Neither Batgirl nor Oracle?

#1 Posted by SupBatz (1737 posts) - - Show Bio

As everybody undoubtably knows, Barbara Gordon being made able to walk again has been amongst the most controversal aspects of the "New 52".

Some people like her back as Batgirl. Some people don't like it so much. And a lot seem unsure how they feel.

I think I'm in the latter category. And I've been asking myself why that is for a while.

I've reached the conclusion that it's not so much Babs being back in action that irks me so much as the fact that she ran right back to being Batgirl.

This got me thinking: rather than just throwing her back in a wheelchair and having her become Oracle again, would it be possible to have her retain her mobility and yet still be Oracle (or an Oracle-like charatcer?)

It's bittersweet seeing her back in action as Batgirl - on the one hand I like seeing Babs on the street kicking butt and being a hero. On the other hand. Batgirl kind of feels like a step backwards. Oracle showed that Barbara has evolved over the years from some kid in a Bat suit to an intelligent, independed, and strong character. (And in my honest opinion - since the new 52 started, I feel like she has been dumbed down and weakened).

I'm starting to ramble so I'll just get to the point - I think that Barbara should lose the Batgirl persona (give it back to Cassie or Stephanie) and should become a new hero (a sort of blend between Oracle and Batgirl maybe?). Or perhaps just take the name Oracle again but still fight crime and keep her ability to walk.

Does anybody else agree?

#2 Posted by AweSam (7375 posts) - - Show Bio

I totally agree. She played a bigger, more important role as Oracle. I also agree she should maintain her mobility. I hated the idea of her being in a wheelchair, it really damaged her character. When I think Barbara, I think an active, jumpy, redhead, but I also think an important member of the team. Her role as Batgirl is great, but you can't just cripple the hyperactive Babs, make her mature and calmer, then throw her back to her former role. To me, the New 52 is just a step or phase of the reboot process. It's more of an experiment before they come up with a good move that everyone can agree with. That's why instead of complaining and ranting about how it sucks, I'm just patiently waiting. On topic, yes, I believe she should become Oracle again, just without the wheelchair. The identity of Batgirl's been passed around for years. they all evolved into their own identities (Oracle, Nightwing, Red Hood, etc).

#3 Posted by Blood1991 (8098 posts) - - Show Bio

@AweSam said:

I totally agree. She played a bigger, more important role as Oracle. I also agree she should maintain her mobility. I hated the idea of her being in a wheelchair, it really damaged her character. When I think Barbara, I think an active, jumpy, redhead, but I also think an important member of the team. Her role as Batgirl is great, but you can't just cripple the hyperactive Babs, make her mature and calmer, then throw her back to her former role. To me, the New 52 is just a step or phase of the reboot process. It's more of an experiment before they come up with a good move that everyone can agree with. That's why instead of complaining and ranting about how it sucks, I'm just patiently waiting. On topic, yes, I believe she should become Oracle again, just without the wheelchair. The identity of Batgirl's been passed around for years. they all evolved into their own identities (Oracle, Nightwing, Red Hood, etc).

Pretty much my feelings. I prefer Oracle, but I would rather her choose to be less active on the field and still have some Batgirl kick assness in her than her go back to the wheel chair.

#4 Posted by danhimself (22564 posts) - - Show Bio

the problem I have is that unlike Dick returning to the Nightwing identity, Babs going back to being Batgirl really is a step back for the character....she had moved on and stepped into a much bigger and more important role in the DC Universe and other characters stepped up to the Batgirl mantle...I agree that she should retain her ability to walk but that she should go back to being Oracle again and let Stephanie Brown or Cassandra Cain step up to the Batgirl role

#5 Posted by X9 (757 posts) - - Show Bio

Awwn, this again?!

Forget Oracle, she was playing the role no one wanted their favorite character to play. The only reason I liked Oracle was because she was Barbara Gordon and I like Barbara Gordon ¬¬ About that bigger role everyone say she played as Oracle... well, it certainly explains why most people don't even know she was Oracle ¬¬ Or immediately associate her with Batgirl.

