Comic Vine Battle of the Week: Gambit vs. Nightcrawler

I am huge Gambit fan, but this fight would definitely go to Nightcrawler. The Blue Elf would only need to find an opening with this fight, latch on to the Cajun, and teleport him dizzy. This tactic is where Gambit's spatial awareness (depending to which one of his ability sets you subscribe to) becomes a liability. Sorry, Rems!

@blazinasian112 said:

It will go something like this.....Nightcrawler is one BAMF!

You do realize he did that to a character who he knew would survive the fall and had his teammates in danger, right? There's about a 0% chance an in character Kurt would teledrop Remy like that.

I think Gambit would win the match against Nightcrawler. As, gambit can kinetically charge the surrounding battlefield with explosive energy. This would impact Nightcrawler from where he is standing to where he would teleport to.

Elf.

Gambit's optimal range is ~30-50 feet, but teleporting instantly closes the distance. Once in close, Nightcrawler's agility and speed would overwhelm any human martial artist (which is what Gambit would be at this point).

It will go something like this.....Nightcrawler is one BAMF!

@admiral_ironbeast said:

@cadencev2 said:

I think people confuse Teleportation with light speed or something.

Example, Ultimate Nightcralwer.

As seen, Ultimate Kurt is a very skilled Teleporter himself, however it can be countered by skillful foes.

"I would like to point out that Longshot is not just a skilled fighter--he is a mutant with the power to change the chance an event will occur. Moreover, Longshot used this power of his to make it easier for him to tag Kurt...without it, there was no way he would have caught him.

I like to point out in no statement or even hinted showing is this true. Long Shot did not even show up till after NC was stabbed.

Thats like saying Gah Lak Tus was defeated because Long Shot was on the planet.... that is not a real argument.

Dang this a tough one. I think in the end Nightcrawler would win this one. Marveldcforum had a cool fights a few months ago. It was Nightcrawler vs Beast Boy. Here's the link http://marveldcforum.com/index.php?topic=433.0 I think this month they are doing Nova vs Green Lantern

@cadencev2 said:

I think people confuse Teleportation with light speed or something.

Example, Ultimate Nightcralwer.

As seen, Ultimate Kurt is a very skilled Teleporter himself, however it can be countered by skillful foes.

Now lets see how this works with 616 Kurt!

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1) Tagged by Cyclopes who predicted where he will go.

2-3) Tagged by Iron Fist twice who predicted where he can go as well being faster than NC reaction.

4) Wolverine is faster than NC reaction!

5) As Kurt states, he is not as fast as Spidey in reaction time!

How is this so one sided!?

I would like to point out that Longshot is not just a skilled fighter--he is a mutant with the power to change the chance an event will occur. Moreover, Longshot used this power of his to make it easier for him to tag Kurt...without it, there was no way he would have caught him.

that said, I still think Gambit can win this, as NC with morals will not go for the kill, and will try to knockout Gambit instead. Here's the problem with this---Gambit can charge organic matter or metal, meaning that as soon as Kurt hits Gambit with his fists or his sword there is a change Kurt will go boom. As Gambit's morals are not nearly as much of a high standard as Kurt's morals are, I see Gambit opting to explode Kurt before Kurt is able to not out Gambit.

"To my friends, de name's Remy LeBeau. To my enemies, it's Gambit! You can go on ahead an' forget dat first name right about now. I throw de cards. De cards go boom! End of bad guy. End of story. "

"If ya mess wit t'e KING's QUEEN, youd better watch your ACE, JACK. You know it's a bad sign when I'm de voice of reason..."

Nightcrawler no questions asked

admittedly, i didn't think out my 'argument' (if it can be called that) at all.

but Gambit not using his horseman powers and not having them is very different. i think it's like the Angel situation where he (angel) needed the life seed to cure the corruption. the horseman is still there, just dormant. please correct me if wrong.

i won't lie, i want gambit to win. and he isn't above cheating to do it. so he should be able to use his horseman powers anyway. why? because! that's why.

im a big remy fan, but I think nightcrawler has this one in hand! sorry gambit!

