Battle of the Week: Batman vs. Iron Fist

@chaos911: His gadgets aren't his only weapon. They aren't even his primary weapon, unlike IF. And even though the statement "He'd win.. BECAUSE HE'S BATMAN!" is completely true and applicable, I have given supporting cannon occurrences backing my theory up. You're saying the equivalent of "nuh uh ur stupid" to which I respond again, give me your evidence of IF being able to best someone with similar abilities and attributes. If not, go crawl back in your troll cave.. or is it under a bridge?

Iron Fist

While both Bruce and Danny have outstanding martial arts skill - I don't see Bruce surviving an encounter with Rand, nor do I see him winning this battle.

Danny's got a bit of a speed advantage from what I've seen of both characters, and his reaction time is insanely great. He's caught sniper rounds, dodged in microseconds, and I believe he even caught 20 - 30 flechette rounds and tossed them back at the person who fired them, though I may be mistaken about that last feat.

Danny's striking power is also far above Bruce's and while Bruce has some durable armor, I don't think it's tough enough to take punches that have the potential to take out an entire helicarrier, or slice through the foot/ankle of an incredibly large demon.

Bruce's gadget's may give him an early lead - but in the end it's Iron Fist who will be celebrating the victory.

@mattknowsbest: how many times do I have to tell you I haven't picked a side yet? Gadgets are his only other weapon in this scenario other than fighting skills and his mind cause unless I missed something in the op they're not going to allow stuff like special suits or vehicles because that is unfair to iron fist. All I'm pointing out is the ridiculousness of him instantly having plan for a stranger and the instances you pointed out are when he is against a character he would logically have a plan for and previously encountered.

@mattknowsbest: u claim u have given accurate replies and supposedly refuted everyone else's statements and that u r very knowledgeable and all that, however you have got a basic thing like the name of the miniseries where Batman shot Darkseid wrong. It did NOT happen in RIP, it happened in Final Crisis, specifically Final Crisis #6.

@cloudzackvincent: I apologize, R.I.P. preceeded Final Crisis- good catch thanks!

Lol...I would, but after reading his comments, I kind of figure I might get a more indepth discussion out of a brick wall. He does not seem interested in doing anything other than sticking his fingers in his ears and screaming Batman=)

@wyldsong: woah woah woah, I'm right here bro. It's funny that's exactly what I feel u guys are saying about Iron F. I'm open to whatever you have to say, but nothing that I said about Batman was untrue.

You are heavily overplaying Batman here, and while you may feel that people are doing the same for Danny, I am fairly well versed on both parties in this one. I can tell you without a shadow of a doubt that Batman has no chance at taking a majority against Danny without some sort of knowledge or prep.

I stated what I stated not to insult you, but reading the debate as presented thus far, I called it like I saw it. If I insulted you, I am man enough to apologize, but Bat's honestly has no chance in a random encounter against Danny.

@wyldsong: Ok. Prove it. Fist's powers aren't unlimited.

QFT

Who said his powers are?

EDIT: In the sense of using it infitinetly, yes it is.

In the sense of the fist can destroy ANYTHING, no. But it can destroy the Bats.

Actually, they have shown no limit. After Danny absorbed the powers of Orson Randall, he no longer tires from the use of the Iron Fist. He could feasibly spam it for as long as he wanted, as they have not shown him tire from its use after the Immortal Iron Fist series. So if there is a limit, it has not been touched upon since his upgrades.

As for the rest, honestly, Danny is winning in the poles, so I really have very little need to prove much of anything. I'll give some basic thoughts...but I am not going into too much depth. Danny has laid out far more durable than Batman, and can push his chi into and through objects. If you have seen the helicarrier scan, you'll see cracks forming with chi spreading throughout, which illustrates this point. Not to mention, we have seen him chi amp projectiles, so basically, armor means very little to chi, as what Danny does is partial physical force, and partial chi based. It's not like taking a hit from someone with superstrength. As well, Danny can cover large areas like a bomb blast with his chi. Danny has also proven proficient at fighting while blind, and invisible foes, and this was before he had the amp in his senses from studying the book of the Iron Fist. Before that amp, he was able to spar the Invisible Woman, and knew she had created an invisible bo staff by sensing the currents in the air around it, so sneaking up on him, not likely.

