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Kaine's Final (?) Fate Revealed in SCARLET SPIDER #25

The latest solicitation reveals tough times are ahead for Kaine, but what exactly does it mean? We take a few guesses.

Marvel's December solicitations were released today and the one for SCARLET SPIDER #25 is absolutely worth discussing.

LAST DEVASTATING ISSUE!

• It’s over. Kaine did his best to be a hero. He failed.

• What about Houston?! Who lives? Who dies? Is there a place for the Scarlet Spider in this world? The answers will surprise you.

• Two years and 25 issues have led to THIS! Guest starring: MEXICO!

First and foremost... LAST ISSUE?!?! Despite being loved here at Comic Vine (it even won the "Best Spider-Man Family Series" poll), Kaine's sales have never been all that grand, so sadly, this comes as no real surprise. It's terrible, terrible news, but unfortunately expected. Nonetheless, this is horrible news for fans of the series -- and there are many of you on this site -- so take a much needed moment or two to vent before reading on.

Cover for #25. Even though the series is ending, can Ryan Stegman PLEASE keep releasing Kaine covers? They're SO good.

"Kaine did his best to be a hero. He failed." When it comes to being a hero, there's two key qualities: doing the right thing and saving lives. In Kaine's latest story, 'Into the Grave,' the Kravinoff family (Ana and Sergei) is striking at the anti-hero's friends. Kaine's lovable supporting cast has apparently been abducted by Sergei's daughter. We know for a fact Aracely is alive and likely being held hostage (we saw her get slashed in the arm and pass out -- most likely due to poison), but it's uncertain if the rest share the same fate because they were all attacked out of our line of sight.

So, why is Kraven taking the people Kaine cares about? Well, it's probably because Kraven wants to die and Kaine's one of the two people capable of doing it. And, in the event he refuses, they'll likely force him into doing it by harming or even killing his loved ones. If Kaine considers himself a failure as a hero, it's surely because he's been forced into killing Kraven, was unable to save the people he cares about... or -- dare I say it -- both of those occurred (which we're betting on). Kaine has been through a whole lot when it comes to his struggle being a hero and being "good," but the combination of being unable to protect the people he cares the most about and being manipulated into killing could be enough to make him pack up and finally make it to Mexico.

For those unfamiliar with why the Spider-Man villain has a death wish, it's because he chose to take his life in the conclusion of 'Kraven's Last Hunt.' In his mind, he proved he was the superior Spider-Man and to him, that was the greatest thing he could accomplish in life. Feeling complete and left without any challenges, he opted to take his own life. Fast forward to 'Grim Hunt.' Kraven's family used "Spider-Man's" blood to resurrect the villain, but they were unaware it was actually Kaine posing as Spidey (which he did to save Parker). Naturally, Kraven wasn't happy about abruptly being brought back, and to make matters even worse, only Peter Parker can end his life. But, seeing as Kaine's a clone of the webhead, surely he can, too. Kraven's not a stupid man by any measure and has likely reached this conclusion as well. He wants nothing more than to go back to his eternal rest, and odds are he thinks Kaine is the man for the job. If he won't do it willingly, then Sergei will force his hand by threatening the people he'd do anything to save. Unfortunately, we think this means a life or two (not including Kraven's) may be lost in the process. But what does this mean for Ana? If we had to guess, she'll be the one to carry on the "Kraven the Hunter" legacy. Heck, she's already killed her brother just to prove she's worthy of the name.

Perfect world scenario, though? Since the Venom symbiote is probably leaving Flash Thompson due to events over in SUPERIOR SPIDER-MAN, Kaine should randomly jump into that story and become the new host instead of potentially fleeing to Mexico. We know the chances of that happening are incredibly slim, but you can't blame us for dreaming, right?

This is all just speculation, mind you. Do you think this is what could go down in the conclusion of SCARLET SPIDER or do you have your own theories? And, if someone is indeed going to die, who do you think it'll be?

