We all say it should be Steve Rogers but what if he doesn't want to be?
Who should be Captain America? Before you start yelling at me that it has to be Steve Rogers or mention the fact that we know he will be back in costume in July's new Captain America #1, let's discuss this. I want to be clear, in my eyes, Steve Rogers is Captain America. There have been others that have successfully taken up the mantle. When he 'died,' Bucky was the logical choice to become the new Cap. Since Bucky's return, he has been made into a great character, but we've barely seen him in the role of Captain America. Just when he was finally getting used to it, it was all taken away. During the Trial of Captain America, I started thinking this same question that was asked in Captain America #616, must there be a Captain America? If you read Captain America #615.1, you know that there's a certain someone that strongly believes one is needed. Now with Bucky currently locked away in a Russian gulag, the time seems perfect for Steve to return to being Captain America.
The only problem is, Steve never wanted to be Captain America in the first place. == TEASER == Does Steve Rogers have to be Captain America if it's not what he wants? He never wanted to take on the role. He just wanted to serve his country. Yes he volunteered to be part of the Super Soldier project but he was meant to be one of many soldiers. He never expected to be a symbol for the entire country. He has the burden of being that symbol. He wants to make the world a better place but doesn't feel the need to be in the spotlight.
Do we just say, "Too bad, Steve"? How long does he have to serve his country? We can assume that Bucky will get out of the Russian gulag but can he go back to being Captain America? He's been cleared of charges in the United States but would the public still accept him as their symbol, knowing what he was forced to do as the assassin, the Winter Soldier? I know I don't want someone else to take on the mantle of Captain America. When we saw someone new in issue #615.1, it didn't feel right. But that brought up another idea, could we have more than one Captain America at the same time? You can have more than one captain in the U.S. Army so why not more than one Captain America? I'm not trying to make this sound like Batman, Inc but why should the burden fall on one man? Why should it fall on one man that has already served for so long and sacrificed so much since first putting on the costume? Could we have Steve and Bucky both dressed as Captain America, as seen back in Captain America: Siege? We're going to (sort of) see the Captain America Corps in June, why not make this idea a permanent thing?
Captain America is a symbol for the people. When Steve had a conversation about his future with an old friend, he's told that now more than ever, people need a Captain America. And with Fear Itself about to wreck havoc across the Marvel Universe, that will become even more so.
It doesn't help Steve that he's just so good at being Captain America. Is it really all in the Super Soldier Serum that made him such an incredible hero and leader or is there just something inside him? There are so many other superheroes that could try to fill the boots of Captain America but it wouldn't seem right. It might be that Steve is stuck being Captain America until his final days.
I want to mention again that I do want Steve to return as Captain America. I knew the day would come the moment I read The Death of Captain America. He's been doing a lot since his return from behind the scenes. It's just he seems to best at being Captain America. Should Steve be stuck in a role he never wanted?
" @G-Man: Commander isn't an Army rank. General is though.
Why does Steve Rogers have to be Captain America? I don't think the arguments stand. I liked that he gave the mantle up to Bucky and took on the role Nick Fury: World's Top Cop. It lent to his maturity into a man who is no longer just a symbol of the American dream, but the ideal of moral and ethical protection of that dream. Cap represents America, Steve represents the protection of the American dream. That to me seems more important than going out on patrol in the streets, especially considering his predecessors in the job were lacking in the moral and ethical fortitude needed to get the job done with a clear conscience.
Unless it's a major event, we don't really need a Captain America. Steve Rogers can do whatever he bloody-well pleases and people will respect him anyway. Captain America was created as a weapon for war, it's an icon, a symbol, and the other heroes should be strong enough to survive without him. I'm not going to try to tell Steve he has to do something, let along something he doesn't want.
looking at current story lines, especially Secret Avengers and The Marvels Project, and leading back to the vintage, I would have John Steele reformed and chosen by Steve to be the new Cap.
Captain America doesn't really stand for anything anymore.He was iconic when we were at war with Vietnam,and in World War II but now he's just a popular superhero and that's all.Don't get me wrong..I love Captain America, but it's not like he's protecting us single handedly.He's an Avenger and he has been since his resurrection.He has god and superhumans fighting at his side.He's like Marvel's Superman but at the same time he's not.He's a big representative for our country but he doesn't really need to exist.He's a street leveler but he's not Batman or Black Panther level.Wakanda needs Black Panther, the DCU superhero community needs Batman..not because of his heroics but because of his intellect.In the Marvel Universe Captain America is just a role model.He's the blueprint for what a Superhero should be and he has enough characters following in his footsteps that, those values can be passed on without their being a Captain America or Cap related characters like Battlestar,Bucky,Nomad,Patriot etc.You have characters like Hawkeye,Daredevil,Falcon,Spider-Man that were huge Cap fanboys.They can let Steve go honestly.He doesn't do much for propaganda and uplifting the American people like he did before any of us were born.