I honestly think Gail is doing a great job with Babs back as Batgirl. She's a young woman with deep personality and great potential as a character. Will she move on to a new superhero identity? Maybe. She probably won't be Batgirl forever. Will she play the role she used to play as Oracle again? I don't think she'll get away from the field in the New 52 anytime soon (thank God) but, if she does, I'm sure they're not putting her back in a wheelchair. (check the sales, readers like her OUT of it)

Last but not least: DC has already said Steph and Cass will show up. I don't know where and I don't know when, but they will. And that's enough for me. Will one of them be Batgirl? Probably not, but I'm sure writes have better plans for them.

#6 Posted by moywar700 (2775 posts) - - Show Bio

Batgirl(barbara gordon) can do anything oracle can do and much more.

#7 Posted by X9 (757 posts) - - Show Bio

@moywar700 said:

Batgirl(barbara gordon) can do anything oracle can do and much more.

Thank you

#8 Posted by Madame_Mist (1325 posts) - - Show Bio

I would like to see more of the Oracle within Babs in the New 52, but I really enjoying her as Batgirl.

#9 Posted by jrock85 (2874 posts) - - Show Bio

Barbara Gordon is Barbara Gordon.

#10 Posted by hyperman (391 posts) - - Show Bio

Barba gordon is such an iconic character, I am reall glad to have Babs back as Batgirl. The Oracle could be a super high-tech system created by Babs in order to help to mantain the order in Gotham or something of the sort.

#11 Posted by hyperman (391 posts) - - Show Bio

@X9 said:

About that bigger role everyone say she played as Oracle... well, it certainly explains why most people don't even know she was Oracle ¬¬ Or immediately associate her with Batgirl.

I honestly think Gail is doing a great job with Babs back as Batgirl. She's a young woman with deep personality and great potential as a character. Will she move on to a new superhero identity? Maybe. She probably won't be Batgirl forever. Will she play the role she used to play as Oracle again? I don't think she'll get away from the field in the New 52 anytime soon (thank God) but, if she does, I'm sure they're not putting her back in a wheelchair. (check the sales, readers like her OUT of it)

Wise words!!

#12 Posted by SupBatz (1737 posts) - - Show Bio

@X9 said:

Awwn, this again?!

Forget Oracle, she was playing the role no one wanted their favorite character to play. The only reason I liked Oracle was because she was Barbara Gordon and I like Barbara Gordon ¬¬ About that bigger role everyone say she played as Oracle... well, it certainly explains why most people don't even know she was Oracle ¬¬ Or immediately associate her with Batgirl.

I always considered Barbara to be a personal favorite of mine and I liked her role as Oracle. I'm not saying I want them to disable her again, but I think it would be good to have her assume a role that mixes her Batgirl and Oracle personas.

Most people also don't know who Jason Todd is, that Dick Grayson became Nightwing, nor 90% of Batman's history. That doesn't mean she didn't play a big role. Thousand of people knew she was Oracle. And there are still tons of people who associate Batman with Adam West - doesn't mean Adam West defines Batman and doesn't mean Batgirl defines Barbara Gordon.

@danhimself said:

the problem I have is that unlike Dick returning to the Nightwing identity, Babs going back to being Batgirl really is a step back for the character....she had moved on and stepped into a much bigger and more important role in the DC Universe and other characters stepped up to the Batgirl mantle...I agree that she should retain her ability to walk but that she should go back to being Oracle again and let Stephanie Brown or Cassandra Cain step up to the Batgirl role

That pretty much sums up my position.

#13 Posted by The_Greatest_Username (144 posts) - - Show Bio

@X9 said:

Awwn, this again?!

Forget Oracle, she was playing the role no one wanted their favorite character to play. The only reason I liked Oracle was because she was Barbara Gordon and I like Barbara Gordon ¬¬ About that bigger role everyone say she played as Oracle... well, it certainly explains why most people don't even know she was Oracle ¬¬ Or immediately associate her with Batgirl.

I think you really hit the nail on the head with this one. Especially the bolded part.

#14 Posted by Mercy_ (92708 posts) - - Show Bio

Um, what? Barbara Gordon became one of my favorite characters as Oracle. I fell in love with her as Batgirl after the fact.