Wow. This is a hard one.

Let's start off with what they have. Nightcrawler has swords, and he can teleport. Gambit has a staff, and he can "charge up" objects and when he releases them, they explode.

One of the most obvious things stated by Nightcrawler fans is that he could teleport behind Gambit. But Gambit is a rather quick guy. He may or may not be taken down by this. Plus, since they are both in character, Gambit would know Nightcrawler and be ready for this from the start. So teleporting won't necessarily give Nightcrawler the advantage, though it is a handy tool at his disposal.

That being said, Nightcrawler also knows Gambit. So he would know that if he maintained distance, Gambit would probably use his trademark offense, throwing cards. And Nighcrawler has incredible agility as well as teleportation. So keeping his distance would certainly allow him to jump/teleport around rather safely. So Gambit's distance isn't necessarily an advantage either.

Both their weapons serve them well. Gambit has some range with his staff though, so that would work very well at fending off Nightcrawler with his swords. Nightcrawler will probably have a little more speed on his side do to the nature of his weapons (Plus the teleporting).

Being that the fight is at night, both of them would have plenty of space to hide, and would excel at it. Gambit is a master thief and Nighcrawler....well...look at his name, haha. Both of them would be proficient at hiding and using stealth tactics.

In the end I think this goes to...(*drum roll*)

Nightcrawler!

I actually would like to give this one to Gambit, but logic tells me otherwise, and here's why. It's the combination on stealth and teleportation that give him the advantage. Physically the both are pretty well equipped, they have mutant abilities that are impressive, and their weapons serve them well, but Nightcrawler can not only hide in the shadows, but teleport between shadows. I can see this to be quite an advantage to Kurt, especially since Gambit needs to run between cover. The battle taking place at night gives this one to Nighcrawler, but in the day, I would almost say "Too Close to Call."

Marvel battles get suggested more often and K4tz generally knows more about Marvel characters. Same reason his personal picks are usually street level, it's what he usually reads.

Although you'd be surprised how often he gets called a DC fanboy. :P

Why are these battles so biased to Marvel characters? Anyway, Nightcrawler wins.

IF GAMBIT HAS HIS FULL RANGE OF POWERS HE COULD TAKE THE ELF JUST BY LOOKING AT HIM. at the height of his power Gambit had the ability to charge objects, even living being, just by looking at it.

Nightcrawler is my 3rd favorite comic character is existence, yet Gambit really is a better fighter. So, I know where my vote goes.

lol based on what? got any proof to that? Cus I got proof to the contrary (besides the fact that @jashro44: just gave 5 examples of how predictable Kurt is)....

Remy is faster than Nightcrawler, he caught a projectile shot at him (may or may not be at bullet speed), not only is he a casual bullet/laser dodger but he makes it look easy, a knife was thrown and was caught when it was an inch away from his face...

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not only does he dodge bullets easily, but he displays agility to rival that of nightcrawler while he does it

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More reaction speed (bullet dodging/laser blocking)

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More of everything...

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He's above Kurt as far as I've seen in speed and easily comparable in agility, now for Remy's combat speed against legitimate super human's with superhuman speed ..... Such as squaring off with and dodging Blade who has super human speed and decades of fighting experience/skill...

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Gambit dodges Spider-Man who is also quite super human in speed and a casual bullet timer ...

Gambit hangs with Wolverine who is also a casual bullet blocker/dodger, known for his incredible speed as well as one of the most skilled individuals on Marvel Earth.

Last but not least, the speed at which he can charge objects for a simple KO....

And with that I can safely say that Gambit wins, teleporting around won't work when he gets tagged by an exploding card or is caught when he reappears since Remy is most likely going to predict his next move and slap him with a staff....what's your excuse?

Nightcrawler. Even with morals on he could still outdo any trickery Gambit would bring.

I'm posting this here just to give gambit some support....