@Osiris1428
said:
" How about Falcon or Luke Cage as Cap? Luke Cage has a variation of the SS Serum, right? "
Those aren't good ideas.First of all...we already have a black character who is trying to be like Cap.Patriot.Second of all those characters were less worthy of the SHIELD than Punisher.They need their own persona.Taking already established character and giving them another's mantle is pointless and more to the point annoying and predictable.
" There MUST be thousands of Batmen for some reason, so why not. "
Batman is the central authority in Gotham City.It's a huge city and full of criminals.Cap doesn't have a post.He's an Avenger.He lives in a tower full of superheroes in a city that is also full of superheroes.Half of the Marvel Universe lives in the same general area they don't actually need Cap there.Gotham City does however need a Batman.It's part of Batman's intimidation ability.Criminals fear the bat more than they do Robin or Red Robin or Nightwing or any of the other sidekicks\knock-offs and he actually has a jurisdiction to hold down, Cap doesn't.
" Captain America doesn't really stand for anything anymore.He was iconic when we were at war with Vietnam,and in World War II but now he's just a popular superhero and that's all.Don't get me wrong..I love Captain America, but it's not like he's protecting us single handedly.He's an Avenger and he has been since his resurrection.He has god and superhumans fighting at his side.He's like Marvel's Superman but at the same time he's not.He's a big representative for our country but he doesn't really need to exist.He's a street leveler but he's not Batman or Black Panther level.Wakanda needs Black Panther, the DCU superhero community needs Batman..not because of his heroics but because of his intellect.In the Marvel Universe Captain America is just a role model.He's the blueprint for what a Superhero should be and he has enough characters following in his footsteps that, those values can be passed on without their being a Captain America or Cap related characters like Battlestar,Bucky,Nomad,Patriot etc.You have characters like Hawkeye,Daredevil,Falcon,Spider-Man that were huge Cap fanboys.They can let Steve go honestly.He doesn't do much for propaganda and uplifting the American people like he did before any of us were born.
@Osiris1428
said:
" How about Falcon or Luke Cage as Cap? Luke Cage has a variation of the SS Serum, right? "
Those aren't good ideas.First of all...we already have a black character who is trying to be like Cap.Patriot.Second of all those characters were less worthy of the SHIELD than Punisher.They need their own persona.Taking already established character and giving them another's mantle is pointless and more to the point annoying and predictable.
"
But that's what they did with Bucky Barnes. And what does them being black have to do with anything. How are they less worthy of the mantle than some guy who goes around wagging a one man war against criminals via bullets in every direction. The Punisher is a manic, Luke Cage, Falcon, and Patriot are not. They have their "own personas."
But that's what they did with Bucky Barnes. And what does them being black have to do with anything. How are they less worthy of the mantle than some guy who goes around wagging a one man war against criminals via bullets in every direction. The Punisher is a manic, Luke Cage, Falcon, and Patriot are not. They have their "own personas." "
Bucky is basically Captain America's Robin.He doesn't have his own hero persona just like Tim,Jason,or Dick don't in comparison to Batman.Batman and Robin are essentially the same character.So Bucky going from Winter Soldier to Captain America is no different from Dick Grayson going from Nightwing to Batman.You chose two random black characters.The fact that they are black have nothing to do with my point other than the fact Cap already has a bunch of black clones (and I mean clone as in characters that are like him not characters that actual share the same DNA).Patriot and Battlestar are already out there so why take Cage or Falcon who actually have their own identity and give them Cap's mantle when Marvel already has two black characters that are basically the same as Steve that they aren't using.I said that the Punisher is more deserving of the mantle than Cage or Falcon because unlike them Frank Castle has actually fought for the our country in a war.The Punisher is not manic he simply has his own way of viewing how crime should be stopped.The Heroes want to put everyone in jail then they break out and they have to fight them again...but the Punisher kills them so that they don't come after their families or cause other people to die.I don't see any reason why Cage or Falcon would become Cap..it would serve no purpose.
Cage and Patriot have taken some form of the SSS. For that reason I could see it happening, but Punisher??? He goes against everything 616 Steve Rogers stands for, and Steve has told him that. So wouldn't making Punisher Captain America like making him closer to Ult Cap?