'Tis better to have loved and lost than never to have loved at all, right?

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Posted by Mangakid1995

So it's the end of Scarlet Spider huh? Well it was going to end sooner or later, with a book like this it always does. Regardless of how hard Kaine was trying to be a hero former villains like him always either end up going back to they're old ways or retiring all together, I'm sure there are some exceptions but I can't think of any.

On a side note: would they take the symbiote from Flash? It feels like they're starting to spread Agent Venom throughout the 616, he's one of the Thunderbolts he was a secret avenger pre AVX and doesn't he appear in Fearless Defenders this week? I feel like if they were gonna take Venom from him they would have been more gradual.

Edited by pulseangel666

@pulseangel666: I really do hope Kaine ends happy....but alas, I lost faith in Marvel around the character assassination of Peter Parker as orchestrated by Slott for the last few years.

Really and truly, I feel like Marvel Now doesn't want -any- threat to Slott's writing. I suspect SSM Team-Up or whatever it is called now will get cancelled when it's arc ends. All so 'we the fans' can have the 'top selling' Spider-Man title, Superior.

I threw up in my mouth a little at that. Plus, I think you are right. I think Otto will end up killing/destroying the 2099 future. It already looks like he will. Or he'll save it and then permanently lock it out of time travel cause Miguel is a better hero than he will ever be. And if that is 'Miles' in the new Mighty Avengers in the 'ill fitting' costume, I'm not putting alot of money down on him surviving 'Infinity'. I'm getting a very Highlander 'There can be only one Spider-Man' vibe from everything Marvel, and it is really sad....because it's crap.

Amen to that, fully agree with you.

Edited by RybackStun

I'd love to see another Spider-Men storyline. But instead of Parker/Morales you bring in six 'Spider-Men"

Kaine, Kraven, Thompson, Brock, Morales, and O'Hara.

I'd buy that.

Sad to see Venom and Scarlet Spider go, but whoever pointed out that Captain Marvel is getting cancelled PLEASE don't be pulling my leg. I hope they bring back Ms. Marvel sometime in the future, Captain Marvel just doesn't fit her.

Posted by Strider92

So it's the end of Scarlet Spider huh? Well it was going to end sooner or later, with a book like this it always does. Regardless of how hard Kaine was trying to be a hero former villains like him always either end up going back to they're old ways or retiring all together, I'm sure there are some exceptions but I can't think of any.

On a side note: would they take the symbiote from Flash? It feels like they're starting to spread Agent Venom throughout the 616, he's one of the Thunderbolts he was a secret avenger pre AVX and doesn't he appear in Fearless Defenders this week? I feel like if they were gonna take Venom from him they would have been more gradual.

Flash looses the Symbiote in Superior Spider-man 23 and we get Superior Venom in issue 24.........Nope I am not even joking:

SUPERIOR SPIDER-MAN #23

Dan Slott and Chris Gage (W)

Humberto Ramos (A/C)

Variant cover BY Skottie Young

DARKEST HOURS Part 2 of 4: “Complications”

• As Otto Octavius takes another big step in his life as Peter Parker... could a big part of Flash Thompson’s life be coming to a close? Will he be... VENOM NO MORE?!

• More with MJ! More with Carlie! More with the Green Goblin! And, after half a century, one of the most cringe-worthy moments in ALL of Spidey-history! You do NOT want to miss this one!

SUPERIOR SPIDER-MAN #24

Dan Slott and Chris Gage (W)

Humberto Ramos (A/C)

Variant cover BY Stefano Caselli

DARKEST HOURS Part 3 of 4: “Complications”

• The birth of a new Goblin! The return of Cardiac! MJ’s greatest fear!

• And the one question everyone will be asking: “Who is THE SUPERIOR VENOM?!”

• Good luck, Superior Spider-Man! You’re gonna need it!

