Will Darkseid be the big bad in the Justice League movie?

@OutlawRenegade said:

@DarthShap said:

@OutlawRenegade said:

Why do people think that if DC uses Darkseid first, then they won't have any villains to use later?

They could do an Atlantean Invasion story. They could do a story with a secret and shadowy version of the LoD/Injustice League/The Light like in Young Justice. They could use Hades. They could even make Felix Faust a servant and worshiper of the inter-dimensional god Starro (just make him a Lovecraftian as possible). It's not hard coming up with threats. Just read Grant Morrison's run for other ideas.

It is not that somehow there will not be any villain to use, it is just that you cannot top Darkseid, the ultimate threat. If Justice League is to become a franchise, that is going to be huge problem.

Anti-Monitor. Crisis of Infinite Earths. Explore New Genesis and Apokolips further in a sequel. Black Lanterns. There are plenty of ways to top Darkseid.

1)Those are not Justice League stories.

2)There is just no way to make a movie out of Crisis on Infinite Earths because it requires dozens of movies about those Earths otherwise people would not care about them disappearing. Same thing about the Black Lanterns, which would require hundreds of superhero deaths prior to the actual movie.

@sethysquare said:

@DarthShap: nothing ultimate about joker?

wahhahahahahahhaahhahahahahahhaahahhahahahahahaha.

oh god. you crack me up.

And you fail to answer to arguments.

I think you do not understand the meaning of the word. It means "last", "final".

The Joker is not no way linked to any idea of ending.

YES! Combine Justice League: Origin, Final Crisis, and Legends and you have a movie!

Gallery

Meanwhile, over at Disney/Marvel...

Sounds right to me, you don't really need much to make a villain like Darkseid; like in this DCnU they can just 'BOOM here is the bad guy now battle him or die trying'

He really doesn't need too much introduction nor background history.

Marvel's got Thanos,.. Thanos is cooler though

This is a sh*tstorm in the making.

@r3d_rob1n: uh what do u mean by " Batman rape face"?

similar but not the same. There will be plenty of differances. Darkside already rules a planet facist style looking for the number thingy to rule everyone. Plus him being a New God will be cool. His minions should be pretty creepy on film as well. Thanos just wants to rule. He also has a thing for death. It'll be fine.

@theTimeStreamer said:

@sethysquare said:

@theTimeStreamer said:

this idea is stupid. we dont know jack about their universe. we dont know what is normal or not. and they just throw dc's biggest baddie at us and expect us to be cool with it. give us some backstory, something to go on. the universe is 100% NOT like the comic one.

Huh? What backstory do you want? Don't you think you're being a little ridiculous?

You didn't need any back story for green goblin in spiderman 1.

you also didnt need any back story for scarecrow in batman 1.

neither did you need any back story for loki in thor.

there also wouldn't be any back story for thanos in avengers 2.

So whats the difference? You want some back story? try wikipedia

you got backstory for loki and green goblin. batman was a mess. they are throwing way too many characters at the screen and expect them to stick. all of the leaguers. who are they? do they have family alive? do they have existent villains? not to mention what are the heroes secret identities. batman and superman are easy but the rest are not known to the public. they wont have alot of time for backstories and it will be messy. now you can continue to be the dick ive seen you to be when dc is involved or see reason. up to you.

are you kidding me? theres no back story for green goblin in the first film. Everything was introduced there.

you should really try wikipedia marvel fanboy.

@DarthShap: nothing ultimate about joker?

wahhahahahahahhaahhahahahahahhaahahhahahahahahaha.

oh god. you crack me up.

@Zeeguy91: What I meant by big enough threat was that since the team's roster includes heavy hitters like aliens, gods and kings then any simple human or man-made villain wouldn't seem like such a big threat as an alien or a multidimensional threat would look like to the eyes of the JL.

@InnerVenom123 said:

So it'll be pretty much the exact same plot as Avengers.

Surely this won't backfire.

Surely.

ALL HAIL LORD DARKSEID!

@DarthShap said:

@OutlawRenegade said:

Why do people think that if DC uses Darkseid first, then they won't have any villains to use later?

They could do an Atlantean Invasion story. They could do a story with a secret and shadowy version of the LoD/Injustice League/The Light like in Young Justice. They could use Hades. They could even make Felix Faust a servant and worshiper of the inter-dimensional god Starro (just make him a Lovecraftian as possible). It's not hard coming up with threats. Just read Grant Morrison's run for other ideas.

It is not that somehow there will not be any villain to use, it is just that you cannot top Darkseid, the ultimate threat. If Justice League is to become a franchise, that is going to be huge problem.

