Six Developments from AVENGERS VS. X-MEN #12

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#151 Posted by LeaderVladimir (150 posts) - - Show Bio

@zackattack529: Iron Man, Captain America, Uncanny Avengers, Thor: God of Thunder, and perhaps the new Spider-Man series.

#152 Posted by GREGalicious (492 posts) - - Show Bio

@brucecapell: My thoughts exactly. They even gave her Jean's Phoenix suit. And I absolutely call BS with the Phoenix Force being gone. I feel it's impossible and even if it were, it would take someone much higher up on the scale than Hope to do it.

Both the force and Jean will find their way back one way or another.

#153 Posted by GREGalicious (492 posts) - - Show Bio

@Sleepbutnodream15: I guess the others dont have it like Wanda has it ahaha!

#154 Posted by Hermatt (72 posts) - - Show Bio

I didn't mind this series. It was better than Fear Itself. The first "act" just seemed to be an excuse to make people fight which then just made it weak. After the Phoenix Five it got interesting. One thing I gotta point out. Hope doesn't have the Phoenix force anymore. She and Wanda held hands and said no more Phoenix. Thats when the mutants came back.

#155 Posted by ArturoCalaKayVee (12592 posts) - - Show Bio

@Lamenoire said:

dear god... that ending was anticlimatic.

And Scott Summers seems like a maniac (in another issue out this week, he claimed he would do it again because thanks to him their are new mutants). This man needs a lobotomy and or is younger self to kick his ass.

This could possibly be why they're doing that new series where the original X-Men are in the past. The present Cyclops has become deranged and psychotic and then BAM! the past Cyclops appears and they're like "eh we'll take him"

#156 Posted by Hadez (164 posts) - - Show Bio

i love more mutants

#157 Posted by fivestarga (240 posts) - - Show Bio

Cyclops is a great character whether it be past or present Cyke. I have personally loved his growth and will continue to read and buy anything he's part of. On a side note it's funny just how much I dislike Captain America nowadays....not the movie Cap mind you, just the very self righteous comic version. I've read comments of people calling Cyke a maniac and I guess they are entitled to that opinion, not sure how they reach it considering he tried his hardest to use the god like power to make the world a better place....I guess some people just skim over his dialogue and don't really read it and take it in. Now if you wanted to call Cap a maniac for constantly forcing his god like hand I could understand that.

#158 Posted by Kimeraevent (3 posts) - - Show Bio

This was the dumbest Phoenix story ever. Worse than even Warsong. The entire event was out of character. The Phoenix never killed Jean Grey. EVER. Driung the Dark Phoenix story, Jean was at the bottom of the Hudson in a TK cocoon. The Phoenix had copied her and believing it was her lived a human life and experienced human emotions until it was corrupted by Jason Wyngarde and the Hellfire Club. It was the Phoenix as a human that became the Dark Phoenix, not Jean Grey. Also, everytime the Phoenix has come back since, it has been on the side of good and done nothing but help out the world, specifically through its main avatars Jean Grey and Rachel Summers. Jean Grey is dead right now, because Quan Yin Xorn as Magneto (I hate retcons) killed her by giving her a massive heart attack. She is currently alive though in a sense in the Phoenix egg communing with all the past and future and alternate avatars. Rachel was never a dark entity while in possession of the Phoenix power so where did this storyline come from?

The Phoenix ran over planets and "destroyed" them. Against purpose, because the Phoenix only removes that which impedes evolution and creation. It is as if everyone involved with this AvX storyline just decided to ignore the last 25 years of Phoenix stories in an effort to tear down Cyclops further than him already giving up his previously ingrained principles and moral guidelines. Also, why would Captain America and Tony Stark, two men who have had ZERO experience with the Phoenix, seek the advice of Wolverine who is just as biased on the subject as Cyclops when Rachel was right there. As was Storm, who was available for consultation. Beast was acting weird and has been since he had a falling out with Cyclops so this was partially him doing an "I told you so".

This was a stupid storyline that took what was a last ditch fight for species survival and reset it back to a status quo from before House of M. With the exception that now Wolverine is the school headmaster, even though he is never there and never had a problem before Edie with putting children in harm's way (Jubilee, Kitty Pryde, Hisako). Where was his condemnation when Generation X was around, or X-Force was being turned into soldiers by Cable. When did he object to children fighting?

This was a stupid, stupid and completely useless storyline that will be retconned and forgotten in 3 years.

#159 Posted by Howlverine (62 posts) - - Show Bio


#160 Posted by Imperius_Rex (452 posts) - - Show Bio

You're the leader of an endangers species. You live on a rock seperated from the flat scan population you have devoted yourself keeping them alive and you finally catch a break with the power of the Phoenix force and the lame ass avengers decide "ummmmm nope" even though you're using our powers to better the entire planet for humans as well and still "nope" and I'm sorry but Scott summers is a douche? Cyclops was right. The avengers were wrong the entire hypocritical douche parade. Was wrong. Cyke did the best he could to avenge his race to protect what was left of his race he fought for what he loved. That's called a hero

#161 Posted by br7ndon (1 posts) - - Show Bio

All AvX amounted to was an X-Men story, poorly written, with annoying, unnecessary interference by the Avengers.

Despite plenty of mutants and Avengers being written out of character in this series, Cyke was true to himself. Only problem? Everyone hated him. If you have an idiotic bias against Cyclops, you should not be writing X-Men comics!! This entire series is based precariously on the ridiculous notion that Cyclops is crazy and can't be trusted. So, the Phoenix is coming. Who knows more about the Phoenix? Cyke or Cap? The Phoenix is not ALWAYS a destructive force; it's shown up before and been wielded for good without sacrifice. And it clearly has a connection with the mutant population, which is STRUGGLING, and Cyclops seems to be the only person to give a crap. So, I would argue he's totally justified in the beginning. For Captain America to show up, claim he knows better, and try to kidnap a mutant is dead wrong, any way you slice it.

