Comic Vine News

61 Comments

Comic Vine Battle of the Week Results: Green Arrow vs. Punisher

When all the arrows and bullets have been used, who's left standing? Come see who the CV community thinks would win this fight!

Oliver Queen: a man who's incredibly skilled with a bow, has a plethora of trick arrows and a whole lot of talent. Frank Castle: a dude who can endure an absurd amount of pain, is beyond talented with firearms and has no problem fighting dirty. No matter who walks away from this one, it's sure to be epic. The winner will likely be in need of a band-aid or two, that's for sure.

Would Oliver's accuracy and trick arrows keep Marvel's brutal anti-hero down for the count, or would Frank overcome the archer? Voting and debate was open all week and result is clear: the Comic Vine community sides with Punisher in this brawl. 54% think Castle has what it takes to win, while 38% think DC's hero will triumph. A mere 7% think it's just too close to call, meaning they basically have an equal shot at winning.

It's easy to root for the Emerald Archer based on how excellent his current run is (thanks to Jeff Lemire/Andrea Sorrentino/Marcelo Maiolo), but in the end, the majority has a hefty amount of logic and reason on their side. There's no denying the combination of Oliver's accuracy and trick arrows is a huge wild card and he certainly has plenty of experience dealing with gunmen. One solid use of a trick arrow absolutely holds the potential to pave the way to victory, but Frank's combination of incredible pain tolerance (an arrow to the thigh, shoulder, wrist or even abdomen won't slow him down that much), skill (both armed and unarmed) and tactics should let him win after a good battle.

Frank has the accuracy and means to pose a threat at a distance and the combination of his sharp mind and pain tolerance should allow him to eventually close the gap. It's unlikely he'll go for fatal shots since he can tell he's possibly fighting a fellow hero, but even when holding back, Frank possess the skill and tenacity to be just as effective while going non-lethal. His shots could be used to manipulate Ollie's movements in combat and he knows where to tag if he doesn't want to end his enemy's life. If it comes down to close range -- which is definitely probable in this scenario -- Ollie can give him hell (especially with proper use of an electric arrow or other trick arrows in close proximity), but Frank's ruthless close combat methods and more than formidable degree of skill should allow him to overcome, even if he takes numerous arrows and hits in the process. It should be a spectacular battle, but ultimately, Frank does indeed have what it takes to earn a small majority.

Viner Argument of the Week for Punisher is by specialmonkey7

"The Punisher, hands down. It would be an amazing fight with bullets and arrows peppering the air. Blood would flow on both ends but when it really comes down to it; Ollie Queen doesn't have the fire in his heart that Frank Castle does. Sure, he has the spirit, he has the drive to do good but Frank Castle is a machine at this point. He is the angel of death and his mission is the destruction of crime in general and he can't let anything stand in his way. Though he wouldn't kill Ollie, Frank would make sure that he stayed down before it was over. Ollie knows arrows, Frank knows almost everything else AND arrows...."

Corey Schroeder, Comic Vine writer

"If they weren't both aware of each other at the outset, I'd say Punisher had this locked up easily. Since they start out facing each other, it seems likely they'd fire at almost the same instant, but Ollie's thinking two steps ahead and fired his arrow down the barrel of Frank's rifle causing the triggering mechanism to break. Another arrow impacts Castle's chest, but his body armor takes most of it as he quickly realizes he can't win this fight at a distance and charges forward.

Ollie slams his bow across Castle's head, but the spec ops soldier has had worse hangovers than this headache and closes the remaining distance. Now it's where Queen doesn't want to be, he's in a place where his trick arrows can't help him AND he's outmatched in terms of his close combat skills. After taking a couple of solid hits to the jaw and abdomen, it becomes clear he's not winning this fight, so he takes the one arrow out that might save him and detonates it. A cloud of smoke fills the area and Ollie flees into the cityscape, but Castle's right behind him, only losing him for a few minutes. Long enough for Ollie to set up a decoy and lie in wait, catching his breath and waiting for his moment.

The flash of a skull is all he needs to see before firing an incendiary arrow, lighting up the empty vest as Castle wraps a massive arm around Ollie's neck. "Didn't work for Charlie. Doesn't work for you," is the last thing he hears before losing consciousness."