32 PGS./Rated T …$3.99

Edited by PunyParker

And again,for all you've done the past yrs to the Spider-Family.......go throw yourself of a bridge,Marvel.

Edited by Dernman

Guest starring Mexico? Damn how they going to fit that many people in one comic book?

Edited by kid Apollo

@thefirstlantern: Superior Scarlet Venom?

when i first read 'guest starring Mexico' i totally picture the entire country walking around fighting people

Posted by Drewyetti

When Stegman left scarlet spider to focus on superior, that's when this series started to go downhill and all the other artists tried their efforts but they artwork was not as attractive for the sales to improve despite the well-written story arc.

Posted by frozenedge

First Venom now Scarlet Spider? At least I've still got Superior Spider-Man to get my anti-hero spider fix (at least until the inevitable return of goody-two shoes Parker)

Posted by MonkeyToe

Wow. There is a lot of 'Superior' hate going on in this thread, which surprises me since I have actually been enjoying that story.

Edited by BritishMonkey

That sucks. I just got the trades too hoping I could get this series in place of Venom being finished.

Posted by jashro44

Does anyone know what other title Yost is writing next?

Online
Posted by G_Money_Christmas

I never read Venom but I liked Scarlet Spider, I just didn't have room on my pull-list. They better end Hawkeye! and they better stop having these stupid hiatuses! When books are gone for so long, people forget about them!

Posted by k4tzm4n

Are you the series is ending? Or is this just a prediction based on the solicitations. I might be in denial but unless Marvel makes an announcement that Scarlet Spider is ending I will continue believing the series will carry on. I love Scarlet Spider and belive he should be in more series.

Posted by WWAJfan

@strider92:

the idea of a Supes Venom just makes me Sick, Agent Venom was already beyong being Superior. If they remove the Symbi from Flash im dropping comicbooks permanently

Edited by TheFirstLantern
Posted by TommytheHitman

I've found myself laughing at a LOT of decisions Marvel's made recently.

Edited by k4tzm4n

@wwajfan said:

@strider92:

the idea of a Supes Venom just makes me Sick, Agent Venom was already beyong being Superior. If they remove the Symbi from Flash im dropping comicbooks permanently

Well, at least you're about to save a lot of money...

Posted by Saren

I hope MJ is the new Venom.

Moderator
Edited by Strider92

@k4tzm4n: To be fair Scarlet Spider lasted two years which is good considering it was built from nothing. At least he was popular enough not to go into limbo. Maybe we'll see him on the Thunderbolts or Dark Avengers in the furture if Yost doesn't kill him of course.

I hope MJ is the new Venom.

I kinda want to see that lol!

Posted by Ando123

I think this series is gonna be rebooted in all new marvel now

Posted by laflux
Posted by Wyldsong

Well hell, it's official, after December I am completely, totally, and irrevocably done with Marvel. Scarlet Spider was the last Marvel title on my reading list...

Online
Posted by warlock360

ctrl+f -> no "Ben"

alt+F4

Edited by MadeinBangladesh

Both Venom and SS cancelled. WTF!

Posted by WWAJfan
Posted by noj

Thunderbolts, A+X, a million crappy avengers titles, a big push on the booooooring inhumans (wanna do a new film marvel? I know you don't actually own the rights to most of your properties and a clutching at straws-but seriously?) kid nova, fearless estrogen, journey into 'where's Thor?'... And more rubbish, still being spewed out by marvel, and the BRILLIANT Scarlet spider gets cancelled!? Obviously Kaine and Venom aren't properties Marvel can turn into films, so don't receive the same grooming and publicity of rubbish like 'the-only bothered about Black Bolt-inhumans'. Ridiculous.

THIS Im SO tired of hearing the Inhumans! Its a damn shame we are getting an Inhumans book and losing Scarlet Spider. Its a shame a great artist like Joe Mad is being wasted on an Inhumans book. If Marvel had bothered getting an awesome artist like Joe Mad on the book after Stegman left maybe more people wouldve tried it out!