Fast forward to the Phoenix Five. They did a hell of a lot of good in a short period of time for not only mutants, but the entire planet. Yeah, some of them would have likely been corrupted eventually. But it happened much faster because of the Avengers' provocations. What? They're helping to balance the Earth?! They must be stopped!! How about a conversation? I know diplomacy isn't popular and doesn't sell comics, and I've already acknowledged that many characters' decision making made zero sense, but why continually assault and provoke overpowered X-Men on the verge of turning to the dark side, but who are currently doing nothing but good. Cyclops knew there was a danger of corruption and was keeping a close eye on his team. But once again, Cap knows better. Stupid.

Hope was written so terribly. I still have no idea who this girl is, what she cares about, what her motivations are, nothing. Considering her role is so central to the story, this is probably the biggest injustice served to readers of this series. Her interactions with the Scarlet Witch in the VERY LAST ISSUE started to shed some light, but the problem is the Scarlet Witch is similarly undefined. She feels awful about crippling the mutant population on Earth? News to me. What has she been doing to make penance? Oh, working with the Avengers. Makes sense. This would have been the perfect time to see meaningful conversation between Cyke and Wanda, conversation so relevant and likely revealing of crucial details... What'd we get? Nothing. The fact that Hope ended up doing what Cyclops wanted her to do all along IS proof that Cyke wasn't crazy. Sure, she wasn't ready at the beginning, even Cyclops agreed with that, but that doesn't mean she was going to go off the deep end in the meantime. Butt the hell out, Avengers.

My last gripe is Cyclops being in prison and the others being "wanted." When Jean went dark and, y'know, ate a planet that one time, everyone was all "Bad Phoenix; Jean's not in control, we have to save her!!" But Cyclops? Pure evil, totally responsible. He even said the same words: "Please kill me." Nope, we don't care, throw him in jail. All the GOOD he did before he was provoked into going bat shit insane?? No1curr.

Sigh. The concept behind this versus series could have been developed into something much better than we were saddled with. I don't really know who's writing good X-Men comics these days, but for this to be Marvel's flagship event and be so sloppy and half-baked is sad. The Avengers needed a better reason to be engaged in the first place. People more central to the story, i.e. Hope, Wanda, Magneto, should have been... more central to the story. And Cyke bias needs to stay where it belongs: in Wolverine's heart. There were some cool moments, but all in all pretty damn disappointing.

#162 Posted by Dark_Phoenix00x (119 posts) - - Show Bio

br7ndon and Kimeraevent sum up everything that was wrong with this whole terrible event.

Only thing I have to add is why has Wanda not received any punishment for what she did? She committed third degree murder when she said "no more mutants", where is her punishment? She gets a free ride and Cyclops gets thrown in jail... Seriously?!?! I love what has been done with Wanda from back in Disassembled until Children's Crusade. Since then though, they've ruined her character.

Marvel has been going down the tank since FearItself.

#163 Posted by PhoenixoftheTides (3628 posts) - - Show Bio

Another new development is that I've dropped all but one X book from my reading list. Just can't support the bland new direction they are going in.

#164 Posted by 00 Raiser (441 posts) - - Show Bio

Cyclops was right!

#165 Posted by why_you_mad_tho (135 posts) - - Show Bio

@PhoenixoftheTides said:

Another new development is that I've dropped all but one X book from my reading list. Just can't support the bland new direction they are going in.

#166 Posted by gemguy0906 (1 posts) - - Show Bio

I am NOT happy with the series as a whole. First of all, Cyclops was one of my favorites, so his fall from grace and Wolverines rosey smelly butt don't jive with me. I loved the fact that they took away all the bogus mutants in the MU. There were too many, and things were not special with all of them. It would have been better to just say mutants can now me born, rather than having them all suddenly appear. Hope is a waste of time. Boring character.

If Jean comes back...yet again, it will only lead to further disappointment. How many times can she come back and be the phoenix? Marvel, let the dead stay dead…!

So glad this artivle pointed out that the Nova in the series was not Richard RIder... not it makes more sense. The series, if it did that, did not spell it out properly.

I will pick up All-New X-Men (althought i hate the time-travel stuff, it will make no sense whatsoever), and Iron Man. Everything else is heading to Drop City. I just cannot afford $3.99 or even $2.99 twice a month at this point.

#167 Posted by missingpriest (9 posts) - - Show Bio

So in the end, CYCLOPS WAS RIGHT!!!

The Phoenix was supposed to go to Hope, so she could restart the mutant race, and this whole episode felt like a hate crime perpetrated by the Avengers against the X-Men and mutant-kind because the X-Men became more powerful than the Avengers, even though the X-Men were doing good for the entire globe, but they just felt like they had to put a stop to that... and in the end Cyclops goes crazy because of the Avengers' relentless assault and from hunting them down...

I don't know if that was the whole point of this story, but that's what it read like...

#168 Posted by frozenedge (1343 posts) - - Show Bio

Great another red-headed woman who looks like Jean Grey gains control of the Phoenix Force. Just what we needed

#169 Posted by queenfrost_ (2490 posts) - - Show Bio


I wanna know what's happening next for my boo, Emma!

#170 Posted by xgirl (136 posts) - - Show Bio

erg ok i was never a big cap or cyclops fan but i stil like there characters. now marvel just make them jerks this is way i only seek the older comics

#171 Posted by Baberaham_Lincoln (944 posts) - - Show Bio

Sam Alexander does not deserve that Nova title... Richeeeee Rider is the TRUE Nova, always have and always will be him.... What happened to him anyways?

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