Ladies and gentlemen, there's no teaser image because next week will be an all-new BATMAN BATTLE OF THE MONTH (throws e-confetti)! Who will the Dark Knight square off against next? Thor? Stilt-Man? Carl Grimes? Check the homepage on Monday to find out!

Previous 'Comic Vine Battle of the Week' results

Want to suggest a Battle of the Week? Feel free to comment below or send it to Gregg via Twitter. It doesn't have to be Marvel or DC!

66 Comments
  • 66 results
  • 1
  • 2
Posted by CheeseSticks

Wow, i can think of many better argument of the week.

Posted by funckygarcon

love the fight scenario that Corey Schroeder set, it's awesome and I guess it could happen in a real showdown between Ollie and Frank.

Posted by nickzambuto

Darn, was hoping I'd get featured on this one.

Online
Posted by Superbat420

Don't understand how this is even an argument, I'm a dc guy who has nothing to do with marvel, and I can tell you hands down arrow loses

Posted by doombot890

excellent

*hand pyramid of evil*

Posted by turel_hash_ak_gik

arrows vs bullets. and bullets win.

Posted by k4tzm4n

Wow, i can think of many better argument of the week.

Been highlighting a lot of essays recently and thought I'd give some love to a post which is simple and straight to the point. Plus, a lot of the more elaborate posts included points which I disagreed with or apparently didn't read what gear the characters had.

Online
Posted by Lvenger

Corey's fight scene was a good way of the fight playing out and honestly, it's a much more solid conclusion that Frank can take out Ollie. If it was Pre New 52 Ollie, then I'd side with Ollie. Frank may have experience but Pre New 52 Ollie would have him down in the ranged and close quarter areas.

Posted by k4tzm4n

arrows vs bullets. and bullets win.

Haha. But really, characters like Hawkeye and Green Arrow have proven numerous times they have the talent and resources required to overcome people with automatic weapons. Heck, in one of the recent Green Arrow issues Ollie humiliated what appeared to be a more than plentiful amount of gunmen. This simply boils down to Frank's attributes -- not the fact he has a gun.

Online
Posted by turel_hash_ak_gik

@k4tzm4n: i know. just wanted to add some humour.

Posted by k4tzm4n

@k4tzm4n: i know. just wanted to add some humour.

I hear ya, but it was a good opportunity to express my thoughts on it. A surprising amount of arguments essentially banked on "bullets > arrows!"

Online
Posted by Xwraith

I'm not entirely surprised with this one.

Posted by k4tzm4n

@xwraith said:

I'm not entirely surprised with this one.

I honestly thought there would be more support for Oliver. He may not have as many showings in the New 52, but they've still been quite impressive along the way and I legitimately believe it would be a really fun battle to witness. Oh well.

Online
Posted by AlKusanagi

Well, bullets kinda do trump arrows. It was one of the defining moments in the history of warfare when a peasant with minutes of training could become a match for a bowman with decades of training.

Posted by Lvenger

@k4tzm4n: If this were Pre Flashpoint Ollie you used, I would have voted for him. He has insane accuracy feats and decent combat feats which would outweigh Frank's experience and versatility with weapons. For me anyway.

Posted by Xwraith

@k4tzm4n: Green Arrow is both my favorite DC character and DC book, but I was not expecting him to win.

Posted by k4tzm4n

@lvenger said:

@k4tzm4n: If this were Pre Flashpoint Ollie you used, I would have voted for him. He has insane accuracy feats and decent combat feats which would outweigh Frank's experience and versatility with weapons. For me anyway.

I can't help but wonder how many people would have misused the fight where Deathstroke purposely loses. Yeah, deciding between the two versions wasn't easy and honestly, I thought the plethora of villains Ollie has faced in the new 52 already would be ample enough. Additionally, he's showcased a lot of cool tech, but I guess that was an error on my part. At the end of the day, I just hope it was at least fun to speculate.

Online
Posted by Lvenger

@k4tzm4n: You're right, that fight would have been posted out of context to support Ollie winning. And it was fun to speculate as I waited for a convincing argument to turn me but with this fight, I see Ollie losing it mostly.

Posted by EvilPenguin543

Batman vs. Stilt-Man: MAKE IT HAPPEN!

