DC Comics Announces New BIRDS OF PREY Writer

I think Stargirl should be in the Birds of Prey.

coooooooooooooooooooooooooool

@arnoldoaad: Well, that's your opinion, and you're entitled to it, but I just don't agree.

@Zeeguy91 said:

Who else thinks that Hawk and Dove should join this team? They need it after their series failed.

i always thought hawk and dove was the best with hank and dawn

Mr. Freeze!

Dislike the new lineup almost as much as I hate the new Mister Freeze so guess I will not be reading this one.

@Ravager4: Funny you say that because Batwoman's image was actually created as a 'Dark batgirl' for the justice mini series ;)

@Zeeguy91 said:

@arnoldoaad: Well don't you think it'd be better to give Hank more rather than just saying "nah, lets just keep him in limbo."

I think we already seen enough of him with the last series

and yeah i wouldnt mind him staying in limbo

but it is not the same for Dove

bottomline is, Dove is interesting, Hank is not

@arnoldoaad: Well don't you think it'd be better to give Hank more rather than just saying "nah, lets just keep him in limbo."

@Zeeguy91 said:

@arnoldoaad: I wasn't even talking about the Talon. And, yeah, I think she does have some potential as a character to grow.

And, um, Hank wasn't created by Liefeld. He and Don were both created by Steve Ditko and actually the concept that they originally embodied was something that was very relevant to the times. They symbolized the debate over Vietnam, with Hank personifying the "warhawk", gung ho stance and Don personifying the "dove", pacifist stance. That personality/concept is something that can be developed, cultivated, etc.

Oh sorry i thought you were

as for Liefeld yeah he didnt created him but he did recreated him, twice as a matter of a fact

he is just this very strong guy, thats it, he has nothing else around it

@arnoldoaad: I'm not downing Holly. In fact, I don't think there is really an angle that you could explore with Hank that you can't explore with Holly, but the fact is that Hank is currently Hawk and, therefore, would be the natural choice. We just need to work with what we have.

@arnoldoaad: I wasn't even talking about the Talon. And, yeah, I think she does have some potential as a character to grow.

And, um, Hank wasn't created by Liefeld. He and Don were both created by Steve Ditko and actually the concept that they originally embodied was something that was very relevant to the times. They symbolized the debate over Vietnam, with Hank personifying the "warhawk", gung ho stance and Don personifying the "dove", pacifist stance. That personality/concept is something that can be developed, cultivated, etc.

@Zeeguy91 said:

@Ravager4: That's fair. I'm not trying to argue, I'm just saying that it would be nice to see Hank and Dawn be placed somewhere in the DCU. both characters have potential, but have been stuck in character limbo after their series failed.

I need to ask, what kind of potential do you see from Hank that doesnt work with Holly?

@Ravager4: That's fair. I'm not trying to argue, I'm just saying that it would be nice to see Hank and Dawn be placed somewhere in the DCU. both characters have potential, but have been stuck in character limbo after their series failed.

@Zeeguy91 said:

@arnoldoaad: Every character has the potential to be interesting of written well. If a particular character is underdeveloped, why would you want to shove them aside? Instead, I'd say that's all the more reason to give more spotlight to said character. To develop them further.

because is a talon, she is just a mute zombie, there are better talons with more personality than Mary, and she has a very bizarre backstory, I still know some people that read Batgirl 9 and honetly thought that Mary was the Asian chick of the stoyr

@Zeeguy91 said:

@Ravager4: Well, to be fair, a lot of people did some screwed up shit during Blackest Night. Ronnie Raymond killed Jason Rusch's girlfriend and was revived, and then him and Jason fused together during Brightest Day. You can't blame Hank for killing Holly anymore than you can blame a bear for killing a fish, because it wasn't really Hank, it was a Black Lantern, a monster. He was being controlled to a certain extent and it was in his "nature" to seek out and kill people.

I dont think it has anything to do with Blackest Night

Hank is just boring, he is just a vanilla Liefeld character with a very bland personality, there is really nothing more i can say about him

and on the other hand Dove was one of the best parts of Blackest Night and Brightest Day, but the sole connection with Hawk just makes the character more dull

@Zeeguy91: I wasn't trying to argue that Holly was the original Hawk, but she was the Hawk at the time, meaning that when Hank killed her and became Hawk again, he was replacing the current Hawk, Holly. And since she was the Hawk that I was first introduced to and grew to like, he certainly replaced her to me, and I can't look past that.

@Ravager4: Well, "replacement" might not be the right word, given that Hank was in fact the original Hawk. But, to each their own, I guess.

@Zeeguy91: and that does absolutely nothing to help my stance on him. He bores me, he was a cheap replacement for a character I actually enjoyed, and I don't want anything to do with him. And I can certainly still blame DC for making the decision to have it happen, but since I'm not going to boycott all of DC because of it, it'll just have to be Hank. I do not regret that decision at all.

