One development I learned about marvel from reading AvsX

#1 Posted by why_you_mad_tho (67 posts) - - Show Bio

1. Marvel just doesn't give a sh*t.

They don't care about continuity. They don't care about quality. The only thing they seem to care about is having yet another reason to put wolverine in a comic. Little to no effort was put forth into this event. In Avengers: X-Sanction Cable came from the future and stated if the avengers got Hope the world would end. And that Scott needed to protect her to keep the planet safe. Such a perfect.. selfless reason to keep Hope from The Avengers. Why wasn't this used in the main story? What happened to Cable who said he would be there to help? Instead they write Scott and Steve out of character to give a forced and irrational reason for these two teams to fight.

Rachel Summers the host for the Phoenix force for years, why didn't anyone think to have her train Hope? Oh that's right they were too busy saying how no one could control the PF. But wait one of the first things Jean Grey did when she became the host of the Phoenix Force was save the entire universe. The original reason given for Jean Grey turning evil was because of The Hellfire Clubs manipulating Jean made her go insane. This was later retconned into The PF created a double of Jean Grey's body and it was the one doing all those things. Either way Wolverines justification and reasoning for all of this is..well...incorrect. Jean grey in Endsong Jean strips the PF from Emma Frost, becomes the White Queen of The Crown and disappears in full control of the entity. What happened to Jean and The PF bonding together? Why is the PF suddenly not one with jean anymore and going around blowing up planets?

Wouldn't it have made more since if the 5 Lights or the 4 remaining lights and Hope becoming the Phoenix 5? The PF did create them after all. It would have given The Lights something to do other than be punching bags for Thor. I mean Christ what was the point of making a big deal about these mutants being born post M-Day if you do nothing with them? And then Have A vs X end with more mutants being created? They've pretty much means they've been irrelevant their entire creation. The Extinction team crossing the line to protect them would have made more sense than the Avengers selectively choosing who belongs and who doesn't belong in a cell/wanted. Magneto didnt have the PF power and he even helped the Avengers in the final fight. Yet he's on the wanted list with the rest of the mutants who weren't in control? The avengers were in control of their actions when they repeatedly invaded the homes of God while attacking children and kidnapping their messiah. No Consequences. The folks over at Marvel just dont give a sh*t.

#2 Posted by krspaceT (1473 posts) - - Show Bio

The athiest prays that Trinity War avoids this

Here that, prayed! From a guy who is less religious than Booster Gold is a modest guy!

#3 Edited by DeviousBastard (136 posts) - - Show Bio

Yeah...this event was nothing more than contrivance after contrivance. Funny thing is Rachel was going really going to train Hope.

#4 Posted by nightthrasher76 (5 posts) - - Show Bio

I don’t think Cyclops has been necessarily painted as a villain. If you really pay attention to the story and history, almost everyone who stood against Cyclops came off as a contradictive hypocrite. These are just my top three reasons why they have no case against Cyke. 1.) Why is it ok for mentally unstable Scarlett Witch to just float around in the world freely after completely altering reality and erasing the majority of mutants on earth, and it’s not ok for Hope to try harness the Phoenix Force (Which was coming no matter what) under training and supervision in order to try to use that power to fix what Wanda broke? 2.) Why can’t Cyclops prepare students to fight as a last line of defense against something that won’t stop hunting them, and Wolverine can try to kill Hope as a first option, use X-23 and Elixir with X-Force and recruit Skarr to fight against Romulus? 3.) Isn’t Captain America taking Hope into custody because of her potential threat kinda like the U.S. Government wanting all superhumans to register because of their potential threats? In fact, isn’t what Captain America is about to do with the X-men, just a more polite way of doing almost exactly what Tony Stark and Norman Osborn did in Avengers Initiative and Dark Reign? Since the Phoenix is this great omnipotent force that couldn’t be stopped from getting to Hope, Cap should have listened to a more informed Cyclops and allowed him to continue to focus Hope into a prepared emotionally calm state to absorb it, instead of just showing up to Utopia exactly like Norman Osborn did at Asgard, making Hope feel like a hunted criminal and running for her life from Wolverine. The only thing the Avengers did was, Create the Phoenix Five, put Hope in an even more stressful state to receive the Phoenix in and finally end up using Cyclops plan once their backs were to the wall and had no other choice. Cyclops may not be too popular amongst the Avengers and X-men anytime soon, but the opinion of him probably wouldn’t be that bad amongst the overall mutant community. His sacrifice of playing the “bad guy” actually ended up repopulating the mutant race and will finally bring the X-men and mutant issues into the mainstream marvel universe. They should all start wearing T-shirts saying, “Cyke was Right!”.

