posted by twisted17 (29 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

Interesting dynamic. This could definitely be explored by the writers in some future storyline. Though I seriously doubt Wayne Enterprise employees now getting a larger life-insurance package with their job, Wayne could definitely get sued by employees for "unmanageable working conditions" (considering that nearly all the rogues want to kill them painfully doesn't leave much room to get any work done.)

But of course, Gotham is pretty much used to being a damned city since it started. People have been getting used to the crime, they find it hard to imagine that nothing bad will ever happen to them. They do expect the inevitable, since Gotham is full of crime, but now people related to Wayne are going to be looking over their shoulders a lot more than before.

#15 Edited by azza04 (1503 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

You're spot on here G-Man. If i were an employee of Wayne Enterprise i would quit asap. No amount of company benifits is going to make me feel better about being on some of Batman's worst enemies hit list.

I think this move could comeback to haunt Bruce.

#16 Posted by johnny_spam (2001 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

I am sorry but this article I think is reaching out for a chance too much first of all they are employes at Wayne Enterprises just like STAR Labs or Cadmus a company that has always been broken into whenever it is convenient for the writer. Being part of Batman Incorporated is not going to change things much since they were always in danger.

The focus is also much more on Batman team ups and international intrigue than the day to day business it just provides a way to explain how Batman is doing this.

#17 Posted by Moonleming (39 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

Working for Wayne Enterprises is no more dangerous then living in Gotham City. If anything your probably safer. I'm sure they pay well affording you more chances to live safely - better part of town, more secures buildings, reliable car, cell phone...etc. As far as his employees outside of Gotham again as long as your out of Gotham I would think your chances were roughly the same amount of peril that everyone in the DCU faces. For me the biggest stretch in the entire bat-mythos is why people remain in that city. Would anyone really be willing to live in a city where there are about a dozen Jeffery Dahmer's regularly escaping? Even that is a tame comparison when you factor in the scale at which said loons are willing to operate at. Burning the whole city, contagions.. list goes on and on. A known ridiculously dirty police force. Why do they stay? Must be because of how their nowhere near a major cataclysmic fault line - oh wait. Seriously you read a lot of debate about Batman's mental stability but not much about the citizenry of Gotham City. Coast City was repopulated because "The Sinestro Corp War" created sort of a Earth Pride thing so I can at least find that bone acceptable. But Gotham City has only ever paid it's citizens back with more misery. .

#18 Posted by UnosInfinitos (148 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

Maybe now every batployee will receive patented batman utility belt and some bat-fu training :D
Or better yet they all now emit the same jobber aura he does!

"Hello my name is Elizabeth Waltz in my free time I'm your standard 30 yr old community college graduate but during nine to five I AM LISA FROM ACCOUNTING!"

#19 Posted by Feliciano2040 (654 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

@UnosInfinitos said:

" Maybe now every batployee will receive patented batman utility belt and some bat-fu training :DOr better yet they all now emit the same jobber aura he does!"Hello my name is Elizabeth Waltz in my free time I'm your standard 30 yr old community college graduate but during nine to five I AM LISA FROM ACCOUNTING!" "

Have you ever read "Gutters" ? You should propose this to them.

And well, obviously the employees being at danger is a concern indeed, I don't think Morrison is going to adress anywhere in the future, specially with his penchant for screwing with our minds.

#20 Posted by PhoenixoftheTides (2883 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

The best part about this storyline is that Batman Inc. may very easily become the next OMAC, which would be interesting.

#21 Posted by RedheadedAtrocitus (5853 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

This is odd but I had never considered this before. And it makes sense that perhaps employees of Wayne Enterprises could be in potential danger now due to Batman, Inc. and Bruce coming out publicly with the revelation that he finances the Dark Knight's operations. In truth Bruce did everything short of revealing his alias to the public with that stunt and personally for me I think he really exposed his own company to danger by doing this in light of Batman, Inc. Now enemies can terrorize employees of the company, possibly commit industrial espionage on a much easier scale, and just create general chaos. But for some reason I can't help but think of Bruce as being the ultimate manipulator, and that maybe, just maybe this was all part of his plan. After all, in this new era of war on crime perhaps its no longer the old paradigm of the creature of the shadows looking for wrongdoing...but having the wrongdoing come right to the doorstep of the Caped Crusader. In truth its just another reason why there are only two results of this whole thing...either Bruce succeeds greater than he has before...or some change revamps it all to where Batman is confined to the shadows. Only time will tell really.