@Ravager4: Well, to be fair, a lot of people did some screwed up shit during Blackest Night. Ronnie Raymond killed Jason Rusch's girlfriend and was revived, and then him and Jason fused together during Brightest Day. You can't blame Hank for killing Holly anymore than you can blame a bear for killing a fish, because it wasn't really Hank, it was a Black Lantern, a monster. He was being controlled to a certain extent and it was in his "nature" to seek out and kill people.

@arnoldoaad: Every character has the potential to be interesting of written well. If a particular character is underdeveloped, why would you want to shove them aside? Instead, I'd say that's all the more reason to give more spotlight to said character. To develop them further.

@Zeeguy91 said:

@Ravager4 said:

@Zeeguy91 said:

Who else thinks that Hawk and Dove should join this team? They need it after their series failed.

Not as long as Hawk is Hank. Bring back Holly.

I actually would prefer Hank to Holly. Who says the Birds of Prey have to be an all female team? I remember that Hank was a member at one point. As long as the team is majority female, then I think Hank would be a welcome addition to the roster.

It doesnt matter if its male or Female

Hank is BORING

Holly is way more interesting

@Zeeguy91 said:

@Ravager4 said:

@Zeeguy91 said:

Who else thinks that Hawk and Dove should join this team? They need it after their series failed.

Not as long as Hawk is Hank. Bring back Holly.

I actually would prefer Hank to Holly. Who says the Birds of Prey have to be an all female team? I remember that Hank was a member at one point. As long as the team is majority female, then I think Hank would be a welcome addition to the roster.

I never said I didn't want him because he was a male. Hank has genuinely never interested me whatsoever, and the horrendous way that he replaced Holly back in Blackest Night by killing her, coming back to life, and then taking her place again (because yeah, who wouldn't want to be partnered with the guy who killed your sister?), was a kick in the balls to me, as someone who actually liked Holly as a character. I boycott all stories that has Hank as Hawk because of that.

@Ravager4 said:

@Zeeguy91 said:

Who else thinks that Hawk and Dove should join this team? They need it after their series failed.

Not as long as Hawk is Hank. Bring back Holly.

I actually would prefer Hank to Holly. Who says the Birds of Prey have to be an all female team? I remember that Hank was a member at one point. As long as the team is majority female, then I think Hank would be a welcome addition to the roster.

@Zeeguy91 said:

Who else thinks that Hawk and Dove should join this team? They need it after their series failed.

Not as long as Hawk is Hank. Bring back Holly.

Who else thinks that Hawk and Dove should join this team? They need it after their series failed.

About time

Totally not feeling Freeze with the mohawk...

@Ravager4: Youre making it sound as if I personally believe theyre the same character. I don't. I know they're very different, and I know just because they are mute well-trained fighters doesn't make them one alike. But it just seemed odd to me that Gail had been complaining about Cass not being in it this whole time and then creates a character with one of Cass' most striking characteristics.

sweet... have been reading birds of prey since the beginning

I am sad to see the previous writer go. I love the book so far and the team. Batgirl and Black Canary are two of my favorite DC characters so this a tailor made book for me.

Dropped it a couple of months back. Not interested in picking it back up.

@entropy_aegis said:

Cassandra Cain minus a decade of character development YAWN.

and minus any hint of personality and as a zombie

Book might get better

Cassandra Cain minus a decade of character development and Mr Freeze? YAWN.

I like Strix's look.

I prefer Black Canary have her own non-bat related team like having Cassandra Cain (no code name necessary but any code name should be ok), Cheshire, Vixen, Gypsy, etc. I really feel bad that Black Canary has become part of Batman's angels.

@queenfrost_: doesn't really seem like all that odd phrasing... she was responding to the people who were seeing Cass in Mary, and saying that if that gave them solace, then she was happy for that. She wasn't trying to insinuate that this is the new Cass and that's all you're going to get. Simone is a huge fan of Cass, and has tried to get the likes of her and Steph back into existence more than anyone else. I find it honestly very difficult to believe that she would ever purposefully create a character to substitute one of them and expect the fans to just accept that. I mean hell, Mary was going to be killed off/frozen like the other Talons until Scott Snyder asked to keep her alive for further use. It wasn't Simone deciding that Cass needed a replacement. There are some similarities, sure, but there's also differences. Being a mute fighter and female automatically makes her a Cass stand in? Their backgrounds, fighting styles, sense of character, are completely different. She might be similar to when Cass first started out, but compared to who Cass became as a character they're not even remotely close.

@Ravager4: I've read it before. As much as Gail says all that, its pretty obvious she created and is trying to tell people that Talon is all that she can offer to please Cass fans. "if she reminds people a little bit of a character who is benched and if that makes some people happy, then I am all for that." just seems like odd phrasing to me...But thats just me. Im all for talon/snix being her own character

@queenfrost_: Read my second post, there's a clear story around Mary's creation, and it has nothing to do with "oh, well let's replace Cass."