Edited by kcvic

@k4tzm4n: batman vs Carl grimes ...lol..I'd go with Carl just cause ...Damian Wayne vs Carl would be better

Edited by wade_wilson22

Wow this is an odd fight. Odd pairing. They don't have themes to their fights like on: Marvel DC Forum Fight Clubs

Edited by k4tzm4n

@wade_wilson22 said:

Wow this is an odd fight. Odd pairing. They don't have themes to their fights like on: Marvel DC Forum Fight Clubs

Dude, you gotta stop spamming your webpage. If you have an article you're sharing from it, sure, that works. But every comment? No.

Online
Edited by Pokeysteve

LOL @ corey's scenario. Arrow's aren't fitting down the barrel of a gun and I don't think bullet proof vests will stop an arrow!

The argument of the week (while nicely written) includes zero facts that would actually sway a battle hahaha.

Edited by RisingBean

Definitely could see it happening this way. Then again, I could see Ollie pulling out a win too. Frank is one mean S.O.B. though.

Posted by TommyJones1945

Pfft, whatevs.

Posted by CrazyScarecrow

Seems to be a typo. Green Arrow should've been the winner.

Posted by i_like_swords
Online
Posted by CheeseSticks

@k4tzm4n said:

@cheesesticks said:

Wow, i can think of many better argument of the week.

Been highlighting a lot of essays recently and thought I'd give some love to a post which is simple and straight to the point. Plus, a lot of the more elaborate posts included points which I disagreed with or apparently didn't read what gear the characters had.

I'm ok with that, it's just that there was plenty of post with feats and argument and the one you choose was only a post saying that Punisher has more hearth and he know guns AND arrow.

Posted by Super_SoldierXII

@k4tzm4n said:

@cheesesticks said:

Wow, i can think of many better argument of the week.

Been highlighting a lot of essays recently and thought I'd give some love to a post which is simple and straight to the point. Plus, a lot of the more elaborate posts included points which I disagreed with or apparently didn't read what gear the characters had.

I'm ok with that, it's just that there was plenty of post with feats and argument and the one you choose was only a post saying that Punisher has more hearth and he know guns AND arrow.

I thought it was a fun, quirky rundown scenario - which is refreshing. More so than our common & popularly used essay type recounts, replete with showings and feats as to why character A) beats character B).

Of itself, this more common type of argument isn't terrible ... but it's fun to break the mold and read someone arguing the merits of a battle scenario creatively like that.

Posted by NoahMcnasty

@k4tzm4n so 16 percent difference means it could go either way. hmmm. we get it you like green arrow

Edited by CheeseSticks

@super_soldierxii: Agree, but saying that the Punisher win because ''Ollie Queen doesn't have the fire in his heart '' is complete BS.

Posted by Super_SoldierXII

@super_soldierxii: Agree, but saying that the Punisher win because ''Ollie Queen doesn't have the fire in his heart '' is complete BS.

Yeah ... it's a bit ... shall we say ... Cheesy? :P

Edited by ULTRAstarkiller

Batman vs Cable I hope

Posted by CheeseSticks

@cheesesticks said:

@super_soldierxii: Agree, but saying that the Punisher win because ''Ollie Queen doesn't have the fire in his heart '' is complete BS.

Yeah ... it's a bit ... shall we say ... Cheesy? :P

Exactly ahah

Posted by Iron_Turtle

@pokeysteve:

Modern standard issue body armour with ceramic/metal/poly plates absolutely would stop an arrow. And the some.

Edited by k4tzm4n

@noahmcnasty said:

@k4tzm4n so 16 percent difference means it could go either way. hmmm. we get it you like green arrow

What are you talking about? I sided with Punisher. If you're using the results to imply it doesn't have the potential to be close, then you're vastly underestimating Green Arrow. I'll never use the poll results to justify my own opinion, either. For example, Deathstroke took a big lead over Ultimate Cap, but that hardly means it's not a good fight which also holds the potential to go either way. Hell, Nightcrawler WRECKED Gambit in the votes and that's something I certainly don't agree with. And for the record, personal preference doesn't mean jack in these when forming my opinions. If they did, the DBAW of TMNT, Gambit and Deadpool would have looked VERY different.

Online
Edited by turoksonofstone

If this is new 52 Green Arrow I guess the outcome is OK Some earlier versions of Green Arrow could take Punisher IMO. Great Stuff.