#22 Posted by InnerVenom123 (27539 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

Joker's just gonna blow up the building. Batman's being an idiot and a tool right now.

#23 Posted by G-Man (25906 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

I wonder if at least Lucius was told before Bruce's announcement. Sure he may have a good idea about Batman's secret but I want to know if there was any official discussion before. That could be interesting or boring in an actual comic but I'd at least like a reference.

Staff

#24 Posted by spider-man 2996 (660 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

@azza04 said:

I think this move could comeback to haunt Bruce. "

#25 Posted by ChadwickDavis (439 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

Personally I think that, as a whole, this won't affect the employees much in a negative way. In fact I think it will bring a very positive. While I do think that there will be some people who leave the company due to the fear of being a target, the rest will stay primarily for one reason...IT'S GOTHAM CITY. Their crime rate is horrible even with the aid of Batman, and if your boss is "helping" him in his war on crime that would essentially make you a VIP of sorts. It would also leave a lot of room to negotiate Raises and Health benefits. On top of that the possibility for increased security would increase jobs, the recommendation for Bruce Wayne would substantial, and if you had a part in making something he actually used against Two Face, the Joker, or with the Justice League that would give you a lot of bragging rights. Unfortunately this also opens the door for corporate minded villains to disrupt things from the inside i.e. Penguin, the Falcone, etc. as potential staff.

#26 Posted by BlueStarr86 (51 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

They live in Gotham City. Long story short: if they were really concerned for their safety, they wouldn't live in Gotham. Being a part of Batman inc. doesn't really increase the danger that much all things told.

#27 Posted by Midnight Monk (225 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

I'm with everyone here, if you live in Gotham City and haven't moved out yet then you are without a doubt already mentality deranged and quite possibly a dangerous SOB

#28 Posted by kimeraevet (188 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

The employees of Wayne Enterprises are in no more danger with Bruce outing himself as Batman's Q than they were beforehand. Gotham is a hellish and dangerous place (serial killing sociopaths and psychotics, earthquakes, disease outbreaks, nuclear bombs, massive police corruption and organized crime, etc.) more than any other DCU metro area. At least now the less crazy threats are less willing to attack anything Wayne out of fear of attracting unwanted Bat attention. If anything, the employees are safer from all of Batman's rouges except for the Joker, but then really no one is safe from Mr. J. He is a multi-spree serial killer with hundreds of bodies to his count. Hitler had a harder time killing people than the Joker does. If I were Bruce, I'd assign a squadron of aerial drones and a cadre of surveillance technicians and cameras to maintain a constant eyes-on the Joker at all times.

#29 Posted by entropy_aegis (12319 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

It's only an issue if the writer makes it.

#30 Posted by entropy_aegis (12319 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

@sEsposito7 said:

" This is one of the problems that I have with Batman, Inc. -- I just don't think Bruce would ever 'come out' the way the he did. It was a bad decision, and it's just not characteristic of him.

I've argued before that Batman, Inc. is or is going to be pretty much a flop, and this is one of the more pragmatic reasons behind my argument. Also, Dick is operating in Gotham and we've seen very little presence (in Detective Comics, at least) of Bruce or Wayne-Tech. I think the people of Gotham would have caused a much larger backlash than was shown post-announcement, let alone the people around the world who are effected by Batman, Inc. at the staggeringly fast past of 1/6 of an adventure per 3 months. -.-When the dust settles, Batman, Inc. is going to be one of those 'meh memories' and Detective Comics, and Dick as Batman in general, will be regarded as one of the great runs of our time. Which is good news, because at least Batman, Inc. won't be a total loss. "

When the dust settles Tec won't be remembered at all,Paul Dini and Dixon wrote spectacular tales in tec(which were better than this) and neither are that fondly remembered.
The simple reason is that like this tec those tecs did nothing in the long run,they were all small time well written books,nothing more.
INC will be remembered,whether it sucks or succeede cause it atleast tried to do something memorable.