" Cage and Patriot have taken some form of the SSS. For that reason I could see it happening, but Punisher??? He goes against everything 616 Steve Rogers stands for, and Steve has told him that. So wouldn't making Punisher Captain America like making him closer to Ult Cap? "
Cage and Patriot have completely different powers though.The super soldier serum clearly has different effects depending on how their used.Sentry got his powers from the SSS.You wouldn't want him to be Cap would you? The Punisher doesn't go against everything Captain America stands for he goes against every SUPERHEROES stand for, thus the label Anti-hero...Frank and Steve do however share some similar views they just have a different way of doing things when it comes to putting the bad guys in their place.
" No one would accept The Punisher as Captain America. Not in the comics, nor as readers. "
He's already been Captain America.... EDIT: I'm not at all saying Frank makes a good Captain America; simply suggesting that his taking of the mantle was less ridiculous than Falcon or Cage doing it.
I can understand why Steve would be the most logical and obvious choice, but at the same time, America is supposed to be the symbol of freedom. And if we force him to be something he doesn't want to be that would kind of be...well....wrong. I know he is a...ahem....cold blooded murderer, but in the right sort of mind...kind of....how about Frank Castle? Properly monitored and guided by Nick Fury per say?
" I can understand why Steve would be the most logical and obvious choice, but at the same time, America is supposed to be the symbol of freedom. And if we force him to be something he doesn't want to be that would kind of be...well....wrong. I know he is a...ahem....cold blooded murderer, but in the right sort of mind...kind of....how about Frank Castle? Properly monitored and guided by Nick Fury per say? "
The Punisher isn't a cold blooded murder.He kills for a reason (a good one at that) and he kills specific people.He kills the bad guys, that's it.
" I can understand why Steve would be the most logical and obvious choice, but at the same time, America is supposed to be the symbol of freedom. And if we force him to be something he doesn't want to be that would kind of be...well....wrong. I know he is a...ahem....cold blooded murderer, but in the right sort of mind...kind of....how about Frank Castle? Properly monitored and guided by Nick Fury per say? "
The Punisher isn't a cold blooded murder.He kills for a reason (a good one at that) and he kills specific people.He kills the bad guys, that's it. "
So what is the justice system for? At least Batman tries to bring the enemy to court and have a fair trail. THIS GUY IS A MANIAC!!!!
@Osiris1428: He's kind of the middle guy here. He does kill and such in the name of justice, however, his methods are exactly humane. If he were to work along side with Nick Fury or something, I think it would work out for a short while at least. Who knows yea?
" I've made my thoughts on this known before. I'll repost here.
This is such BS. I knew they were going to do this as soon as it was announced that Steve was coming back, something that in and of itself also pissed me off.
Bringing Steve back negated everything that he died for, it completely takes away from his death and from the meaning of it.
Bucky was doing great as Captain America, he had grown into the role and gave it a fresh spin. He may not be the iconic true blue hero that Steve was, but he was a hero in his own right.
Steve had his position, Bucky had his. It was a fine system and a nice new twist for both characters. It was a good idea.
This is a freaking horrible one. I hate it as much as I hated them bringing Steve back.
"
This pretty much sums up everything I wanted to say (minus the cursing though :P lol)
I think that the persistence of the super soldier program and the number of people wearing the name "Captain America" over the years in the Marvel Universes points to one answer:
There must be a Captain America at all costs (at least in the view of the US government).
Doesn't have to be Steve Rogers though. The real question is whether Steve Rogers sees himself as Steve Rogers or whether he views himself as Captain America.
Personally, I think he should stay in his "Nick Fury like" role. Bucky was doing a fine job as Cap, and it made sense for Steve to move on and serve a "higher purpose".
But I think it would be cool if he would don the old Captain America Uniform, and fight along side is fellow heroes in dire situations, when they could use the moral boost he obviously gives, like say, in all those Big Events that are supposed to change the Marvel Universe forever...until the next event.
So to sum it up, he should stay Commander Rogers, or whatever they call him, and during the Events, he should join the fight as Captain America. Bucky should remain as the "full-time" Captain America.
@SpideyIvyDaredevilFan26: Why should he be Cap!? He already has his own firmly established identity. It wouldn't make much sense for him to just change into a new one.
Yes, there must be a Captain America. He's an American cultural icon. He's one of the top-5 greatest superheroes ever. Besides; not having/using the name or character of Captain America would squander the legacy and future potential of this iconic character.
There must be a Captain America. Also, it must be the Captain America; Steve Rogers.