Coupled with Danny's superhuman stats, his versatility thanks to his chi (he can do a scary amount of things with it, including but not limited to healing himself and others, energy absorption, and so on), his ability to control his nervous system, and so on, he is just a bit beyond a non-prepped Batman. Non-prepped Batman has had issues with Slade, and Danny has stats comparable to if not better than Slade's, and is far more skilled than Slade. The only way Batman can hang like he did with Slade was his skill, and Danny is far more skilled than Slade, so Bruce won't have that advantage here.

@wyldsong: 1. Was not aware of Iron Fist's power up in "Immortal" - never read it- Haven't been a huge marvel fan since 2002ish and "Immortal" began in 2006. Thanks tho, I will check it out.

2. Since it was previously established that his Fist technique had recharge limits, it would logically follow that even though he could down a helicarrier, no where does it show him using it again in the next 5min- chi energy comes from his life force not some external source(i.e. The Flash and the speed force).

3. How about some excerpts?

"the world's most skilled combatant"(Batman Son of The Demon, while instructing the league of assassins)

"Is said to be the most highly skilled fighter in the world, possibly the greatest human fighter the world has ever known, and a master of every combat form there is (Batman Secret Files & Origins #1)

"He's trained to perfection in every combat form there is plus how he can incapacitate a person in 463 different ways without drawing blood" (Batman The Widening Gyre #4)

"Masterfully defends against The Sensei's spine crusher IRON FIST technique from behind by trapping him with his own unique technique that he calls "The Gymnast's Third Hand.'" (Batman Odyssey vol2 #7)

"Deduces the basic type of fighting style a super powered alien being known as Super Titan Gladiator is using against him despite having a massive headache having just come out of a coma (Batman Superman #10)"

So where do you get he would be unprepared for anything Iron Fist could come up with?

@cdiddyman911: No where does it state he can use his powers infinitely, so where do you get this? His concentration and stamina are key when using the technique and he isn't omnipotent.

Which just occurred to me- it is widely accepted that batman has various gas pellets on his belt at all times- smoke bomb + knock out gas, and it's over. Unless you're going to tell me that Iron Fist can use a rare chi-fan/gasmask technique to which I would simply just give up..

Well, yeah he can use his powers infinitely in the sense that he can punch for days, his own stamina will be the only problem.

And he has no rare chi fan or whatever your smoking, but he can, oh I dont know, jump away when he sees gas getting sprayed

I think the Batman is more skilled too but how can he avoid being hit by the chi enhanced attacks. He will most likely be hit by at least one and that is all it should take.

Only way Batman is leaving this one is on a stretcher!!!

@mattknowsbest:

1. Was not aware of Iron Fist's power up in "Immortal" - never read it- Haven't been a huge marvel fan since 2002ish and "Immortal" began in 2006. Thanks tho, I will check it out.

He drained the chi from Orson Randall directly, and studied from the book of the Iron Fist, learning new techniques, abilities, and so on. Immortal is a good read, and highly recommended.

2. Since it was previously established that his Fist technique had recharge limits, it would logically follow that even though he could down a helicarrier, no where does it show him using it again in the next 5min- chi energy comes from his life force not some external source(i.e. The Flash and the speed force).

It was firmly established prior to Immortal that he was weakened after multiple chi use, and that was due to Orson Randall also running around. When Danny drained his Shou Lao chi, that was no longer an issue. He has been established as using the Iron Fist multiple times since then, without tiring or slowing down. The issue has ceased to exist since immortal. So no, there have been no shown, proven, or stated limits since that time.

And no, the chi for the Iron Fist does not come from Danny's personal chi. Danny has two sources of chi, his personal chi which allows for speed and the ability to break steel girders without using the Iron Fist, and then the Shou Lao chi, which is the chi of the immortal dragon:

As shown there, the chi of Shou Lao is brought up quite a bit as being separate from Danny's personal stores.

3. How about some excerpts?

"the world's most skilled combatant"(Batman Son of The Demon, while instructing the league of assassins)

"Is said to be the most highly skilled fighter in the world, possibly the greatest human fighter the world has ever known, and a master of every combat form there is (Batman Secret Files & Origins #1)

"He's trained to perfection in every combat form there is plus how he can incapacitate a person in 463 different ways without drawing blood" (Batman The Widening Gyre #4)

"Masterfully defends against The Sensei's spine crusher IRON FIST technique from behind by trapping him with his own unique technique that he calls "The Gymnast's Third Hand.'" (Batman Odyssey vol2 #7)

"Deduces the basic type of fighting style a super powered alien being known as Super Titan Gladiator is using against him despite having a massive headache having just come out of a coma (Batman Superman #10)"

So where do you get he would be unprepared for anything Iron Fist could come up with?