Anti-Monitor. Crisis of Infinite Earths. Explore New Genesis and Apokolips further in a sequel. Black Lanterns. There are plenty of ways to top Darkseid.

Darkseid in first movie with Cyborg, and then possibly a sequel that introduces the Martian Manhunter. I wouldn't mind seeing a white MArtian invasion. WB could even have Batman rape face in the sequel as an homage to the time he took out the White Martians with only his fists, his brains, and a book of matches

@sora_thekey said:

@Zeeguy91: Hmmm... (After checking the CV pages for all these characters.) Lets see, Grundy is pretty much a powerful zombie. I don't think that would sell too well on the big screen, especially fighting against the likes of Superman. Seeing as how the JL includes gods and aliens, characters like Amazo, Queen Bee and Vandal Savage might not be a big enough threat in the movie. TO Morrow might be good as a secondary character. For Legion of Doom to exist there needs to be a Justice League first. Prometheus is pretty much a Batman villain.

So it seems that Despero or Starro are the best bet instead of Darkseid.

How would Amazo, a nearly invincible android who can duplicate all of the powers of the Justice League, not enough of a threat? Although, he's not a good choice for a first movie villain because for Ivo to build Amazo in response to the JL, there has to be a JL first. Save him for the second or third movie. Also, which Queen Bee are you referring to? There are several. I should have been clearer, but I meant the Zazzala version, who has superhuman strength and speed and the ability to control peoples minds. I think she'd be a good choice since both DC and Marvel have so few strong female villains. Also, Vandal Savage isn't really so much of a physical threat (although he is immortal, so the League wouldn't be able to kill him anyway), but more so of a threat when dealing with his manipulative and tactical brilliance.

I think its a godd idea cause well darkseid awesome

@AmazingWebHead said:

I hope so. Making the White Martians villains seems wrong after Young Justice, and Starro would look too silly on screen.

why does making White Martians villains seem wrong. Ms. Martians ben lobotomizing people left and right

I hope so. Making the White Martians villains seems wrong after Young Justice, and Starro would look too silly on screen.

Too much to introduce in the first JL film. This movie is going to be confusing and messy. It will fail. Hate to say.

@The Stegman: Not a bad idea you have....I'd be open to that. There have been a ton of good suggestions in this thread....all that would be better than just Darkseid with parademons...........Like I said, I love Darkseid as a badd-ass, but the problem with Darkseid in JLA movie would be that both movies debut in 2015......It'd seem just like "Meteor" vs "Armageddon" when both those stinker flicks came our at the same time. Eeef.

I kind of figure it was Darkseid but this shouldn't be a origin movie they should establish that JLA been around for years and have more members, in fact should open the movie with other members going on deep space mission and leave the original seven on Earth to face the big threat themselves

@moywar700 said:

Not many people are gonna like my JL idea.I think there should be no villain in the story.The Justice League's mission is political and they go around the world doing politics stuff.There's once scene where Superman stops the middle east from killing each other with guns but they ended up having a blood bath with rocks as weapons.The movie will explore Wonder Woman ambassor's mission for world peace.She writes a book and there's a public outcry for it because of how scandalous it is.

So basically, the Authority?

Michael Ironside for Darkseid please

darkseid should and would be a good villain

@DeusVult: Despero?

Ok, so now i can safely assume that we will see Cyborg instead of MM in this, oh well.

Also, Brainiac would've work amazing as well, having him referenced by Zod in Man of Steel so things get even more tense in the movie, helping the tone of this more "serious and gritty world" they're trying to portray. Still, it's smart for Warner to do this as close to The New 52 as possible, but at the same time it's stupid, because things are really close to what Marvel's doing, they have to manage well the scripts and set the tone right so that people who aren't familiar with comic books know that this isn't an Avengers rip off with no Samuel L Jackson. I hope that they really think this through instead of just rushing to get the film up as quick as possible.

my only issue with this is the Darkseid is such a big villian, who would be the baddie of a potential sequel? i think he should be saved for a 2nd or 3rd movie

@Dethklokx7 said:

Heres how you do it DC:

1st movie: Government or CADMUS to develop AMAZO as a contingency against the the yet to be formed Justice League. He attacks each one only to get stronger with each encounter forcing and ultimately going rouge. They come together to stop AMAZO and the league is formed. End with after credits scene of the reveal that AMAZO design and project was influenced by Brainiac saying "This experience was most informative. I well correct this error......"

*yawn

@DeusVult: how about any other jl villian?