All right Here are some scans of why I believe Gambit takes this. These scans have all ready been uploaded but I am uploading them again just to remind everyone:

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Here we see various comments on nightcrawlers ports. The first scan is iron fist and nightcrawlers first encounter. Iron fist didn't know any thing about nightcrawler and yet he was able to predict his ports. And not only that but iron fist states there is one second between nightcrawlers punch and his ports. So there not an instantaneous thing. He has to think and actually punch gambit before he ports away. Next one is cyclops remarking how nightcrawler likes to teleport above people (an observation his team mates have probably made). The prior scan to wolverine punching nightcrawler he used a stealth trick to disappear. He knew nightcrawler would teleport down and look for him and then he got ambushed. This is just to further show its not just cyclops who predicts his ports. Again we see cyclops toss wolverine at nightcrawler so he tries to port above cyclops to attack. Cyclops knew this and tags him.

The point of these scans is to show that nightcrawlers ports have been predictable and this increases the odds of him getting tagged. Gambit being a teammate has probably observed nightcrawlers ports and probably knows nightcrawler likes to attack from above. So he has a very strong chance of guessing nightcrawlers ports.

Moving on to Gambits reflexes.

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The first 2 scans he deflects bullets with ease. Next he gets surprised by rubber bullets and dodges the shot and the second scan is a nice showing of the potential radius of his blasts. The final scan shows Gambit catching an RPG. I haven't seen much to indicate from nightcrawler that he has the reflexes of gambit. And another thing to consider is that gambit would also have better reach in melee due to his staff.

Now for accuracy.

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First scan is self explanatory. The second scan shows gambit is accurate even when he is using his agility. The next scan doubles as both a reaction and a accuracy feat. Gambit shoots spider-mans web balls out of the air (spider-man has used his webbing to create shields after bullets have been fired). Next 2 Gambit throws his cards down sabretooths throat.

I know it sounds like I am down playing nightcrawler but the major point of the scans of him being tagged isn't to show him getting tagged. Its to show that his ports are predictable. Read cyclops comment about his ports. He knew where nightcrawler was. He didn't guess. Iron fist didn't know anything about nightcrawler and he was able to predict his ports after a short bit. Gambits reflexes are sufficient enough to tag nightcrawler and so is his accuracy.

@ashtonred6: Venom eats Bane for a light afternoon snack

@k4tzm4n: Ahhh, thanks for clearing that up.

no no no. no one wins when brothers fight. i protest this. sigh humans

Only once and it wasn't actually Kurt -- it was an illusion. I believe the other example someone cited was from a TV show. Regardless, it does go to show he's more tactical than some seem to think.

@boschepg: Remy apparently been said a few time beaten NC twice already. If that is true.....

In character, would Kurt risk this maneuver? If he was wrong, he could kill Gambit. I still think Kurt wins though

@cadencev2 said:

I think people confuse Teleportation with light speed or something.

Example, Ultimate Nightcralwer.

As seen, Ultimate Kurt is a very skilled Teleporter himself, however it can be countered by skillful foes.

Now lets see how this works with 616 Kurt!

Gallery

1) Tagged by Cyclopes who predicted where he will go.

2-3) Tagged by Iron Fist twice who predicted where he can go as well being faster than NC reaction.

4) Wolverine is faster than NC reaction!

5) As Kurt states, he is not as fast as Spidey in reaction time!

How is this so one sided!?

my dude, Cadence.

You know how I think in battle scenarios, so I agree it isnt one sided, but unless Gambit has a way of predicting where NC is going to end up that I dont know about, than I say the person that can close distance in NC will win.

1-Cyclops basically trained NC. Gambit has far less training time with NC

2-Iron Fist is the best martial artist in 616. Above Gambit

3-Gambit has got his licks in on Logan but I personally rank Logan ahead of Remy

I know Remy has fought Sabertooth and people like that, but NC closes on people is pretty good in battle scenarios

@super_soldierxii:

Is it ever not :P?

Good argument.