Moderator
#15 Posted by divingfalcon713 (282 posts) - - Show Bio

@Mercy_ said:

Um, what? Barbara Gordon became one of my favorite characters as Oracle. I fell in love with her as Batgirl after the fact.

That basically sums up how I feel about her. The Killing Joke came out before I was born so I've always known her as Oracle. I think it's cool that they took her out of the wheelchair, but I also think she became her own person as Oracle. Like Grayson did when he left the Robin mantle, Barbara created her own identity outside of Batman when she began operating as Oracle. After reading Birds of Prey I guess I'd rather see her being more tech savvy as well as fighting the bad guys.

#16 Posted by Wboy (442 posts) - - Show Bio

Considering they live in the DC universe I'm suprised she never called in stem cell research, Zatanna magic and fix her back, mechanical spine connection, idunno. Whatever they do don't throw her back into wheelchair ;-;

#17 Posted by Twentyfive (2845 posts) - - Show Bio

I dunno, man. DC is crazy. While I love Barbara Gordon's character no matter which identity she assumes, I agree that having her back as Batgirl is not a good idea. They brought her back just so things can go back to the way they were before. Because that is all a comic fan needs.

#18 Posted by Hazlenaut (1960 posts) - - Show Bio

how about she takes the batwoman mantle Kate she shouldn't mind.

#19 Posted by PowerHerc (84035 posts) - - Show Bio

I like Barbara walking again and want her to be what she is; the one, true Batgirl!

#20 Posted by dboyrules2011 (13542 posts) - - Show Bio

@moywar700 said:

Batgirl(barbara gordon) can do anything oracle can do and much more.

#21 Edited by WonderHunter (121 posts) - - Show Bio

@divingfalcon713 said:

@Mercy_ said:

Um, what? Barbara Gordon became one of my favorite characters as Oracle. I fell in love with her as Batgirl after the fact.

That basically sums up how I feel about her. The Killing Joke came out before I was born so I've always known her as Oracle. I think it's cool that they took her out of the wheelchair, but I also think she became her own person as Oracle. Like Grayson did when he left the Robin mantle, Barbara created her own identity outside of Batman when she began operating as Oracle. After reading Birds of Prey I guess I'd rather see her being more tech savvy as well as fighting the bad guys.

I agree with this. I don't really mind her being a street hero again, but i do prefer her as Oracle. It would be cool to have her in a new identity: something between her job as Oracle and her job as Batgirl.

@Hazlenaut said:

how about she takes the batwoman mantle Kate she shouldn't mind.

Uhm? ._. do you want Kate to stop being Batwoman and hand over to Babs? I'm sorry, i'm not trying to be mean, but i would like to know why do you think that :)

#22 Posted by Hazlenaut (1960 posts) - - Show Bio

@WonderHunter: I am saying she be named Batwoman since she has been in action for long while that she would be named Batwoman or higher level than being Batgirl. Batlady, Batmaiden, Batmadam or something like that. Perhaps later on future all name of the bat will be called batknight more gender neutral and mysterious. Barbra had three people take the mantle of batgirl Kate shouldn’t mind calling her Batwoman. She should take it a flattery. Kate gets red Barbra gets blue.

#23 Posted by WonderHunter (121 posts) - - Show Bio

@Hazlenaut: Having two batwomans can be confused :P And the others girls weren't all batgirls at the same time, but i do see your point. It could be could for her to adopt a new identity. I am never against seeing a character developments, especially with Babs, as they have taken a step back with her in that regard.

#24 Posted by Hazlenaut (1960 posts) - - Show Bio

There is Batman Incorporated that used confusion for their advantage and to show that batman is everywhere. the confusion is not that much as they were color coded for convince.

Blue is Barbra

Black was Cassandra but she can get another color if she wanted

Violet is Stephanie

#25 Posted by charlieboy (7160 posts) - - Show Bio

I really liked Steph and Cassandra but Babs is Batgirl to me. I am actually old enough that I knew her as Batgirl first before Oracle. I loved her as Oracle but I prefer her as Batgirl.

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