Posted by Pokeysteve

@pokeysteve:

Modern standard issue body armour with ceramic/metal/poly plates absolutely would stop an arrow. And the some.

That armor is designed to stop bullets. Not arrows. Most won't stop knives.

Posted by Zadoulo

Wow...what happened to the boxing glove arrow? That arrow can really knock a person out cold.

Edited by DecoyElite

@zadoulo said:

Wow...what happened to the boxing glove arrow? That arrow can really knock a person out cold.

Yeah never underestimate the boxing glove arrow, just ask The Key.

Posted by Praetor_fenix

When bad comes to worse, it's not important if you are the stronger or the fastest, the thoughest one wins. And i really can't think of many normal humans tougher than Frank, Batman, and maybe (and it's a BIG maybe) Moon Knight.

Posted by Wilbertus

This was a great matchup. I love Green Arrow, but I think Punisher deserved the win here.

Edited by ImmortalOne

I really can't take the argument of the week seriously.

Ollie doesn't have the fire in his heart? Frank is a machine? An angel of death? I mean, come on.

Posted by Iron_Turtle

@pokeysteve:

I'm basing this off of my personal experience with modern body armour issued in theatre to British and US troops. Of which I've had the pleasure of wearing for a number of years.

Most modern body armour is a combination of synthetic weaves, and metal, ceramic, or poly plates.

The people that designed body armour quickly realised that in theatre, that a synthetic weave alone was not enough to stop shrapnel flying at high velocity from nearly explosions, certain types of ammunition, or as you have stated, knives and other bladed or pointed articles. This has pretty much been the standard minimum requirement of all combat body armour since the 90's.

Now, if the punisher can get his hands on the high end assault weaponry and tech that he uses. It only stands to reason that he can at the very least get hold of standard military issue body armour which is mass produced and distributed by the thousands.

Edited by Mezmero

I voted for Ollie but I agree with this result. I figured Punisher would hold back on a fellow costumed crusader but we've recently seen him deal with some of the strongest Avengers by his lonesome without killing them. He has even subdued some of the top Marvel acrobats like Spider-Man and the Daredevil. Ollie's slick but his athletics can't compare to those levels. I felt Green Arrow's experience against foes with firearms gave him the edge but I can accept that Frank Castle is too efficient a combatant for Ollie to trick with arrows. Pretty neat battle this week. Next Batman fight better be Moon Knight or Joseph Joestar.

Posted by nickzambuto

@k4tzm4n said:

@turel_hash_ak_gik said:

@k4tzm4n: i know. just wanted to add some humour.

I hear ya, but it was a good opportunity to express my thoughts on it. A surprising amount of arguments essentially banked on "bullets > arrows!"

But assuming Arrow and Punisher have the same amount of skill, it should boil down to the fact that Frank can dodge arrows a lot easier than Oliver can dodge bullets (even trick arrows), so weaponry does factor in.

Online
Posted by Ace20XD6

Well I have to say, this is one of their better photoshops for these battles.

Edited by k4tzm4n

@nickzambuto said:

@k4tzm4n said:

@turel_hash_ak_gik said:

@k4tzm4n: i know. just wanted to add some humour.

I hear ya, but it was a good opportunity to express my thoughts on it. A surprising amount of arguments essentially banked on "bullets > arrows!"

But assuming Arrow and Punisher have the same amount of skill, it should boil down to the fact that Frank can dodge arrows a lot easier than Oliver can dodge bullets (even trick arrows), so weaponry does factor in.

Except some of those arrows are explosive. Others are electric. Others can incapacitate him in place. So on and so on. Saying "bullets > arrows!" is vastly underestimating the factors, ESPECIALLY when the man with bullets is VERY unlikely to go for the kill. Hell, in my eyes, Punisher doesn't even win "because he has a gun," he wins because he has the means to get close and from there, has what it takes to win in a close combat battle. That outcome seems far more probable than victory via bullets at a distance based on their mindsets.

Online
Edited by k4tzm4n

@ace20xd6 said:

Well I have to say, this is one of their better photoshops for these battles.

Why thank you! I wish it wasn't raining in Ollie's image, but I thought it was a great match.

Also, I use Microsoft Paint for all of my images :D

Online
  • 66 results
  • 1
  • 2