#31 Posted by karrob (4203 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

@Emperor Gonzo Noir said:

" Living in Gotham in of itself is a health and safety hazard.

"

#32 Posted by sEsposito7 (454 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

@entropy_aegis said:

" @sEsposito7 said:
" This is one of the problems that I have with Batman, Inc. -- I just don't think Bruce would ever 'come out' the way the he did. It was a bad decision, and it's just not characteristic of him.

I've argued before that Batman, Inc. is or is going to be pretty much a flop, and this is one of the more pragmatic reasons behind my argument. Also, Dick is operating in Gotham and we've seen very little presence (in Detective Comics, at least) of Bruce or Wayne-Tech. I think the people of Gotham would have caused a much larger backlash than was shown post-announcement, let alone the people around the world who are effected by Batman, Inc. at the staggeringly fast past of 1/6 of an adventure per 3 months. -.-When the dust settles, Batman, Inc. is going to be one of those 'meh memories' and Detective Comics, and Dick as Batman in general, will be regarded as one of the great runs of our time. Which is good news, because at least Batman, Inc. won't be a total loss. "
When the dust settles Tec won't be remembered at all,Paul Dini and Dixon wrote spectacular tales in tec(which were better than this) and neither are that fondly remembered.The simple reason is that like this tec those tecs did nothing in the long run,they were all small time well written books,nothing more.INC will be remembered,whether it sucks or succeede cause it atleast tried to do something memorable. "

I have to respectively -- thought thoroughly -- disagree with you. We can both agree that Inc. will be remembered. However, I believe that it won't be remembered very fondly. It's plagued by a lack of momentum (which is cause by delays) and by a story that really doesn't seem to do what it wanted to do. That's just my opinion.

As far as 'Tec goes, you can't possibly say that Scott Snyder isn't breaking new ground -- he definitely is. Dick is Batman, and more so than Morrison did in Batman and Robin, we're really getting a feel for what that's like for him. The entire story is about something different. It started out as Dick in Bruce's world (Gotham), but Snyder has morphed that theme into Dick in Dick's own Gotham. The villains, the darkness that Dick is surrounded by; everything is a reflection of who Dick is as a person and how he's very different from Bruce.

I cannot see this run being forgotten. It's just too good. The one thing that it might have against it in terms of longevity is that it might not stick with Bruce fans. I'm a life long fan of Grayson, so for me to love the series as much as I do is only natural, but I can see how maybe some fans of Bruce may not care all that much about the series in the long run. But it's not fair or correct to say that 'Tec is not doing anything in the long run.

#33 Posted by Noctis (1390 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

He's BATMAN, I'm sure he has his employees covered.

#34 Posted by carnivalofsins00 (938 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

@The Sadhu: Well in the last arc, with Doc Ock, a couple of his employees were captured by Sandman and Electro due to Doc Ock's orders.

#35 Posted by dewboy01 (1826 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

If there's going to be a batman inc. then were going to need a bigger cave.

#36 Posted by dondasch (921 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

While the article by G Man may be far reaching (over reaching ?), I have a nagging suspicion that this entire announcement of Bruce Wayne funding Batman will be written out of continuity relatively soon. It seems like such stretch for Bruce to announce that he's the funding for Batman. Doesn't seem to add up to me as to why the writer would do this. Granted, Bruce will have already thought ahead of this but again, why ?

#37 Posted by ragman1138 (2727 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

THATS A RANDOM QUESTION ISENT IT??

#38 Posted by G-Man (25906 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

@Noctis: Except for Barbar Gordon back when Joker paid her a visit? But then, I suppose he didn't know she had a real connection to Batman.