Because Danny is not like any foe he has faced. He never seen nor heard of the dimension Danny trained in, he has not faced the chi of Shou Lao (and it doesn't even exist in DC), he has no clue about Danny's martial arts styles being of another dimension, and he quite literally has no information to even help him prep against someone like Danny. His usual street level prep doesn't work, as Danny with the power to one shot types that fight evenly with Thor barely qualifies as even upper tier street level. The IRON FIST technique he has seen, is nowhere near the same as what Danny does, and while he may deduce a basic fighting style, what Danny does is anything but basic. This is an extradimensional fighting style, with someone who has mastered his personal chi, then gained the chi of a supernatural being as well. This is someone he has no basic knowledge, no idea on what he can do, and someone that with just his chi, can handle the majority of Batman's gadgets. This is someone who has seen and faced people who know every earthly style and then some (so Batman holds no surprises in hand to hand), and even has styles to face and beat telepaths (Mr. X). Danny is a few levels above Batman here.

@wyldsong: You disregarded most of #3. Yes different universes, but as I stated Batman has faced foes from other planets and dimensions, and has emerged victorious every time. Also, those that have called him the best are those that are regarded as the best on tge planet. Magic and mystical forces DO exist in the DC universe, and the masters that trained Batman are at the very least equal to those of the Marvel universe. Which is to say you are correct in saying Batman has never encountered someone trained in the ways of Shao Lao or whatever, but as the DC vs. Marvel series indicated, the 2 universes are essentially copies of each other. True Batman hasn't faced Marvel's Iron Fist, but he has faced down and beaten plenty of foes(not just street thugs, that's an ignorant statement), some more powerful that your Iron Fist, and beaten them. And how can you only count Batman's gadgets as his primary weapons? The Batman IS a weapon. Period.

@mattknowsbest: Iron Fist is a weapon period, he is the living weapon to be certain, as his whole body is a weapon, and that is the current moniker from the new series. He doesn't rely on gadgets and tech...unlike Batman. And I didn't disregard #3, but those statements don't really do anything to prove Batman over Iron Fist. Batman has not faced the likes of Danny, the likes of Danny does not exist in DC, and Bats has no counter for him.

Iron fist is a master of mystic chi, something bat has not yet fought/seen I think.but Bruce is a deadly martial artist and knows pressure points and maybe all the techniques available and has more experience and as chi is related to martial arts, I am sure Bruce at least knows what it is and its capabilities. This fight is taking place at night, street lights are EMPd by Bruce for total darkness, for sure. Now, as morals are on, BOTH WILL ONLY TRY FOR INCAPACITATION OR KO. Now in the darkness, his opponent is suddenly stunned and Bruce is at an advantage as he has fought his many battles exploiting it.however iron fist has superhuman senses that he will use to adapt to the situation. Now it all comes down to experience and trickery vs raw power and better techniques.bats will throw a set of gas pellets at iron fist,which would explode and make iron fist uneasy. But iron fist may use his chi to overcome effects of the gas,when he's trying to do this,bat throws a set of exploding batarangs at him,and they explode, rendering iron fist weak. Cmon, he's only a human after all.now before he could recover from this, bat uses his knowledge of pressure points and KOes him in a stealth takedown amongst all the confusion created by gas and explosions.

Outcome: batman wins, very tough fight.

@deadcool_xd said:

Rather interesting fight. Both have extreme discipline and are master of marshal arts as well as judo, and so on. Batman has the stronger armor but iron fist has the stronger weapon. The fact that this takes place at night is Batman's advantage and also that it is in the city an area where batman is more adapted to than iron fist. In mental strength they are equal but Batman possesses a much greater intelligence. Now usually I would go and say Batman would lose according to the rules because he would retreat to the bat cave to study Iron Fists weaknesses but the rules state that they are in a city not particularly Gotham so I cannot make that assumption. The way I determine who wins this battle is to compare Iron Fist with a villain very much like him Ra's al Ghul. The immortal who posses amazing marshal arts techniques. Because Batman can beat Ra's I think he can beat Iron Fist.

You're spelling "martial" wrong.

Iron Fist stomps IMHO. He's got microsecond reaction speed, helicarrier busting striking power, and comparable skill.

Danny's chi abilities put him at near Spider-Man level, that in combination with his equal/superior level of skill makes this practically a mismatch.

Danny still stomps