Does Hulk belong on the Avengers? In the grand scheme I mean.

Posted by Overseer (404 posts) - - Show Bio

Don't get me wrong. I loved Banner/Hulk in the Avengers movie and FREAKEN LOVED Hulk in Avengers EMH. He brings a unique personality to the team and is very fun to watch interact with Cap, Iron Man Thor, etc. and I beleive Hulk is an INTEGRAL part of the team's origin but then you actually add in the Hulk mythos/universe into it.

Bruce Banner is classically "The Lonley Man" a wonderer trying to find a way to deal with the Hulk while being chased by the relentless General Ross as he keeps stumbling into situations only Marvel's (non-copywritten) version of Godzilla could handle alone. Hulk on the other hand is a force of rage and destruction desparately seeking a friend who won't hurt him while struggling with Banner's memories and Banner's own attempts to kill him when Savage. And when intelligent Hulk struggles with his own status as a hero and Marvel's version of Godzilla as well as his own cynical beliefs and attitude born of the abuse given to him in his Savage days.

With Hulk as an Avenger, his status on the team being VERY public where could Hulk's supporting cast come in without involving Red Hulk, A-Bomb or Red She-Hulk so early in the game? What if Hulk goes on a rampage? Is his status as an Avenger even put into question or his motives questioned by the authorities (sp?) or do they just shoot him. How much strain does Hulk's rather unstable character put on his membership on the team before Nicky boy says "Ok Dr. Banner, for public safty I'm asking to to be placed in this Guilded Cage in New Mexico until we need you." How would either Bruce or Hulk take that. When you factor in the themes, motifs, workings, characters and general workings of the Hulk Microverse within the large Marvel Universe context and Hulk being an Avenger for an extended length of time just makes less sense from the Hulk mythos POV.

This is just my personal thoughts and I do love Hulk on the team but... as I say for Hulk to be an Avenger, you have to give up at least 1/3 of the Hulk mythos. To be honest She-Hulk was a much better fit for the Avengers. However the thing that made Hulk work as an Avenger was his cynism and jackass-ish behavior that Jan is just too developed a character to really be altered to fit and not piss off hundreds of people. My own personal solution to the problem was to give the C-List Avenger Mantis an overhall to make her "Hulk without the baggage".

Thoughts? Solutions? Things I missed? People having a rather immature argument just to be immature? ...Anything?

#1 Posted by Sinfulplayerx (193 posts) - - Show Bio

....... do some research. You are short info like 50 years....

#2 Posted by Overseer (404 posts) - - Show Bio

@Sinfulplayerx: Please elaborate your point of view. I'd honestly like to know.

#3 Posted by Sinfulplayerx (193 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm sorry had some good punch that night ! :)

Hulk has been an Avenger for longer then I was born. The fact that he does not fit is a "aDditional effect" to the teaM. Does not fit................. does not equal to why he fits on the team. Sounds confusing I know. That is why it works. Sometimes in math the diffrence is > then the whole. The Sum of the means is the answer.

#4 Posted by Jonny_Anonymous (32675 posts) - - Show Bio

Hulk should be the Frankenstein's Monster/Dr Jekyll/Mr Hyde like he was invented to be

#5 Posted by Overseer (404 posts) - - Show Bio

@Sinfulplayerx: Like I said, I as an actual member of the team, HELL YEAH. Similarly to Spider-Man (in his early years) Hulk being on a

team is just such a bad idea that it works. But... when you actually take a look into the classical Hulk, the golly green giant has mostly been a fugitive from the law with his own strong path of character development, storylines, supporting cast and niche within the Marvel Universe, the Hulk Mythos. As I said, when you put the Hulk Mythos into context with the Avengers Maxi-Mythos, Hulk himself just doesn't blend as well as the Iron Man Mythos or the Captain America Mythos and in order for him to be a member of the main Avenger roster (instead of say an honorary member) you would have to give up 1/3 of the Hulk Mythos, the fugitive like chase story, "The Lonley Man" wonderer aspect of the character, the mass rampages, General Ross chasing him, Betty, Rick, She-Hulk, Doc Samson and everyone of his friends doing what they can to help him but the fight is a losing battle and the general mistrust of the character due to his own rage and unstable nature. I just feel as an Avenger "Classical Hulk" simply can't exist.