@Ravager4: Ok maybe she didnt actually say it word-for-word but its pretty obvious that's why.

I don't want to see Strix's mouth. When you have a full face covering mask, you shouldn't show someone's mouth through it. It just looks weird. Like when Deadpool smiles, I don't like that.

@queenfrost_: and also:

Gail Simone said:

lauralot89 asked: I've never read anything featuring Cassandra Cain, but after the annual came out I've seen a lot of comic readers online calling Talon Mary an expy of her. Do you think they're especially similar, or is this like when people said New 52 Barbara was just like Stephanie in terms of personality?

People saying Barbara is just like Steph don’t know their history at all, wow. The voices are not similar. If we have a model, it’s Batgirl: Year One and I think that’s pretty clear to anyone who has read that book. Believe me, I love Steph, I love Barbara, comparing them is a dead end every time. They’re different characters entirely. I am amazed anyone thinks their voices or MO’s are the same. The tone is different, it’s a different book. But, being two of the only young women with optimistic viewpoints in Gotham, I can see how people would latch on to that, but it’s pretty superficial. I can’t see Barbara having Steph’s adventures or vice versa, can you? They just don’t fit at all.

The thing with Mary (soon to be called “Strix,”) is that she was based on true stories of young children traumatized by bombs in WWII, something no country really wanted to talk about. The main difference is that Cass’ silence was due to her upbringing. Mary is physically unable to speak at all, period, ever.

The silence is the main thing that is similar, Mary’s not a martial artist in the traditional sense. She’s got the Talon abilities and is an astounding acrobat, very fierce, very feral in combat. And of course, Cass eventually was able to speak (in a very moving series of stories). And Mary lacks Cass’ complicated backstory and body reading abilities.

I also think it’s fair to say that Cass has had a conscience for a long time, something that Mary is only just discovering. When you’re writing the characters, things like that just seem immense, huge, like a vast character gulf.

When Mary was created, we wanted to give a moving background to a Talon, to make her different from all the rest. She’s a thousand times more in common with the other Talons than Cass…but if she reminds people of Cass a little bit, from Cass’ early days, I think that’s lovely, too.

Scott Snyder absolutely loved her in the original script and outline, and he is the one who first asked that she not die or be frozen. Then the reader response was so high that we got the opportunity to flesh her out a bit more. As her character grows, I think we’ll see very little similarity…but that bit IS out of my hands a little, as Duane is working with her in Birds of Prey. But he’s been great and I’m convinced he’s going to make her a wonderful addition to that book.

I love her, I think there’s tremendous potential.

I really really hate when stories continue in a title other than the one they started in. That is frickin infuriating. This could be fun though. The BoP writing has kind of been all over the place. I was looking forward to Ivy being a good guy and they wrecked it.

@queenfrost_ said:

@ThanosIsMad said:

@G-Man said:

@darkrider: Kinda seems like she's replacing Cassandra Cain as well. :(

"Kinda"? I think it's pretty blatant at this point. The girl can barely speak, but can read body movements and is an exceptional fighter. She's Cass Cain in all but the name.

Gail Simone - her creator - even said so herself. She said that since DC wont let her bring back Cass, she made Talon as a substitute.

No she didn't

Gail Simone said:

@Anonymous asked:

I think that a lot of fans are trying to relate Cass and Steph to current characters, often as a way to either cope or hate. But I do think that though Cass is dearly missed, I really don't see much of her character in Mary. Cass is an especially unique character. And Steph and Babs are very different characters and I don't see how they are that much alike, though they do have the most similar sense of drive of the bats.

Well, I think that first thing is true and I sympathize, that’s a kind way to see it. I should be more patient…but I’ve always kind of loathed that thing that two dissimilar female characters are the same because they have red hair or they’re both black or bat-themed or whatever superficial similarity they share. You can have twelve million Green Lanterns and people don’t say that. But with female characters, it happens ALL THE TIME, and it’s frustrating to here, particularly when to any passing examination, the characters aren’t even remotely similar.

I agree about Cass. I love Mary, but she could never replace Cass in the DCU or in my heart or in the hearts of readers. She’s a different character. However, in this one case, if she reminds people a little bit of a character who is benched and if that makes some people happy, then I am all for that.

She never once said that she created Mary to substitute Cass.

Omg no! I cant believe Dinah's leg was amputated :(

@ThanosIsMad said:

@G-Man said:

@darkrider: Kinda seems like she's replacing Cassandra Cain as well. :(

"Kinda"? I think it's pretty blatant at this point. The girl can barely speak, but can read body movements and is an exceptional fighter. She's Cass Cain in all but the name.

Gail Simone - her creator - even said so herself. She said that since DC wont let her bring back Cass, she made Talon as a substitute.

Havent read anything ftom the birds since issue 5

Havent read anything ftom the birds since issue 5

Bring back Helena Bertinelli