@dondasch: There is an assassination story coming up in Red Robin. It was hinted that it could be because they're at Wayne Enterprises or maybe some other deep dark secret from their past. But the fact that DC is using it as a tease means I'm not the only one thinking about the possibility.

Staff

#39 Edited by invadernick (7 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

LOL in the real world he would have probably been sued for defrauding his investors and not keeping transparent accounting records.

#40 Posted by entropy_aegis (12319 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

@sEsposito7 said:

" @entropy_aegis said:
" @sEsposito7 said:
" This is one of the problems that I have with Batman, Inc. -- I just don't think Bruce would ever 'come out' the way the he did. It was a bad decision, and it's just not characteristic of him.

I've argued before that Batman, Inc. is or is going to be pretty much a flop, and this is one of the more pragmatic reasons behind my argument. Also, Dick is operating in Gotham and we've seen very little presence (in Detective Comics, at least) of Bruce or Wayne-Tech. I think the people of Gotham would have caused a much larger backlash than was shown post-announcement, let alone the people around the world who are effected by Batman, Inc. at the staggeringly fast past of 1/6 of an adventure per 3 months. -.-When the dust settles, Batman, Inc. is going to be one of those 'meh memories' and Detective Comics, and Dick as Batman in general, will be regarded as one of the great runs of our time. Which is good news, because at least Batman, Inc. won't be a total loss. "
When the dust settles Tec won't be remembered at all,Paul Dini and Dixon wrote spectacular tales in tec(which were better than this) and neither are that fondly remembered.The simple reason is that like this tec those tecs did nothing in the long run,they were all small time well written books,nothing more.INC will be remembered,whether it sucks or succeede cause it atleast tried to do something memorable. "
I have to respectively -- thought thoroughly -- disagree with you. We can both agree that Inc. will be remembered. However, I believe that it won't be remembered very fondly. It's plagued by a lack of momentum (which is cause by delays) and by a story that really doesn't seem to do what it wanted to do. That's just my opinion.As far as 'Tec goes, you can't possibly say that Scott Snyder isn't breaking new ground -- he definitely is. Dick is Batman, and more so than Morrison did in Batman and Robin, we're really getting a feel for what that's like for him. The entire story is about something different. It started out as Dick in Bruce's world (Gotham), but Snyder has morphed that theme into Dick in Dick's own Gotham. The villains, the darkness that Dick is surrounded by; everything is a reflection of who Dick is as a person and how he's very different from Bruce.I cannot see this run being forgotten. It's just too good. The one thing that it might have against it in terms of longevity is that it might not stick with Bruce fans. I'm a life long fan of Grayson, so for me to love the series as much as I do is only natural, but I can see how maybe some fans of Bruce may not care all that much about the series in the long run. But it's not fair or correct to say that 'Tec is not doing anything in the long run. "

What ground has Snyder broken? I'm dying to know.Villians? you think Dealer is a good villian,some guy who decided to copy Bane and man-bat? or James Gordon Jr? .I'm starting to get a Jeph Loeb vibe from Snyder honestly,he too was overrated for writing crap like TLH and look at him now.This run has only been 6 issues and people are already treating it like some holy book,if you believe it won't be forgotten then how about mentioning atleast one memorable moment ?
Again i wont deny that the stories are indeed well written,but they are not better than anything Dini or Dixon did on the title,not even close actually.
Batman & Robin was actually more about Damian than it was about Dick.Inc will pick up by this time next year i'm willing to bet that it will completly overshadow all of DC just like Batman and & Robin,everything else will seem worthless during that period.Mark my words.

#41 Posted by Veidt (25 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

I think that the common people that lives in the comics (how else should I name them?) are way dumber than real common people of our world... I mean, if the stories were real, how long would it take for people to raise the question: "so, is Wayne Batman? hey, that's it! of course!" ?