Not many people are gonna like my JL idea.I think there should be no villain in the story.The Justice League's mission is political and they go around the world doing politics stuff.There's once scene where Superman stops the middle east from killing each other with guns but they ended up having a blood bath with rocks as weapons.The movie will explore Wonder Woman ambassor's mission for world peace.She writes a book and there's a public outcry for it because of how scandalous it is.

Until we get official confirmation, I'll remain sceptical for now. Though Darkseid is way too obvious a choice, deserves more than to be a mere Justice League villain and will get loads of Thanos comparisons from non comic book viewers. And I have a bad feeling WB are rushing Justice League to compete with the Avengers 2. And a rushed movie is never a good thing.

"but I'm willing to bet a rather huge percentage of general moviegoers don't know that."

That's cause no one reads comics anymore :(. Majority of the people I know who watch The Walking Dead had no freaking idea that it was based off a comic series.

Thanos is a rip of Metron and Darkseid from DC so it doesn't matter to me if they go with Darkseid as the leading villain/opponent. I was thinkin' they should do someone like Brainiac. If they do the White Martians, people will think its an automatic copy of The Avengers.... Whatever they do, they should make the Tower of Babel arc a part of the series. That would be awesome.

Hmm...not sure I would do Darkseid first. Maybe Vandal Savage or Starro like someone else pointed out. I have to admit, I'm a bit worried for this film. But I guess we'll have to wait and see!

@DeusVult: they'll probably each get their respective movies introducing a villain in each, then fight the Legion of Doom in the JL sequel

@StMichalofWilson: I think Michael Clarke Duncan (RIP) had the best, most menacing voice for the character

Yeah Baby! Go big or go home!!!!!!!!

@TitanTempest said:

This.

Once Thanos arrives mainstream and is established in the Avengers 2 movie, then we would prob never see Darkseid on the big screen for future movies. So Id rather see a head-to-head match Marvel and DC, then to never see him at all

Agreed. And I really love Thanos - ask me how much sometime and my wife will read the riot act on how much. Darkseid is a great choice, not the only one perhaps; Amazo, Luthor, Brainiac or even Doomsday might work as well just to name a few. I got the faith that Time Warner will do Kirby's villain justice. We'll see.

Good don't hold anything back. The general audience doesn't know who Thanos is anyway even if they saw that scene at the end of Avengers

@Zeeguy91: Hmmm... (After checking the CV pages for all these characters.) Lets see, Grundy is pretty much a powerful zombie. I don't think that would sell too well on the big screen, especially fighting against the likes of Superman. Seeing as how the JL includes gods and aliens, characters like Amazo, Queen Bee and Vandal Savage might not be a big enough threat in the movie. TO Morrow might be good as a secondary character. For Legion of Doom to exist there needs to be a Justice League first. Prometheus is pretty much a Batman villain.

So it seems that Despero or Starro are the best bet instead of Darkseid.

Darkseid is one of the Justice League's most powerful opponents, I can understand why they chose him... He poses the biggest threat. Brainiac would be cool, too. I think it'd be best to create a completely new villain that poses a threat to the entire world... H'El would be pretty sweet, I think.

Wasn't it reported that the Masters of Evil would be the villains working for Thanos in Avengers 2? That right there can help differentiate them, a little. Thanos is likely going to continued to be played up as the chess master, manipulating stuff behind the scenes. You can make Darkseid more upfront.

Darkseid is the safe choice wich is a smart move considering its the first JLA movie.In the sequels they can get a bit more ballsy and try Starro,Braniac,Superboy Prime or even the Anti Monitor.

Heres how you do it DC:

1st movie: Government or CADMUS to develop AMAZO as a contingency against the the yet to be formed Justice League. He attacks each one only to get stronger with each encounter forcing and ultimately going rouge. They come together to stop AMAZO and the league is formed. End with after credits scene of the reveal that AMAZO design and project was influenced by Brainiac saying "This experience was most informative. I well correct this error......"

if they do this.....MICHAEL IRONSIDE HAS TO VOICE DARKSEID!!!!!!! I dont care who the stand in actor is, the voice has to be Ironside lol

The Avengers has managed to kicked off the summer with a bang, making a billion dollars like it was nothing.

While The Dark Knight Rises will certainly offer some fierce competition for The Avengers later this summer, on the whole DC's recent movie efforts have been surprisingly weak. Green Lantern debuted to a tepid reception last summer, while other characters like Wonder Woman and Flash seem locked in development hell. As for a Justice League team-up movie? Who knows when we'll ever see that materialize.