Posted by Phaedrusgr

So, Scarlet Spider cancelled. Well, Marvel, I must admit I really hate you right now...

Posted by scarspider

You suck Marvel. God forbid you keep publishing a good book for the sake that it's a good book. Ok so the sales aren't as great as other Marvel comics but that's b/c the majority of people are stupid who have no taste. At least leave us intelligent few a morsel to chew on!

Posted by mickeyangel

Not trying to be small minded or closed off to new ideas, but honestly, personally I'm not interested in spiderman without a true blue peter Parker. So I haven't even picked up superior. Could be the best book in the world and I'm not interested. So I delved into venom and scarlet spider and loved both books. Now the spider universe shrinks again. Ciao. Well I am still enjoying solos books daredevil and hawkeye. A nice breather from the over crowded avengers team book universe. It just looks exhausting,

Edited by CaptainHoopla

I hate seeing everyone blame Marvel/DC for series cancellations. Do people actually think somebody at Marvel just up and said "hey, I don't like this book, I think we'll cancel it." Books get cancelled because they are no longer or near no longer profitable. Publishing books is a business, they are required to make profits. The news stinks, I've bought, supported, and loved the book for a while now. Unfortunately in this day and age, the money makers are #1 issues and event books and all of their crossover/tie-ins.

Online
Posted by TobenRacicot

Thunderbolts, A+X, a million crappy avengers titles, a big push on the booooooring inhumans (wanna do a new film marvel? I know you don't actually own the rights to most of your properties and a clutching at straws-but seriously?) kid nova, fearless estrogen, journey into 'where's Thor?'... And more rubbish, still being spewed out by marvel, and the BRILLIANT Scarlet spider gets cancelled!? Obviously Kaine and Venom aren't properties Marvel can turn into films, so don't receive the same grooming and publicity of rubbish like 'the-only bothered about Black Bolt-inhumans'. Ridiculous.

this is awesome and so true! made me so sad to read this. and you know as much as i love marvel i dont think im gonna keep switching up books. im going over to image more and more. Sorry Marvel. I don't like the avengers. I don't like x-men. I like Venom, Scarlet Spider, Daredevil, and Spider-Man. And the first two are gone. And i am only buying this arc of Superior to have add to my 2099 collection!

Posted by Captain13

It hasn't broken Diamond's Top 100 for a while now. Marvel put good talent on it and advertised it. Blame the fans.

Posted by GraniteSoldier

@k4tzm4n:

First Venom, and now (potentially) Kaine. Sad day in Spider-Land. Your idea about Kaine getting the symbiote though, that's superbly awesome. Scarlet Venom? I could get on board.

Posted by hyenascar

Don't bring Peter back, and keep Kaine alive. Yeah right, i 'll never get so lucky. I loved Scarlet spider, one of only two physical single monthly titles i kept up with. Still would trade series to never see Peter again. Time for Legacy characters to start. New characters living and dying/retiring and people taking up the costumes.

Posted by Rolls7royce

Not Scarlet Spider too! And yet we another Avengers title. I hate what they are doing with the Spider-Man books right now. Hopefully Kaine and Flash will show up in Superior to help get Peter back. This is depressing.

Posted by Mrgreenlantern

I said it before BUY 2 COPIES!!!! we can double the sales guys. Its a small price to pay if we can save this book

Edited by danhimself

I don't understand...I've never heard anyone say a bad thing about the book....you put Bat something or Super something or Avengers something in the title of a book and it's guaranteed to sell but Spider family books don't sell...that's just weird

Edited by garlyle

The above sums up how I feel about this, but the worst part of all this is that Slott continues to get to waste page space with superior spiderman, but Scarlet Spider, far and away the best spider anything of the shelves, gets cancelled. I don't even know who to be mad at. I buy the trades. I buy the individual issue. I tell people about it. I can blame IGN because they refused to review it, but they suck in general, and are only a small part of the problem. Bryan Millers Batgirl, Demon Knights, Frankenstein, I Vampire, Journey into Mystery, and now Scarlet Spider....*sigh*

Edited by Vaccine

No. PLEASE, NO.