A+

hmmm I say stalemate. And here's why. NC can easily avoid losing to Gambit but he won't do much to beat him since this is morals on he won't kill his fellow X-Man. There is an argument in story that if he attempt to teleport Gambit to a high area and dropping him on the ground to KO him, but in order to do that he has to hold on to Gambit who will have the advantage hear, he can charge some card and make a small kinetic explosion to knock him off. Though Gambit specializes in long ranged attacks, they're not gonna help him against NC. Gambit has no way of tagging NC unless he gets too close.

With morals gambit wins because he is a master of the dirty shot. They both know each other making NC lose a lot of his advantage. To add on too that kurts morals do him in. He would waist too much time allowing him to be caught off guard. In a no morals fight the battle would end in a second. To who ever struck first

Nightcrawler.

Gambit has beaten Nightcrawler easily before, twice, once in the Gambit/Bishop crossover comic book series, and once on the Wolverine & The X-Men cartoon. That's 2 times already Gambit has beaten Nightcrawler easily. I'm getting pretty tired of people saying "what if" they'd battle. It's been done. If you allow fans to vote for it, then Nightcrawler wins easily because there are more Nightcrawler fans (not really sure why, he's never appealed to me much) and lots of Gambit haters (also not really sure why, he's not a bad character). Gambit is a clever fighter and knows Nightcrawler's ability, so he'd predict where he'd teleport. Gambit would intentionally throw explosives at him knowing he'd teleport behind him, and then have some charged explosives waiting for him to knock him out when he teleports near him, likely from behind. Also, Gambit is a dirtier fighter than Nightcrawler, with no hesitations due to religious beliefs. Maybe if Nightcrawler had it in him to play dirty, like Azazel, he could stand a chance, .

But yeah, this battle of the week is a sham. Gambit deserves this one, but he's so unpopular nowadays, he even loses to someone like Nightwing just because some bias fans decided so.

Ooooh, also it should be mentioned that this would just be the prettiest, purplest fight of all time!

nightcrawler....and as much as I like gambit he would lose but mainly because its a random encounter..if they knew each other it would be different I still think gambit would lose but not as badly as he does here.

While Kurt seems to be the heavy favorite here, it should be noted that he doesn't have a ranged attack. Even porting requires him to get in close, which could go very wrong very quickly with Remy's combination of heightened senses/agility and kinetic charging. If Kurt grabs Remy and ports him into the air, those couple of seconds would be more than enough for Remy to, say, charge up Kurt's outfit, then BOOOM! goes the Elf! I think Remy would also be quicker to get serious; any hesitation from Kurt is gonna equal a world of hurt. Unless Kurt opens the fight at 100%, I'm gonna say Remy takes this, especially the longer the fight goes on.

I think Gambit has this.

I'm voting for my boy NightcrawlerA!

I think people confuse Teleportation with light speed or something.

Example, Ultimate Nightcralwer.

As seen, Ultimate Kurt is a very skilled Teleporter himself, however it can be countered by skillful foes.

Now lets see how this works with 616 Kurt!

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1) Tagged by Cyclopes who predicted where he will go.

2-3) Tagged by Iron Fist twice who predicted where he can go as well being faster than NC reaction.

4) Wolverine is faster than NC reaction!

5) As Kurt states, he is not as fast as Spidey in reaction time!

How is this so one sided!?

@god_spawn:

This has me convinced, Nightcrawler wouldn't kill Gambit outright.

I call that makes no sense. Like, at all.

Gambit vs. deceased Nightcrawler with a hole in his chest = no debate since one of them can't fight. Or breathe. Or anything.

Gambit with his insanely powerful and loosely defined Horseman powers = unfair, not to mention he hasn't had 'em for months.

There's not much else I can add. Nightcrawler is my fav of all X-men and for this fight he is my Winner.