With The Dark Knight Rises wrapping up Christopher Nolan's Batman trilogy, it's clear DC and Warner Bros. need to refocus and work on building up their superhero stable in Hollywood. Marvel has set the stage for their franchises, so what about DC? Let me explain some things...

No Unnecessary Reboots

Ever since The Dark Knight made a billion dollars for Warner's, the word “reboot” has been tossed around Hollywood in conjunction with just about every dormant superhero franchise there is -- Daredevil, Fantastic Four, Ghost Rider, Superman, etc. Some studios seem to believe that the great lesson to take away from Christopher Nolan's Bat trilogy is that the surest path to success is to start over, make everything darker, grittier, and more realistic, and make sure the main character is ready to scream at you in a menacing growl.

While Superman and Spider-Man are getting the full-on reboot treatment, we're noticing a promising trend with many of these projects. Films like Ghost Rider: Spirit of Vengeance, Punisher: War Zone, and Incredible Hulk aren't necessarily sequels to the previous installments, but the filmmakers don't waste an inordinate amount of time rehashing the characters' respective origin stories either. More often than not, studios can assume that audiences either remember the character from past movies or are intelligent enough to pick up on the necessary details. It isn't rocket science their spouting, but hammers of

At this point, Warners has lost a lot of ground to Marvel Studios in the past five years. Marvel has successfully established an entire team of cinematic heroes, many of whom now qualify as franchises in their own right. Meanwhile, Warner has been coasting on the success of Nolan's Bat films, with only the... uhh...Green Lantern as an attempt to develop a new superhero franchise. They don't have that much time as they use to, they need to start now with a Justice League movie!

That said, there's no way the filmmakers can deliver a satisfying film if they're struggling to introduce and establish seven different heroes. Therefore, they'll need to assume viewers know who most of these characters are and don't need complicated origin stories. The new Superman will have already been established in next year's Man of Steel. Even if the movie offers a new take on Green Lantern, the previous film still laid out the basics of the character and his world. Everyone knows who Batman is. There's really no need to make viewers sit through half a dozen solo films just to get to the big team-up. Instead, let the JLA movie introduce the new Hollywood versions of Wonder Woman, Flash, etc. and then spin them out into solo franchises (or you could make another Green Lantern film... Just Sayin')

Pace the Story

We've seen plenty of solo superhero adventures on the big screen by now, but prior to The Avengers, the only real team-based movies on tap were the X-Men and Fantastic Four franchises. Studios and filmmakers are still wrestling with the challenges of juggling so many heroes in one film. The first three X-Men movies are infamous for prioritizing Wolverine over all the other X-Men.

The Avengers juggled its various major players well considering the large cast and limited amount of room to work with. This is a lesson Warners will need to take to heart. Assuming they move straight ahead with the JLA movie, their challenges will be even greater. The script will need to properly introduce each of the individual heroes and develop a working dynamic over the course of two or three hours.

Part of the strategy Joss Whedon employed in The Avengers was to emphasize certain Avengers over the others. At its core, the movie was more focused on Tony Stark and Bruce Banner's personal journeys than the rest. Meanwhile, Hawkeye's role was downplayed relative to the rest of the team. This approach may upset fans of specific characters, but at the end of the day there's only so much you can accomplish in one film. Better to focus on the characters with the deepest connection to the conflict than struggle to find equal screen time for all. Otherwise, why not just make a TV show? And as long as the JLA movie doesn't hinge too heavily on one character a la the X-Men movies, fans will be able to roll with the punches.

Don't Skimp on the Humor

Marvel Studios' decision to put Joss Whedon in control of The Avengers paid off handsomely. Whedon has always been renowned for his distinctive humor, witty banter, and focus on character dynamics. Many unfamiliar Whedon fans were surprised to discover just how funny The Avengers was (including me). Hulk's brief battle with Loki made me die of laughter!

There's a place for dark, intensely dramatic storytelling in superhero movies. But it doesn't belong in a JLA film any more than it did in Avengers. Warner's' movie needs to be fun, and in some places it needs to be funny. The script should exploit all of the distinct character dynamics comic readers have grown to love over the decades. Like Thor, we should see Wonder Woman being out of touch with the mortal world. Like Iron Man, Green Lantern should be the cocky, wisecracking jerk who knows how to push buttons. Batman's grim demeanor should be used for its own brand of comedy.

It's easy to keep viewers captivated during extended battle sequences when buildings are exploding and aliens are being smacked from one side of the city to the other. All that requires is money. It's the quieter moments in between the big battles that can make or break a superhero movie. Warner's will need to find their own Joss Whedon to bring out the fun. If JLA can't make viewers laugh and get them emotionally invested in the various characters, it doesn't stand a chance of competing on The Avengers' level.