Hulk as a DEFENDER on the other hand is a diffrent story...

PS: I was under the impression Hulk was only a member of the Avengers for the first 3 issues then left after feeling distrusted and all my resources (Marvel Database, Marvel Encyclopedia: The Avengers, and the general lack of importance of the team to Hulk as seen in say The Incredible Hulk (both the 1970's live action series staring Bill Bixby and Lou Ferrigno and the 1990's animated series)) that Hulk never returned to the Avengers until recently when his part in the team's origin became more apparent. Could you please point out certain runs or issues of the Avengers where Hulk returned and remained a long standing member? Because I'd honestly like to know why said run/issues were omitted. Seriously.

#6 Posted by Sinfulplayerx (193 posts) - - Show Bio

It's like having a "Gold Gym Membership" from day one but then only going to the gym a few times a year. The Avengers line up has always changed thru the years. It's kind of like the "NWO" from wrestlings WWE / WCW. Once a member...your a member 4-life. Hulks part in the Avengers is a special one for just those same reasons you listed.

#7 Posted by InfinityAce (110 posts) - - Show Bio

@Overseer said:

@Sinfulplayerx: Like I said, I as an actual member of the team, HELL YEAH. Similarly to Spider-Man (in his early years) Hulk being on a

team is just such a bad idea that it works. But... when you actually take a look into the classical Hulk, the golly green giant has mostly been a fugitive from the law with his own strong path of character development, storylines, supporting cast and niche within the Marvel Universe, the Hulk Mythos. As I said, when you put the Hulk Mythos into context with the Avengers Maxi-Mythos, Hulk himself just doesn't blend as well as the Iron Man Mythos or the Captain America Mythos and in order for him to be a member of the main Avenger roster (instead of say an honorary member) you would have to give up 1/3 of the Hulk Mythos, the fugitive like chase story, "The Lonley Man" wonderer aspect of the character, the mass rampages, General Ross chasing him, Betty, Rick, She-Hulk, Doc Samson and everyone of his friends doing what they can to help him but the fight is a losing battle and the general mistrust of the character due to his own rage and unstable nature. I just feel as an Avenger "Classical Hulk" simply can't exist.

Hulk as a DEFENDER on the other hand is a diffrent story...

PS: I was under the impression Hulk was only a member of the Avengers for the first 3 issues then left after feeling distrusted and all my resources (Marvel Database, Marvel Encyclopedia: The Avengers, and the general lack of importance of the team to Hulk as seen in say The Incredible Hulk (both the 1970's live action series staring Bill Bixby and Lou Ferrigno and the 1990's animated series)) that Hulk never returned to the Avengers until recently when his part in the team's origin became more apparent. Could you please point out certain runs or issues of the Avengers where Hulk returned and remained a long standing member? Because I'd honestly like to know why said run/issues were omitted. Seriously.

You talk ALOT no offense but, wow man how long did it take to type all of that? Anyway on to the point Hulk is a "on off" avenger so he fits when they need a tank that CANNOT be beat.(Yeah i now he's been beat lot before). He techinally isn't on the avengers but, yes he fits I hated the idea of spidey being on a team because he is loner like hulk but, hell it worked great.

#8 Posted by Bo88gdan (4393 posts) - - Show Bio

yes without a doubt

#9 Posted by THORSON (2317 posts) - - Show Bio

YES.

#10 Posted by Overseer (404 posts) - - Show Bio

@InfinityAce: No offence taken, I tend to ramble. Nice points you've raised. And to be honest I agree with you. Hulk does work as the "Godzilla Threshold" (Tvtropes) of the team called in for massive emergancies, though I was thinking in more the sense of the way Avengers:EMH plays with Hulk on the team. As a perminant mainstay on the main team.

Upon further thought, perhaps this blog should have been titled "Do the Avengers belong with Hulk" since I'm trying to look at things from Hulk's POV rather than the larger universe of the Avengers.

#11 Posted by PowerHerc (81602 posts) - - Show Bio

No. Neither does Spider-Man, Wolverine or the Thing.

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