I'll be the odd man out and go Gambit. Kurt is by no means going to teleslam Gambit on pavement. He is not going to kill his friend. This also means he won't teledismember anything either. Kurt is also not untouchable, considering both the Punisher and even Wendigo have hit him before. One of Kurt's biggest flaws is that he is predictable. Cyclops has predicted Kurt's patterns numerous times. Iron Fist noticed the brimstone smell of his ports and was able to attack when he ported to him. Daredevil has noticed it (but given his sense of smell, of course he can.) Gambit's a skilled fighter in his own right when it comes to his agility, staff fighting skills, and craftiness. His agility and skill were enough to battle Daredevil while leaping across rooftops, and DD's agility is better than even some superhumans. Gambit's also got some of the best reflex feats street levelers have to offer. He's fast enough to deflect bullets on multiple occasions from even machine gunfire. He's caught grenade shells shot at him and thrown back. He was fast and accurate enough to throw charged cards into oncoming web balls from Spider-Man before.

So someone who has reflex feats beyond some of the people who have tagged Kurt and has ran with him enough times to know how he operates and is smart enough to exploit them should be able to counter Kurt's one advantage he has. Cyclops has shown this is possible. While I will admit there is a big difference between Cyclops and Gambit in tactical abilities, Gambit is by no means an idiot and is extremely cunning. Gambit is quick enough and skill enough to respond and react to Kurt. If people who haven't even fought Nightcrawler before can pick this out, no reason Gambit can't. And unlike Kurt, Gambit has ranged attacks and it is perfectly possible Gambit can lure Kurt in. He sees him, throws some cards, Kurt ports to his location, and boom. Gambit lays a charged card with a simple sleight of hand. Given that Kurt also has his shadowmeld ability, Gambit is incredibly stealthy himself. A city setting at night suits him just fine.

why not gambits horseman powers.

i call shenanigans, favoritism, unfair rules etc.

seriously though. if kurt can suddenly be undead then remy should have his horseman powers.

NIGHTCRAWLER!!!

Probably Nightcrawler. It's less that he can win, than that he can avoid losing.

How about instead of putting them up against each other you put them each up against three random mid-level (but super powered) villains (if you can find 3 such villains in the Marvel Universe these days).

Also, this fight is more interesting if the city has a power outage, and it's completely in the dark.

I just..... I just don't see how Gambit could win this.

First of all, let's be clear - if there were no morals, Nightcrawler would kill Gambit immediately. Immediately. 100%. The fact that Nightcrawler is a devout Catholic is the only thing keeping Kurt from teleporting Gambit into a wall, or teleporting away with parts of his body (aka teleporting the head off of the body - I forget where he did this, probably in Uncanny X-Force and as AOA Kurt, but still), or the classic teleport up and drop him from a height.

Second, If Kurt wants to get away, or not be touched, he is getting away or not being touched. The likelihood of Gambit landing a final blow is so small....... there would have to be small children in danger or something to prevent Kurt from just leaving and recuperating. In this regard, the only way Gambit could win is if Kurt finds it necessary to sacrifice himself.

Third, say they do get into a close quarters melee, which is the best option for Gambit overall despite his ranged cards/etc attacks, I think Kurt is just to quick and slippery even without teleporting for Gambit to land enough meaningful blows to win. And then..... just add the teleportation factor... so that's out for Gambit too.

With the environment - dark areas for Kurt to hide in if he needs a moment - no innocent bystanders for Gambit to use to Kurt's disadvantage (not that he necessarily would)..... I honestly think this is a 10/10 for Nightcrawler situation.

Nightcrawler has at least as good hand-to-hand skills as Remy and is certainly more agile. Even in a straight up fist fight I think Kurt would win. If you add in powers Gambit just doesn't stand a chance. Nightcrawler has so many options for the fight--he could just teleport in and out while punching Gambit, he could 'port him into the air and drop him, or he could just grab him and teleport him around until the strain of teleportation knocks him out.

Gambit's powers wouldn't help much. His throwing cards aren't faster than normal thrown objects and Kurt certainly has the reaction time to teleport away from any explosions Remy causes. If the fight even started to turn against him, Nightcrawler could teleport away and stick to a wall in shadow and wait to re-engage Gambit at his own pace. I just can't see a way for Gambit to beat Nightcrawler without some serious luck.

Amen!