#42 Posted by sEsposito7 (454 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

@entropy_aegis said:

" @sEsposito7 said:
" @entropy_aegis said:
" @sEsposito7 said:
" This is one of the problems that I have with Batman, Inc. -- I just don't think Bruce would ever 'come out' the way the he did. It was a bad decision, and it's just not characteristic of him.

I've argued before that Batman, Inc. is or is going to be pretty much a flop, and this is one of the more pragmatic reasons behind my argument. Also, Dick is operating in Gotham and we've seen very little presence (in Detective Comics, at least) of Bruce or Wayne-Tech. I think the people of Gotham would have caused a much larger backlash than was shown post-announcement, let alone the people around the world who are effected by Batman, Inc. at the staggeringly fast past of 1/6 of an adventure per 3 months. -.-When the dust settles, Batman, Inc. is going to be one of those 'meh memories' and Detective Comics, and Dick as Batman in general, will be regarded as one of the great runs of our time. Which is good news, because at least Batman, Inc. won't be a total loss. "
When the dust settles Tec won't be remembered at all,Paul Dini and Dixon wrote spectacular tales in tec(which were better than this) and neither are that fondly remembered.The simple reason is that like this tec those tecs did nothing in the long run,they were all small time well written books,nothing more.INC will be remembered,whether it sucks or succeede cause it atleast tried to do something memorable. "
I have to respectively -- thought thoroughly -- disagree with you. We can both agree that Inc. will be remembered. However, I believe that it won't be remembered very fondly. It's plagued by a lack of momentum (which is cause by delays) and by a story that really doesn't seem to do what it wanted to do. That's just my opinion.As far as 'Tec goes, you can't possibly say that Scott Snyder isn't breaking new ground -- he definitely is. Dick is Batman, and more so than Morrison did in Batman and Robin, we're really getting a feel for what that's like for him. The entire story is about something different. It started out as Dick in Bruce's world (Gotham), but Snyder has morphed that theme into Dick in Dick's own Gotham. The villains, the darkness that Dick is surrounded by; everything is a reflection of who Dick is as a person and how he's very different from Bruce.I cannot see this run being forgotten. It's just too good. The one thing that it might have against it in terms of longevity is that it might not stick with Bruce fans. I'm a life long fan of Grayson, so for me to love the series as much as I do is only natural, but I can see how maybe some fans of Bruce may not care all that much about the series in the long run. But it's not fair or correct to say that 'Tec is not doing anything in the long run. "
What ground has Snyder broken? I'm dying to know.Villians? you think Dealer is a good villian,some guy who decided to copy Bane and man-bat? or James Gordon Jr? .I'm starting to get a Jeph Loeb vibe from Snyder honestly,he too was overrated for writing crap like TLH and look at him now.This run has only been 6 issues and people are already treating it like some holy book,if you believe it won't be forgotten then how about mentioning atleast one memorable moment ?Again i wont deny that the stories are indeed well written,but they are not better than anything Dini or Dixon did on the title,not even close actually.Batman & Robin was actually more about Damian than it was about Dick.Inc will pick up by this time next year i'm willing to bet that it will completly overshadow all of DC just like Batman and & Robin,everything else will seem worthless during that period.Mark my words. "

The very concept of what Snyder is doing in 'Tec has broken new ground. The villains have been great so far. The Dealer is a chilling and quasi-realistic villain, and he does what every good Batman villain does -- he plays on Batman's darkest psychological troubles and he does it with Dick under the cowl. There would be no interest in seeing Dick swinging around fighting crime in Bruce's Gotham. The reason 'Tec is so amazing is because it's a fresh new take and we haven't lost Grayson's identity under the cowl.

And the Jeph Loeb shot? Really, the Long Halloween is crap? It's one of the best Batman stories every written, critically acclaimed and a fan-favorite. Loeb is a great writer. He's written some of the best comic book stories of the modern age. To be fair, I stopped reading Marvel books before he got on Hulk, which I've heard people hate.

A memorable moment? The entire first arc was nearly unforgettable. And the issue where Barbara, Jim and James Jr. are in the diner is some of the best story telling that I've read in years. I'm not treating it as a 'holy book' prematurely, I'm treating it as it is: my favorite -- and I'd say best -- book on the stands.