Im from Argentina and seriously... every time you call yourselves AMERICA is a spit in the face to the rest of the continent so if you ask me, NO there souldn't be a captain america or patriot of capitalism like Fantomex calls him
" Im from Argentina and seriously... every time you call yourselves AMERICA is a spit in the face to the rest of the continent so if you ask me, NO there souldn't be a captain america or patriot of capitalism like Fantomex calls him "
" Im from Argentina and seriously... every time you call yourselves AMERICA is a spit in the face to the rest of the continent so if you ask me, NO there souldn't be a captain america or patriot of capitalism like Fantomex calls him "
He makes a...controversial point. I mean, what does he stand for today? This ain't exactly WWII.
" Im from Argentina and seriously... every time you call yourselves AMERICA is a spit in the face to the rest of the continent so if you ask me, NO there souldn't be a captain america or patriot of capitalism like Fantomex calls him "
He makes a...controversial point. I mean, what does he stand for today? This ain't exactly WWII. "
America is part of our countries name.(UNITED STATES OF AMERICA) so catching feelings because we call our country America or that a character is called Captain America because his persona is based on this country is just silly to me.You can call him a patriot of capitalism but that's not what Captain America stands for.His values have nothing to do with our way as a capitalist country.
Steve Rogers became so conflicted with the role and how he felt about the direction America was taking he abandoned the title and took on a new one-NOMAD: A man without country. "His values have nothing to do with our way as a capitalist country." Why should have to represent himself in a way he does not want to?
" Steve Rogers became so conflicted with the role and how he felt about the direction America was taking he abandoned the title and took on a new one-NOMAD: A man without country. "His values have nothing to do with our way as a capitalist country." Why should have to represent himself in a way he does not want to? "
I don't think you understood what I meant.Steve Rogers stands for Freedom,Liberty,The Pursuit of Happiness, the core values of the United States of America.Something like Capitalism has nothing to do with Steve Rogers beliefs and values what so ever.Just because he represents the United States as Captain America doesn't mean that he shares all of the same views as our government.Steve Rogers became Nomad when he found out a US government official (possibly the current President at the time) was running a terrorist organization.It had nothing to do with America as a country.
To answer the question as simply as I can, yes, there must be a Captain America. In the marvel world where people go psyco at the drop of a hat, where people like Tony Stark forget who their friends are and begin a crusade to arrest all his friends who refuse to register just because they disagreed with the law. He's a symbol that even people like the Punisher will not go against. So Captain America is desperately needed.
Now we come to the issue of respect. It's one thing to wear the costume and another thing to stand for what it represents. Steve Rogers is the only one who really does that. Bucky won the right to wear the suit for a while, but, I never bought him as Captain America. Maybe it was his use of a gun, maybe it was because Black Widow sided against Steve Rogers in the whole Civil War thing and now is shacking up with Steve's replacement. I don't know but I couldn't accept him over Steve. He was a decent replacement as long as Steve didn't want to do it, but, well, let's quote spider-man here. With great power comes great responsibility. He doesn't want to do it, but he's needed and that's just the kind of man Steve Rogers is. His country needs him, he will be the first to defend it.
" How long is Bucky going to be in Russia for? I have yet read the last couple issues. "
He's only been in Russia for one issue so far, but I think he's only going to be there for the next few issues. The next story arc I believe from what I've read is going to focus on Bucky dealing with being in prison while Steve tries to find a way to free his friend.
Steve is The Patriot. You can't tell me that The Patriot do not wants to be the symbol of liberty, he isn't a teenager, he is a mature man, he loves his state, the idea of freedom, the rights of every man more than everything, he can't say "oh mumy, I don't want to be Cap america anymore, it is stressful! >.<" where is the boy who sacrificed everything for his country, becoming Cap. A? Oh c'mon steve, what is wrong with Marvel heroes? What's next? Thor hates his long blond hair? He wants a brown mohawk? Oh God...
i say give steve a new mantle...how bout just keep the soldier/captain idea and just take out the America part...so hes not serving "the stars and stripes"......keep the shield...maybe just change the colors to greys or camos...get rid of that stupid A on his forehead...and just leave it blank please...
Here's a question. Okay, so, Cap is running around the world recruiting super soldiers right? What happened to Diamondback? I mean, she was injected with the super soldier serium, her entire goal has been to try and be worth of Captain America so... why is he ignoring her now?
Oh, well, they already did the Captain. A problem I have with Captain America, and a problem Brubaker himself has posted on forums is that, all the stories tend to repeat themselves. Marvel wants to tell the same thing over and over again because it sells, but they don't want to venture into new territory too much. As a result it's just a question of how many times can we tell the same story and simply change the players. So...yes, there very well could be a Captain, why not. they did it once before right?
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