#5 Posted by fastolfe (5 posts) - - Show Bio

@nightthrasher76:

Completely agree! I feel the writing has been off since schism, not to mention the complete forgiveness of the Avengers for the Scarlet Witch's actions. Not to mention Cap's completely irrational behavior to the registration - which I think Stark was right about.

Cyke was RIGHT!

#6 Posted by DeviousBastard (136 posts) - - Show Bio

I still want an in-universe explanation why the future saw was never brought up by Scott.

#7 Posted by Timandm (3374 posts) - - Show Bio

@nightthrasher76 said:

I don’t think Cyclops has been necessarily painted as a villain. If you really pay attention to the story and history, almost everyone who stood against Cyclops came off as a contradictive hypocrite. These are just my top three reasons why they have no case against Cyke. 1.) Why is it ok for mentally unstable Scarlett Witch to just float around in the world freely after completely altering reality and erasing the majority of mutants on earth, and it’s not ok for Hope to try harness the Phoenix Force (Which was coming no matter what) under training and supervision in order to try to use that power to fix what Wanda broke? 2.) Why can’t Cyclops prepare students to fight as a last line of defense against something that won’t stop hunting them, and Wolverine can try to kill Hope as a first option, use X-23 and Elixir with X-Force and recruit Skarr to fight against Romulus? 3.) Isn’t Captain America taking Hope into custody because of her potential threat kinda like the U.S. Government wanting all superhumans to register because of their potential threats? In fact, isn’t what Captain America is about to do with the X-men, just a more polite way of doing almost exactly what Tony Stark and Norman Osborn did in Avengers Initiative and Dark Reign? Since the Phoenix is this great omnipotent force that couldn’t be stopped from getting to Hope, Cap should have listened to a more informed Cyclops and allowed him to continue to focus Hope into a prepared emotionally calm state to absorb it, instead of just showing up to Utopia exactly like Norman Osborn did at Asgard, making Hope feel like a hunted criminal and running for her life from Wolverine. The only thing the Avengers did was, Create the Phoenix Five, put Hope in an even more stressful state to receive the Phoenix in and finally end up using Cyclops plan once their backs were to the wall and had no other choice. Cyclops may not be too popular amongst the Avengers and X-men anytime soon, but the opinion of him probably wouldn’t be that bad amongst the overall mutant community. His sacrifice of playing the “bad guy” actually ended up repopulating the mutant race and will finally bring the X-men and mutant issues into the mainstream marvel universe. They should all start wearing T-shirts saying, “Cyke was Right!”.

Had to quote this for absolute truth...

#8 Posted by Timandm (3374 posts) - - Show Bio

@DeviousBastard said:

I still want an in-universe explanation why the future saw was never brought up by Scott.

Bbecause, if they had taken time to talk things out and share information.... There wouldn't have been a pointless war, and in turn, no Marvel Event.

#9 Posted by Rabbitearsblog (5835 posts) - - Show Bio

I agree with everything you said, especially the part about Cable not being involved, even though this supposedly was the reason why this fight between the Avengers and the X-Men started in the first place.

#10 Posted by DeviousBastard (136 posts) - - Show Bio

@Timandm: I said "in-universe".

#11 Posted by OmegaHans (206 posts) - - Show Bio

@Timandm: It was a pointless war. Hope rejected the Force, it went back to its roost.

All this panicking and back and forth crap between the big 2 teams was all just to sell another event, in a cheap way. Didn't really make Hope any more interesting either if that's what Marvel was going for.

Hope was a failed idea.

No I don't hate her and yeah she'll probably make a decent hero later on down the line, but it's time to move on from this. She'll linger around probably for the next couple years and then fade into history.

X-Men is a mess, period. Only a totally start over approach is going to salvage it for this decade. Here's hoping for it.

Enough team books all the time. More solos, one-shots please.

Wanda's past screw ups will be put behind, somehow I'm fine with that too. Marvel NOW will begin with the repercussions, but then it will float dead in the water, they'll probably try more silly events (if they are any as bad as Chaos War of Fear Itself) and perhaps sales will go down, just by looking at what they have presented to us currently.

#12 Posted by Timandm (3374 posts) - - Show Bio

@OmegaHans: Sadly, I think you're absolutely right... I love how you say, "but then it will float dead in the water.".... Yes... yes it will... The X-Men really are a huge mess now, this "Wolverine and the X-Men" is beyond stupid.... It's as if it is written by children FOR children... and it's become one big Cluster-(*&$

#13 Posted by moywar700 (2775 posts) - - Show Bio

I can understand ignoring continuity from decades ago but Marvel ignore stuff that happened recently.That's very lazy writing on their part.What's was the point of reading stuff that happened 2 years ago when it was ignored?Generation Hope was a waste and the characters had little use in the story.

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