Dini and Dixon both did excellent stuff in 'Tec, but not like this. Snyder, Jock and Francavilla have nailed it in my opinion. They've gotten Gotham right, Dick right, the Gordon's right, etc... And they're making this an original story, grounded in continuity.

Batman, Inc. may pick up, but it's taking a damn long time to get off the ground. I hope it does, I'm not rooting for it to fail; I like Morrison's stories. It just seems like it's going to far into left field at far too slow a pace.

#43 Posted by Out_of_Space (720 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

@TDK_1997 said:

" I think the same way but Bruce knows what to do "

Agreed.

#44 Posted by waruikumo (357 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

Is Wayne Enterprises public?

#45 Posted by Emperormeister734 (714 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

Hey battling evil as a business was never going to be easy

#46 Posted by ssnyder1835 (9 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

@entropy_aegis:
Hi Entropy. It's Scott Snyder. I appreciate you taking the time to read my run on TEC and give your thoughts. And I'd never claim to be doing anything close to what Dini or Dixon have done, or even Jeph Loeb whose TLH and Dark Victory i love, personally. The only thing I can say for our run is that it's a story we all (Jock, FF, Dave Daron, and me) believe in strongly, and what I hope is coming across is that the whole 11-part run is actually one big take on Gotham. It's an exploration of Gotham as a twisted fun-house mirror to the people who try to do good for the city - the way it has this disturbing way of conjuring up villains and challenges that speak to a hero's greatest vulnerabilities. Meaning, for Bruce, Gotham throws back all these villains who are really just extensions of Bruce's own obsessions, taken to the extreme. Two-face being the duality of Bruce's life. Joker being who Bruce would be if he descended fully into the cave... So what we're trying to do is explore how that sort of city - some kind of black mirror city - would treat Dick Grayson. So the Dealer isn't a villain I'm prod of simply b/c he's creepy, but b/c he harnesses the worst in people, the buried desire to be bad and laud evil. And in that way, he's a good foil for Dick. who (unlike Bruce) puts a lot of stock in the goodness in people. He's a more hopeful man, less misanthropic. He has faith in the human character. So a villain that believes in the divine nature of humanity's capacity for evil is something that for me, makes a scary opponent for Dick. For Bruce, the Dealer would be easily dispatched, but he hits a deeper nerve w/Dick. And if the first cycle is about showing Dick how dark regular people can be (hence the crowbar), this second arc is about showing how dark street criminals can be. How unafraid of Batman. And the third cycle... well, I don;t want to give anything away, but I do promise it'll bring the James Jr. story and the Dick Grayson story lines together in a big way. And speaking to the James Jr. story - for me, James is the same nightmare for Jim Gordon that the Dealer is for Dick, just more central and direct. Meaning, Gordon is all about cause and effect, clues adding up. But what if his own son, his only biological child, is a person who doesn't add up? What is that person is an enigma, in a frightening way? (Though believe me, by 878 you will know whether James is, as Babs thinks, a brilliant serial killer, or (as Jim hopes) a troubled young man struggling with a neurological disorder... Anyway, the point is, whether or not we're any good or breaking new ground, we are all excited about the story we have to tell. And it is one big story, one exploration of a singular idea. Thanks again for checking us out :) S

#47 Posted by ssnyder1835 (9 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

Dave BARON, not Daron - typo :)

#48 Posted by G-Man (25906 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

@ssnyder1835: Ha ha. You could've edited your post before anyone noticed! (And nice to see you posting here!)

Staff

#49 Posted by ssnyder1835 (9 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

@G-Man: thanks man. I'll spell check next time :)

#50 Posted by Doctor!!!!! (2053 posts) - 2 years, 15 days ago - Show Bio

Bruce got a little cocky there.

Batman Inc.

Batman Inc. is the result of Bruce Wayne using the concept and idea of Batman to counter-act the idea of crime. His goal is to make Batman a global franchise and stop crime around the world.

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