Posted by Darkseid_Prime

Soon there won't be a Spider-Man of any kind... Just Otto and Spider-Men from the past/future

Posted by WaveMotionCannon

@iaconpoint: boo hoo you hate SSM. The people who should be ashamed of themselves are the ones who didn't buy Scarlet Spider ( myself included as I came late and have been buying back issues since jumping on). This was a great book that deserved more shine and notoriety. Damn.

Posted by Mrgreenlantern

First sunday freight train loses his 5dw world title to big donnie now this..

Posted by thenexusrebound

@thenexusrebound said:

This stinks. I loved Venom and I love Scarlet Spider. Now I do worry about the Ultimate universe ending but Brian Woods made it seem like it would still keep going. I mean in the past few months they have introed too many characters to just end it. A shame though Kaine is going away though.

The Ultimate Universe better not end. It's currently my favorite comic book universe. (Yes,ahead of 616 and DC-New 52...the old DCU is dead so they are not in this).

I hate how only the cash cows survive. It doesn't matter if other titles were more amazing (or at times,better) than the main titles,if it isn't a cash cow and in the top-tier,it will get cancelled. I HATE seeing great books cancelled. Like the ones hawkguy listed. I swear they are gonna end Hawkeye next.

Although the titles not being supported is also a huge factor in this.

I doubt it will end even for Ultimate Comics Spider-man they talk about the intro of another new hero. If it was ending what would be the point of adding new characters for one additional book. Also the Cataclyms solicitation says Miles only goes to 616 to find out how to stop Galactus not that he is there for keeps. So here is hopping that I am right.

Posted by Deranged Midget

@revendawn said:

Seeing as how the comments are already derailing into Superior Spider-Man hate and what not. Do we know what's going on with the solicitations for Amazing Spider-Man 700.1 - 700.5 claiming the return of Peter Parker?

Likely just a series of Peter Parker adventures set in the pre-#700 past, to appease the people who want to see him back in the costume.

Wouldn't be the first time they continued off the main series again after creating a different on-going though. We're undoubtedly going to see the return of Peter anyway, perhaps it's a countdown?

Moderator
Posted by Deranged Midget

I hope MJ is the new Venom.

That would be nuts, although I can kinda see it becoming Carlie.

Moderator
Posted by InnerVenom123

I just want Kaine to get a happy ending.

Posted by Mrgreenlantern

I'm a sad panda..

Posted by Sammo21

Marvel and DC are apparently in a race to see how many of their titles I can drop in one year. Venom and Scarlet Spider are getting cancelled and then there are rumors that Flash Thompson will be losing the symbiote in Superior Spider-Man around the end of the year? This is gross. This reminds me of when Morrison got a hold of Batman and that got utterly ruined for me. I really started enjoying a lot of Marvel titles but it feels that we are getting fewer "Spider Family" titles because Marvel is going to try and make room for Miles...then he'll defeat Spock and he'll become the new Spider-Man. After Nick Fury Jr I have a feeling that Marvel 616 is going to start becoming the new Ultimate Marvel universe.

Edited by sparty-dbq

What else can I possibly say except...

I mean seriously, I know Scarlet wasn't a best-seller, but it was still well above the unofficial kill line of 20,000 copies a month. There has to be a story reason why both this and Venom are ending virtually at the same time, and the implications terrify me, especially after reading the solicits for the other guy's books. What is Marvel planning? Another two or three books for Spider-Felon to be in? Just have him infect and take over everything he touches like the virus he is? All just to polish Dan Slobb's crank some more, that fat greaseball?!

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