A Truly Epic Villain

As it reads in their mission statement, the Avengers were created “to fight the foes no single hero could withstand.” When you bring the team together, you can't have them fight just any old assortment of villains. A team-up between past Marvel villains (Red Skull, Abomination, etc) may have been a logical next step, but it wouldn't have brought the scale and sense of danger that pairing a fallen Asgardian god with an entire race of imperialistic aliens did. An ensemble superhero film needs a foe that really puts the full team to the test.

This is even more true for the JLA. In terms of powers and abilities, the core JLA cast far outranks the Avengers squad seen in the movie. Between the all-powerful Superman, warrior supreme Wonder Woman, the fearless and inventive Green Lantern, and the hyper-fast Flash, the JLA are almost like gods in the DC Universe. They need a foe that can provide a true challenge to all of that combined might.

Darkseid is a logical choice. This stony villain is a god in a more literal sense, ruling over the hellish planet of Apokolips for hundreds of thousands of years and searching endlessly for the elusive Anti-Life Equation. Darkseid even served as the foe that first battled the JLA in Geoff Johns and Jim Lee's recent, revamped origin tale.

Oh, and a spoilers... Since Thanos made his appearance, were are gonna need a big DC threat. That still leaves plenty of other options -- Amazo, Despero, the White Martians -- or even full teams of villains like the Secret Society of Supervillains or the Crime Syndicate. We just don't want to see some sort of tepid team-up between Lex Luthor and Joker driving the movie forward. The JLA are a team of incredibly powerful heroes, and they need a challenge that reflects that.

Don't be Afraid to Get Comic Book-y

With the rise of the Nolan Bat films,general viewers only think that they want realism in their superhero movies. These three movies have hand-picked the villains most suited to a more realistic and down-to-Earth version of the DCU. And that's why we'll never see teenaged sidekicks or Nolan's take on foes like Clayface or Killer Croc. Even at the beginning of the Marvel Studios movement, heroes and villains were steeped in science fiction rather than fantasy, and everything had a vaguely plausible aura about it.

Thor was Marvel's first attempt at dipping their toes into a larger, more colorful universe. Suddenly, viewers were seeing heroic conflicts steeped in fantasy and mythology rather than science fiction. The rainbow bridges and enchanted battle-suits of Thor paved the way for alien armies and cosmic cubes in The Avengers. By now, it's safe to say that audiences don't care if their superhero films are plausible and grounded in the real world.

The DC Universe is arguably even weirder and more crammed with eccentric characters and concepts than the Marvel Universe. This is a universe where Death is a happy-go-lucky goth chick, where an orphan boy can become the world's mightiest mortal by speaking a single word, and where the ability to eat anything is an actual super-power. There's no reason the JLA movie can't begin to take advantage of these elements. As long as the characters themselves are believable and true, the conflicts and settings can be as outlandish as the budget and effects technology will allow.

What Failed Before Can Still Work

The Avengers is frequently praised as being the greatest Hulk movie ever filmed. And it's true. Marvel's previous Hulk efforts were flawed at best, failing to achieve the popularity or box office success of franchises like Iron Man or Spider-Man. And until very recently, Marvel gave every indication that they were planning to skip a Hulk sequel during the next round of solo films. But thanks to Hulk's new found popularity in The Avengers and Mark Ruffalo's shiny new contract, that stance appears to be rapidly shifting.

Neither Green Lantern nor Superman Returns were the box office smashes Warner's was expecting them to be. But disappointing as they may have been, the studio shouldn't take that as a sign that viewers simply don't care about the characters. Superman Returns stumbled because it spent more time paying homage to the past than offering a fresh, exciting take on the character. Green Lantern fell flat because of a dull plot and characters who recalled too little of the depth and fun of the comics (being sandwiched between high-profile Marvel movies didn't help, either).

While I hope Man of Steel will have already done this for Superman, there's no reason a JLA movie can't revitalize these two characters every bit as capably as Avengers did for Hulk. These characters have remained vibrant in the comics all this time for a reason. The fact that DC's live-action adaptations have done a spotty job of adapting most of the JLA members doesn't mean these characters can't become as wildly successful as Iron Man and Captain America. It just requires a stronger, more focused effort.

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Although the gl should be John Stewart and not Hal Jordan.

Well I think that the White Martians would be cool. Also, I think General Zod could be DC's Loki if they wanted to connect the Man of Steel movie with the other movies. I think Darkseid will be a cool baddie! Also, if the movie is successful they have to do a Tower of Babel movie, in my opinion.